Going to the airport to get information about starting my PPL

TreeTopFlyer83

TreeTopFlyer83

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TreeTopFlyer83
Any information that I should be on the look out for? Is a Cessna 172 a good plane to learn to fly? Is $175/hour wet w/ instructor reasonable? Also I have a great fear of the stall training portion of the lesson. Any information you guys could pass along would be greatly appreciated.

A little about myself. I'm 35 years old, I'll be receiving lessons out of the Monroe Executive Airport in the Charlotte, NC area (EQY). My father just started his sport pilot training and the goal is for us to be able to fly together recreationally. I appreciate any information or comments you can provide.
 
You’ll get over the stalls (and some of us even enjoy them) after u do a couple. 175 sounds a little on the high side for this area but some have it worse.
 
eman1200 said:
You’ll get over the stalls (and some of us even enjoy them) after u do a couple. 175 sounds a little on the high side for this area but some have it worse.
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Thanks for the response. Shows what I know at this stage, right? Lol I thought $175 sounded reasonable. I'm sure if I did enough research I could find it for a little less. The airport being only about 15 minutes from my house is a key factor for me. Also I'll only be able to fly 2/3 times per month. I know that isn't ideal and it'll take longer to obtain the PPL but that's what I'm working with.
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
Any information that I should be on the look out for? Is a Cessna 172 a good plane to learn to fly? Is $175/hour wet w/ instructor reasonable? Also I have a great fear of the stall training portion of the lesson. Any information you guys could pass along would be greatly appreciated.

A little about myself. I'm 35 years old, I'll be receiving lessons out of the Monroe Executive Airport in the Charlotte, NC area (EQY). My father just started his sport pilot training and the goal is for us to be able to fly together recreationally. I appreciate any information or comments you can provide.
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Stalls in a 172 are very benign. Nothing to worry about.
 
kath said:
If the $175 *includes* the instructor, that seems very reasonable to me.
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That does include the instructor. The plane is $125/hour wet and the instructor is $50/hour. I didn't think it was terrible.
 
Magnus P.IFR said:
Find a club to join...?
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My dad lives in Columbia, SC and I live in Charlotte, NC so the conflict would be to find a club that works for both of us. Not saying impossible but may be better for us to find an old, used plane that's in decent shape.
 
Just don’t pay a lump sum ahead of time.

Train as much as you can; To get 2-3 lessons a month, you may need to schedule more than 2-3 a month due to weather cancellations.

If cost is an issue, remember that post-solo, you’re not paying for the instructor some of the time.

That rate sounds OK to me.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Just don’t pay a lump sum ahead of time.

Train as much as you can; To get 2-3 lessons a month, you may need to schedule more than 2-3 a month due to weather cancellations.

If cost is an issue, remember that post-solo, you’re not paying for the instructor some of the time.
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Great point. This place that I'm going to visit this Saturday is pretty straight forward it seems. They have several CFI's to choose from. They are a pay as you go type place. They do not ask for any money upfront.
 
That’s a decent price.

Stalls are no big deal. People make much more of them than necessary.

Which school?
 
$175/hr, wet with an instructor is what I paid 2 years ago, so that sounds pretty reasonable. I'm in NY.

172 is a great plane to start training with, and don't worry about the stalls. I hated them at first, but not a big deal.
 
It bugs the heck out of me when a potential student is fed scare stories about stall recognition and recovery. A good instructor will approach stalls slowly, with emphasis on recognition. Slow flight is a good place to start. Then, when the student is confident of his/her ability to understand what makes a lifting surface stop lifting, it it is time to teach recoveries.

An instructor who jumps right into departure stalls and approach stalls (and accelerated stalls) per the test standards is setting his/her student up for a lot of unneccesary angst.

Bob Gardner
 
sorry, $50 for PRIMARY training, around here, is expensive. there are plenty of places 'round here charging $50 for advanced training and less for primary. not saying it's all that far off, but still on the high side. anyways, don't worry too much about it, it's fair.
 
Re: stalls - remember there's a better than fair chance your instructor wants to go home at the end of the day - s/he is not going to let you do anything too hazardous.

