fiveoboy01
Pattern Altitude
I don't know. When I slow to approach speed, and add flaps, the airplane wants to pitch up. I end up with down trim(spinning the wheel forward). Shrug.
Higher Vr speed?
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I don't know. When I slow to approach speed, and add flaps, the airplane wants to pitch up. I end up with down trim(spinning the wheel forward). Shrug.
Yeah, those numbers change with condition, but you still use the best procedure and they fall where they may. That's why it's good to apply the 70/50 rule in adverse conditions you can't accurately precalculate.
I don't trim for final until I have full flaps, T&Gs typically only take a small change in trim for climb.
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GeorgeC
Hadn't heard of the 50/70 rule before, and now I've heard it twice in one day. Thanks.
fiveoboy01
Pattern Altitude
I don't trim for final until I have full flaps, T&Gs typically only take a small change in trim for climb.
It's not a large change but it does make a noticeable difference on how hard I have to pull when I'm on the go. If I think of it too late I'll reach down and flick the wheel a few times while applying backpressure and the effort lessens noticeably.
Keep in mind when I say "effort", it's relative. If the airplane isn't retrimmed, it's not like I need 200 pounds of pull to get it airborne. Just noticeably more than if it was trimmed for takeoff.
In my POH (1976 C177B ), in the normal operating procedures it says under normal takeoff: "(4) Stabilator Control--Lift NOSE WHEEL at 50 KIAS."
Back to definition of rotate. Is lifting nose wheel = rotating?
fiveoboy01
Pattern Altitude
The definition of rotate is the aircraft rotating about the main gear axis, so if you lift the nose at all from the static/at rest position with the mains still on the pavement, then I'd say yes.
Jaybird180
Final Approach
There are some aircraft that like to have weight taken off the nose gear before a "real" rotation. Mooney 201 is one of those. I also flew a C-182N that required it; you get it light on the nosewheel, continue the takeoff run, then pull again to get airborne. The 2nd pull is more of a pressure, than a pull.
Come to think of it, Cirrus SR-22 is somewhat like this also.
Used to own a Mooney and the Jabiru calls for nose up. But I don't do a second 'big pull'. Weight off the nose and let her fly off the ground. Then accelerate to
Vx and start climbing.
Use the speed that "feels" the best.
Ravioli
Ejection Handle Pulled
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"rotate" at the speed indicated in the POH or throw the rest of the performance chart out the window too.
Graueradler
Pattern Altitude
I thought that the post I quited as proposing exactly that.
1RTK1
Pattern Altitude
There is a difference between rotating and yanking it off the runway. If you ever fly a Grumman you'll see
Guess I will have to try that in my tiger and see
Caramon13
Pattern Altitude
I definitely feel like I have to pull my PA28-180 off the runway. The 172's I've flown just ease up and float off the runway, but the PA28-180 definitely takes more effort to get off the ground.
I also climb-out at about 100 mph or more (slightly above Vy) because I actually like seeing OVER the cowling for traffic ahead of me. Climbing out at Vx is all well and good if you have to for obstacle clearance, but for passenger comfort and visibility, slightly faster than Vy works well for me.
Vr is about 60 mph for me with some trim and slight pull.
I also climb-out at about 100 mph or more (slightly above Vy) because I actually like seeing OVER the cowling for traffic ahead of me. Climbing out at Vx is all well and good if you have to for obstacle clearance, but for passenger comfort and visibility, slightly faster than Vy works well for me.
Vr is about 60 mph for me with some trim and slight pull.