Help Me Decide: Garmin 430 or 650?

I really liked the Marconi nav-comms, but the telegraph keys were hard to use in turbulence.

N747JB said:
He seems right more than he's wrong, but he's old enough to have seen it all.:D:D
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Jaybird180 said:
They've already priced themselves out of the market




Looks like Wayne's words may prove true
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I agree on the pricing, I think the intro price was $8900 or so on the 440, and that was for a slide in replacement, so I guess an install kit, antenna etc would be extra.:dunno: If the pricing were close, I'd still go with Garmin, I've had a 430 and or a 530 since 2000 and never had an issue with one.:yes:
Wayne's usually right cause he's old enough to have seen all this stuff before.:rofl:
 
Well I hope Wayne is off the mark here as I decided to put down a deposit on a 440. It looks like an improved design over the 650 to me.
 
FORANE said:
Well I hope Wayne is off the mark here as I decided to put down a deposit on a 440. It looks like an improved design over the 650 to me.
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I look forward to a pirep on your 440! I just can't wait, hell I may trade airplanes again before they get it produced and installed!:D
 
N747JB said:
I look forward to a pirep on your 440! I just can't wait, hell I may trade airplanes again before they get it produced and installed!:D
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Judging by the planes you have owned thread, that may not take too long for some of y'all.
 
Why not just have an ipad and foreflight why does one need these 430 650's ??? Am I missing something?
 
I don't mind being wrong about this stuff, and have in the past rooted for the new guys on the basis that competition is good for everybody. Unfortunately, some of them have proven to be incapable of delivering on their widely hyped and ballyhooed wonder-boxes.

Whether this new entry performs as hoped and provides a wedge into the market remains to be seen, but they have a steep hill to climb. Whether Garmin has a 440-killer sitting on the drawing boards won't be known for a while, but they have reacted strongly to prior threats and I wouldn't bet against them. Time will tell.

FORANE said:
Well I hope Wayne is off the mark here as I decided to put down a deposit on a 440. It looks like an improved design over the 650 to me.
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The panel-mount gives the autopilot something to talk to.

marcoseddi said:
Why not just have an ipad and foreflight why does one need these 430 650's ??? Am I missing something?
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marcoseddi said:
Why not just have an ipad and foreflight why does one need these 430 650's ??? Am I missing something?
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Yes as Wayne said, the panel mount feeds the autopilot. However, some are feeding their autopilot with Anywheremap run from tablet or even old Ipaq HX4700's. I run Anywheremap - currently on Asus TF700 which is tremendous.

Also, I fly IFR and need a panel mount of some sort. I looked to upgrade as I currently have a non-waas 430. I considered the 430w but it suffers from a few deficiencies such as no airways for one. I looked at and almost bought a 650 but after playing with the simulator for a while, I was disappointed with the user interface and menus.

One additional benefit for me is the vector autopilot output of the 440. I have an old Navaid ap1 autopilot and when I get issued vectors I generally have to turn off the autopilot and hand fly. With the 440 I will be able to remain coupled and dial in a vector. Would be nice to upgrade autopilot but for now, this will be an added benefit.
 
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marcoseddi said:
Why not just have an ipad and foreflight why does one need these 430 650's ??? Am I missing something?
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Good question, here are some reasons for having a 530

1. It is also a COM. Have you tried talking to ATC with your iPad?
2. Auto pilot coupling. Specially useful on long flights and LPV approaches.
3. VOR/LOC/GS navigation. Not all the airports have GPS approaches in South America.
4. TCAS display. Not available with an iPad
5. FAA TSO certified and reliable.
6. No need to hold a tablet on my lap watching my nostrils on it.

José
 
Jeanie said:
I have a friend who has an iFly gps unit and uses it for VFR only. I don't know if they make them for IFR but anyway, he says it's really great and that the data subscription is. Uh less than garmin.
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I have an iFly and it does support ifr charts and approaches. The issue however is that regardless of all it's abilities it is technically a hand held device and cannot be used for anything more than a map. In order to fly instrument with a gps it must be a certified gps.

The iFly is great on instrument approaches for situational awareness but you must have a certified primary means of navigation.

This all holds true for the Garmin 396, 496 and even the 696 as well.

Data for sectional's TAC's, WAC's, Low En-route, High En-route, approach plates, airport diagrams, sids, stars, and now a satellite image of the airport is $109 a year.

I love mine, YMMV
 
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Piloto said:
4. TCAS display. Not available with an iPad
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It's a T.I.S. display, and an iPad with a Stratus 2 and ForeFlight will see the same traffic.

TCAS is much more expensive, and has the crucial difference of providing Resolution Advisories to pilots. TCAS also works independently of TIS-B broadcasts in the area (it works anywhere there's another aircraft equipped with Mode C or S transponders). One rarely finds TCAS on light GA planes, and it's definitely not built into the Garmin 430.
 
FORANE said:
Yup, I don't mind it though. I am an Anywheremap user and fly an experimental.
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Understand. It's a weird world these days.

Software rarely if ever works as intended upon first release and if it did, there's no real fiscal incentive for the coders to have done it that way, at anything larger than a three coder shop.
 
Mike I said:
It's a T.I.S. display, and an iPad with a Stratus 2 and ForeFlight will see the same traffic.

TCAS is much more expensive, and has the crucial difference of providing Resolution Advisories to pilots. TCAS also works independently of TIS-B broadcasts in the area (it works anywhere there's another aircraft equipped with Mode C or S transponders). One rarely finds TCAS on light GA planes, and it's definitely not built into the Garmin 430.
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GNS530W and GNS430W are capable of displaying TCAS traffic from an L3 Skywatch, Avidyne 600 or Garmin 800 TCAS in addition to TIS from a GTX 330. One of my Citation 500 buddy has it on his plane with the 530. But no iPad will show traffic with TCAS sensors or outside the US

José
 
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