Re: Cost - I'm in a very reasonable club between Chicago and Milwaukee and our instructor rate is $50, our early '80s 172Ps are $95 and our 172SPs are $115. Depending on age and condition, $125 wet feels a little high, but not outrageous.

I learned in Warrior IIs, then transitioned to the Cessna club. Pros and cons each way, but 172 suits me well. After 11 years away, it felt like putting on a comfy old coat.

Good luck and have fun!
 
@TreeTopFlyer83 ... how are ya set on the medication certification front?


Below is one of my copy/paste items about the FAA application for your first medical certificate.


To gain confidence, and more importantly, knowledge, of what is involved with obtaining your first medical certificate, start by reviewing the instruction manual for MedXpress, the FAA's online form for applying for a medical. You can find that here: https://medxpress.faa.gov/medxpress/Content/Docs/MedXPressUsersGuide.pdf

Scroll down to page 24 of 36. This is where they ask about any medications you are currently taking (Question 17). If there are none, move to the next section.

But if there are some, you will be asked to list the names, dosage, and frequency. Most medications are permitted. Some are not and will be a show stopper. Others may be an indicator of a medical item that the FAA will want to know more about.

In many cases, the FAA will need a letter from your treating doctor that mention the medications, why they were prescribed, and how well they are helping you.

During the examination, the Aviation Medical Examiner will ask questions about the medications and the doctors letter, fill in some blanks, and make notations on his side of the application form.

Now scroll down to page 26 of 36. This is the medical history section (Question 18). An important phrase here is "Have you ever in your life..." Review these items and see if any should be answered yes. If one or more is answered yes, then definitely do not go to an AME to obtain a medical certificate until you thoroughly know what the FAA is going to want to know about the item you checked as yes.

Some of these are minor and the documentation required is also minor. Others are big, BIG things, and while they might not be show stoppers, you will have to obtain more things that are the right things and in the right format and order in order to satisfy the FAA.

Again, do not go to an AME for a live exam until you know what information and documentation the FAA wants for the item(s) you marked "yes"​

How do you find out what the FAA wants? The best way is to have a consultation visit with an AME. This visit does not get reported to the FAA. All it is is a information gather visit with the medical examiner to find out what you need to obtain. If you are unable to find an AME in your area to do this, then reach out to Dr. Bruce Chien in Bolingbrook, IL, www.aeromedicaldoc.com Dr. Bruce is a member here and can answer your questions online. But direct emails are often more efficient and allow him to discuss things in a way he cannot on a public form.


Another important area of Question 18 is Question 18v. Alcohol and drug related motor vehicle actions. Question 18v asks about a history of “arrests or convictions involving driving while intoxicated by, while impaired by, or while under the influence of alcohol or a drug.” This would include arrests or convictions for offenses that were reduced to a lower offense, such as careless driving. This also includes offenses that were expunged by the courts after a certain time period. Pilots who have been ticketed for operating under the influence while driving a golf cart or a boat have also been required to report these offenses. Remember, your signature on the Form authorizes the FAA to search the National Drivers Register.

Do not try to lie or fib or skirt the issue here.... if you are found out... it is major bad voodoo.

If you do have an alcohol offense in your past, it is not a showstopper. But there will be some added steps to demonstrate to the FAA that you are worthy of the certificate in spite of alcohol being a part of your past life.

Moving on, look at page 28 of 36 and Question 19, which asks questions about medical professionals. If all of your past doctor visits have been routine things with no major medical issues. Then the FAA will say all is good, thanks for telling us about the visits. But if there were visits for particular medical things, then additional explanations about the reason for the visit, and the doctor's findings will be needed.
_______________________________________

I hope this helps. Do continue to ask questions as you think of them.
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
Any information that I should be on the look out for? Is a Cessna 172 a good plane to learn to fly? Is $175/hour wet w/ instructor reasonable? Also I have a great fear of the stall training portion of the lesson. Any information you guys could pass along would be greatly appreciated.

