Help a Newbie: Under Contract for C172F

[machkhatib]

Hello again. The previous airplane I was in discussions over (a Piper Cherokee) fell through but I am now under contract for a C172F.

Engine is mid-time though hasn’t been flown much recently. Apparently the seller bought the plane for flight training as a student pilot but got too busy for aviation and is quitting.

https://www.trade-a-plane.com/searc...2F+SKYHAWK&listing_id=2402218&s-type=aircraft

Price is $41K. At a minimum, I’ll need to get ADSB-out and reupholster some of the seats. I plan on getting a pre-buy inspection, of course.

Help me avoid getting burned - I can still terminate the contract if I am unsatisfied with the condition. Your advice and feedback is greatly appreciated!!

 

[455 Bravo Uniform]

If the airframe is in good condition, the avionics and interior can be improved over time. It’s a cheap way to get into a 172 these days.

Engine may be a gamble, due to some apparent periods of inactivity, maybe less hours per year than ideal, and missing an annual inspection, when it either didn’t fly for a year or flew without annual. Minnesota? If it was hangared, that’s better.

Have the cylinders borescoped for signs of prior corrosion that the rings might have cleaned up over a few hours of recent running. Not sure if you can get a view of a cam lobe in that engine, but that would be good too.

Turn your pre-buy into an annual if no red flags, and determine if the price to fix airworthiness squawks is still a good deal, or adjust the price.

Last thing - the mechanic appears to be the same guy the last 6 years. Same owner too during that time? Not saying the story doesn’t jive, but consider how many years (6) and hours (160) that student took and then gave up; Is the story true? Probably fine, but dig a bit.

 

[masloki]

Not enough info. “Hasn’t flown much recently” is how long and where? Conti 0-300 - not sure where on the reliability/parts availability spectrum they fall.

 

[Kenny Phillips]

We had one for seventeen years. Notably smoother than the later four-bangers. Not fast; FP 100 kts or so, though it did make book top speed after rebuild (135 mph or so.)
I believe engine parts are available, at least cylinders (which may be shared with the 0-200 IIRC).
We had ours overbored because it had been flown not at all for ten years, but was kept by a pilot/A&P/IA who no longer flew, but did an annual every year, and thus started it up. Even hangared, the water in the oil caused corrosion in the oil pan that nearly went through. Then it had a TDI 'cuz I decided to Q-tip the prop. But otherwise no issues (other than age-related) for the time we had it. It's not the one you are buying, ours is at a flight school now.

 

[asicer]

Engine is mid-time though hasn’t been flown much recently.

Pretty much any engine is a gamble, but this one a little more than others. That said, I voted "go for it" on the assumption that you are keeping some of your purchasing budget in reserve just in case it doesn't work out. And also that you're a quick learner when it comes to paying attention to what your engine is trying to tell you because it's unlikely that it will suddenly go "pop" without warning. But said above, some of that is also going to depend on where/when.

I’ll need to get ADSB-out and reupholster some of the seats.

You can easily get by on ADS-B with a uAvionix TailBeacon, but keep some money in reserve for when the transponder finally goes kaput. Seat upholstery falls under Part 43 Appendix A "Preventive Maintenance" so that's something you can tackle yourself if you're handy.

 

[schmookeeg]

We took one of our O-300-Ds from 0 to 4400 hours (1800 TBO) in flight training service. +1 to the remark that the 6 cyl conti is smoother than the O-320/O-360 Skyhawks.

Once it started making metal, I flew it from CA to AR for an exchange at Mena. That's like 20 hours on a metal-chucking engine. Thing purred the whole way there. I have a lot of respect for the motor.

(...I probably wouldn't do that now that I am older and wiser, though )

I really like the F model 172s. You're buying a mid-1960's airplane, so it will have squawks and it's lightly built compared to the restart cessnas -- but they're common and not costly to find parts for, and they fly pretty nice and predictably.

I'd rock it. It's like a 1989 Toyota Corolla. Ain't impressing nobody, you can pimp it out if you realllllly wanted to (and be absurd), or you could just enjoy easy and cheap and low-fashion driving. It's comfy enough and will do everything you'll put to it without much fuss or drama.

 

[L J Donelson]

Let us know.
If you don't I might.

 

[somorris]

We used to have a 172G, and it was a great airplane. This one looks a little ragged, and the radios are old, but it is priced right also.

 

[machkhatib]

What do people think of the Continental O-300 engine? Is it a pain to maintain and find parts for?

And is a C172F good for someone who is a first time buyer or will it be more trouble than it’s worth?

The majority of my 260ish hours is on various C-172 models (most of my hours probably on the M and N models) so I’m most comfortable flying C-172’s - my worry is about ownership turning into a nightmare.

 

[somorris]

The O-300 we had was fine. The only problem we had in three years of ownership was fouling of some of the bottom plugs when idling or taxiing. What I did, and continue to do with our current plane, is lean pretty aggresively for taxi. Buying is kind of a crap shoot. You might buy it and fly several years trouble free, or have some pretty expensive squawks before you get it home. Airplanes like to be flown. Letting it sit is one of the worse things you can do for it.

 

[asicer]

my worry is about ownership turning into a nightmare.

The only nightmare scenarios that immediately come to mind are:

1. The pre-buy was so bad that it was not noticed that this thing is already corroded to death
2. You didn't keep enough money in reserve for that unpleasant surprise
   
3. Something unexpected happened to keep it down for X # of months and you don't have anything else to fly in the meantime

 

[schmookeeg]

You can get partners and suffer only 1/2 or 1/3 or 1/5 of an ownership nightmare which reduces it to a mere ownership kick in the bonch.

Used engines are a thing. Used not-in-production engines seem to be rather inexpensive. You are under no obligation to repair a bad engine, you can wait for sanity in the market, or a deal, or a salvage engine from a plane that wrecked its airframe but had a nice motor. Aviation is a crafty business filled with clever people. "Plane Ownership" is a skill that you develop after overpaying for maladies and then learn there was a better or cheaper way all along. You'll do that for hundreds of things, promise. Some even say it's fun.

You can part out a plane if you lunch an engine and are fed up with the entire business, sell it as a project, make a flight simulator, wet bar, coffee table, lamps, donate the rest to a charity and enjoy a tax writeoff, or any of 100 other things. If the plane presents you with an unwanted bill for $20,000, you are under no obligation to pay it, and it may be an opportunity if you're not having fun.

Renting is a good deal if you just want to fly 172s. The flight school owner has the worst car in the parking lot, promise.

 

[Sinistar]

Isn't there some type of common issue with the 172 Conti's and the oil pan or something?

@455 Bravo Uniform - mentioned Minnesota location?? I though the add indicates Georgia - maybe I am missing something. If was midwest and no hangared then hail could be an issue.

This seems like a plane to plan for about $8K over the first two annuals...especially if you use two different mechanics.

5yrs ago the price would be crazy. Now its cool that it gets you into a plane. I hope it works out. I voted for as well.

 

[idahoflier]

Is this your third potential purchase in one week? My advice would be to slow down, regroup and determine the aircraft that fits your mission and wait until you find that aircraft on the market. The last thing I would do is purchase an older, cheaper "junker" aircraft as that will likely bite you in maintenance costs down the road. Good Luck!