A little about myself. I'm 35 years old, I'll be receiving lessons out of the Monroe Executive Airport in the Charlotte, NC area (EQY). My father just started his sport pilot training and the goal is for us to be able to fly together recreationally. I appreciate any information or comments you can provide.
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Like said, stalls aren't that big of deal. Why just 2-3 times a month. If it's money you may think about filling the piggy bank for a month or so and delaying getting started flying. More frequent flying at first will probably help a lot. You have some new muscle memories to learn and it helps if you don't put to much time between flights in the beginning. You have some knowledge to learn and a test to take so you could get crackin on that while your building up a stash to get more frequent flying. Just an idea, maybe the weather out there makes it a bad one.
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
That does include the instructor. The plane is $125/hour wet and the instructor is $50/hour. I didn't think it was terrible.
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The way you worded it makes it sounds like the instructor is only getting paid for Hobbs time. If that's true then be careful that he/she does not skimp out on the pre- and post- briefing.
 
Great price. I paid more than that learning in a 152 /w instructor. Don't worry about the stalls. The worst that can happen is you stall and then spiral into the ground. Just kidding.... I too had issues with stalls. Just practice a lot of them with your instructor before doing them solo. I speak from experience....:eek:
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
That does include the instructor. The plane is $125/hour wet and the instructor is $50/hour. I didn't think it was terrible.
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I paid $135 for plane in Indiana and $35 for instructor, so those prices look normal/good to me. Like others have said, don't worry about the stalls.
 
"... before doing them solo."

I see no value in a student practicing stalls while solo. Theoretically, stalls are supposed to sneak up and bite you on the butt, and who is netter at being sneaky than an instructor?

Bob
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
Also I have a great fear of the stall training portion of the lesson. Any information you guys could pass along would be greatly appreciated.
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Stalls can be scary until you actually do them. Yes, they are potentially dangerous but when you practice them at a safe altitude and with an instructor, they are becoming a valuable learning experience. And in the 172 stalls are gentle, and very easy to recover. Really, the moment you let go of the controls, the airplane recovers. But the objective of the exercise is for you to learn the recovery procedure because not all airplanes are as ... helpful as the 172.

My fear of stalls had to do with those while turning. I got the straight-out, power-on or off stalls just fine, but I couldn't bring myself to do a turning stall correctly no matter how many times my instructor showed me how. It's not that I wasn't getting the steps. It was plain, pure, unadulterated fear. Banking the airplane, while stalling it, terrified me. I got it finally, and in retrospect, there was no reason to fear it, but I understand how you feel about stalls.
 
LOL I won't be telling anyone what I paid for my PPL training. I paid a bit of a premium, but I knew that going in, and the 172 I flew was in fantastic shape and I had a great instructor. At the time of getting my PPL I was anal about flying in something that wasn't beat to hell (even though cosmetics isn't always an indicator of how safe the airplane is).
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
That does include the instructor. The plane is $125/hour wet and the instructor is $50/hour.
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You guys have no idea how good you have it over there (wherever that is you are).
SoCal C-172s are $167/h. CFIs are $90-120/h. Landing at SMO is $12.95/landing (or touch and go).
I should have moved to another state for my training...:rolleyes:

Stalls for me were scary at first. But after doing dozens of stalls with my CFI (and after doing some acro training), I actually got to like them. Don't worry about them, it's a process you will go through - scared first, not so scared, then having a blast doing them. 172s are such gentle airplanes :)

OP, ask the CFI what ground school curriculum they recommend.
Go get your medical taken care of.
Train as often as you can.
When weather is crap, still go to the airport (it's only 15 mins), ask for the keys, sit in the plane and get to know her very well, familiarize yourself with all the nuts and bolts and gadgets and buttons and screws and gauges :D
Use your smartphone to listen to LiveATC and pretend you are flying. It will help a TON!
 
Hippike said:
You guys have no idea how good you have it over there (wherever that is you are).
SoCal C-172s are $167/h. CFIs are $90-120/h. Landing at SMO is $12.95/landing (or touch and go).
I should have moved to another state for my training...:rolleyes:
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This is like when I complain about auto gas prices and my friend in Ireland scoffs so hard it hurts. :D

Great advice on 'chair' flying the plane on IMC days. I did that both during initial training and also recently knocking the rust off. It helps for sure.
 
Stalls, practiced at altitude, and certainly when introduced under the supervision of an instructor, are neither dangerous nor a rational reason for fear. Stalls are a good way of exploring the flight envelope, and understanding the limits of slow flight. The best way to combat fear of them is to confront them and practice recovery until you have confidence in and understanding of this flight regime.

Modern planes wanna fly. If you don't stubbornly hold them in a stall, they recover easily. You want to learn to recognize the incipient signs of a stall so you don't do this a too low an altitude to recover. And you want to learn the proper control inputs for rapid recovery. Power-off stalls are a big nothing-burger. Power-on stalls will get your attention, but are really more of the same, except with more exaggerated flight attitudes.

Unjustified and irrational fear of stalls is what causes some pilots to take normal landing approach speeds and add 5 kt for the crosswind, 5 kt for the wife and kids, 5 kt for turbulence, and 5 kt for good luck. I've flown with such pilots, and they are the ones that are going to have a runway overrun accident someday. (These are also the same pilots that think they will die if they slip a plane on final, because...um...all cross controlled flight must always end badly.)

Understand and learn to fly the wing, and you will have lots of tools in your flying toolbox, and won't be afraid of flying the plane by the POH on takeoff and landing.
 
Nice thing about the 172 is you gotta work to stall it. So you know what you’re doing when you do it, it’s not going to sneak up on ya. CFI’s don’t just stall plane and ask now what without a whole lotta talk about what your doing, how it will feel, what to look for! After a few you’ll be ****ed you were worried about it! Congrats. Sounds like you are going to have some fun!
 
Too bad most no longer do any spin training, stall will seem benign after that. I loved spins!
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
That does include the instructor. The plane is $125/hour wet and the instructor is $50/hour. I didn't think it was terrible.
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That sounds like that might be the http://www.flycarolina.com/ flight club that you talked to at EQY. You don't have to join to get your private, just pay $50 a month dues. They have two 172s, one is $125 an hour and the other $133 an hour. That's not bad at all.

http://www.flycarolina.com/flying_club
http://www.flycarolina.com/flight_school
 
Stalls are a big nothing burger in a 172. You should know how to properly do them and properly recover but honestly in a 172 if you just let go of everything it will usually recover on its own. The 172 is super stable.

$175 an hour is about the norm. Here it is $125 for the plane and $60 for the instructor.
 
Good luck on your training,the 175 is a good price.
 
Here it is $129 for the 172SP or $139 for one with Glass cockpit. Plus $40 per hr for instructor.

Club does $105/hr for an older VFR 172 plus $40-50 depending on instuctor.

If you and your dad make it to 20 hrs and pass medicals, i would say buy a plane to finish training. Find someone with a Citabria to teach extras like spins and upset recovery.
 
TreeTopFlyer83 said:
Any information that I should be on the look out for? Is a Cessna 172 a good plane to learn to fly? Is $175/hour wet w/ instructor reasonable? Also I have a great fear of the stall training portion of the lesson. Any information you guys could pass along would be greatly appreciated.

A little about myself. I'm 35 years old, I'll be receiving lessons out of the Monroe Executive Airport in the Charlotte, NC area (EQY). My father just started his sport pilot training and the goal is for us to be able to fly together recreationally. I appreciate any information or comments you can provide.
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$175 an hour wet with instructor is a very good rate. My school gets $127 an hour wet plus a fuel surcharge for a 172 and the instructor is $52 an hour. So that's pretty good.

Look at how many planes they have and the availability of your instructor. Flying often, especially in the first few hours, helps as you do get rusty.

I hate roller coasters and while I didn't like stalls at first (tunnel vision, racing pulse, sweaty palms) I got used to them. They're still low on my list of maneuvers that I like to practice but they become more tolerable. Exposure helps, and it is easier (I think) when you are flying them. It somehow helps you connect to the maneuver.
 
Go get your medical before you get too deep into your training. Hopefully you have never had a DUI, ADHD, etc. as those things can really put up roadblocks.
 
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