So does this mean i have to do all of these 3 tests before i ever acutally get to fly? And after those 3 start i could then start working on whatever hours I need for the practical part, being around 60-70 hours?
German student seeking help on how to do a license in the us
- Thread starter Jonas1994
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So does this mean i have to do all of these 3 tests before i ever acutally get to fly? And after those 3 start i could then start working on whatever hours I need for the practical part, being around 60-70 hours?
No. You have to have the solo written test done before you can fly solo. This usually happens after around 10-20 hours of flying experience (10 is the minimum allowed). You need to have the official written test done before you are eligible to do the final test (known as the checkride). The checkride itself also contains a theory component (oral, not written).
These are the only constraints. You can do as much flying as you like before you solo, but you can't solo until you have done the pre solo written test (there are other requirements before you can solo too, this is just to address your questions about how theory and practical training are mixed). Similarly, you can do as much flying as you want before the official written test, but you won't be allowed to the checkride until you have done that written test. You could also do the written test before anything else if you want.
You need both of those before you can fly solo. But there are no training requirements to get them.
Think about it like this: to get the license, there are just 2 main requirements - pass the official written test, and pass the checkride.
For passing the written test, there are no special entry requirements as far as I know. You just have to have the knowledge. Some people pass the written before they start any flying at all!
So, on to the other major requirement - the checkride. To do that, first you have to have a minimum of 40 hours, which must include at least 10 hours of solo flight. There are other requirements on what the 40 hours must contain, such as a certain amount of night time flying etc., but you don't need to know about that in advance.
Before you can do those 10 hours of solo, you'll need to:
* get a medical
* get a student pilot certificate
* get enough training to convince your instructor that you're safe to fly solo
* pass a pre-solo written exam administered by your flight school
I hope that breaks it down a bit more clearly.
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Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
You will get to fly the first day you show up and the hours will count. After a while, your instructor will talk less and less, getting you more comfortable with making your own decisions. This is all to get you ready for solo flight.
Before solo you will take a pre-solo written test. It's going to ask basic questions, and most of the time the correct answer will be "fly the airplane". Some of the questions might be specific to your particular airplane and airport. This test will be done a few days or so before you solo, so when your CFI gives it to you, that's a pretty good sign. Because you will be the only pilot on board, you will need to have your medical completed, too.
The official written test must be complete before your checkride. The test results are valid for some amount of time (1 yr? 2 yr?), so you can take it at your convenience. You'll have to go to a testing center and pay a fee.
The checkride is your final exam. It will have 2 parts - the first part will be with the examiner in a conference room where he will ask you a lot of questions. This could last an hour or more. After that is finished, the examimer will say "Let's go fly" and you'll both get in the plane and finish the flying part of the exam. At the end of that flight, the examiner will say, "Take us back, I have some paperwork to finish." He'll hand you your temporary license and you are no longer a student.
1. get a medical
2. get a student pilot certificate
3. get enough training to convince my instructor that I´m safe to fly solo
4. pass a pre-solo written exam administered by my flight school
5. Do the official written test (somewhere in between 5. and 6.)
6. Fly solo for 10 hours, get the rest of the flying hours up to a minimum of 40 (which most of the time is rather around 60-70)
7. checkride oral
8. checkride practical
I hope this time i got it right
If so, when do i need to apply for the TSA-thing? Or is the TSA’s Alien Flight Student Program (AFSP) the actual TSA itself?
2. get a student pilot certificate
3. get enough training to convince my instructor that I´m safe to fly solo
4. pass a pre-solo written exam administered by my flight school
5. Do the official written test (somewhere in between 5. and 6.)
6. Fly solo for 10 hours, get the rest of the flying hours up to a minimum of 40 (which most of the time is rather around 60-70)
7. checkride oral
8. checkride practical
I hope this time i got it right
If so, when do i need to apply for the TSA-thing? Or is the TSA’s Alien Flight Student Program (AFSP) the actual TSA itself?
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
I don't know if anyone has already posted this:
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/faq/
And the medical form will be an online application. DON'T do this yet!:
https://medxpress.faa.gov/medxpress/
But here is a paper copy of what it used to look like. You will fill in items 1-20. The medical examiner will do the rest. Item 18 is where people usually make mistakes that cost them. Read each one carefully and answer honestly, this will give you an idea of any surprises.
https://www.aviationmedicine.com/wp...PPLICATION-FOR-AIRMAN-MEDICAL-CERTIFICATE.pdf
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/
https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/faq/
And the medical form will be an online application. DON'T do this yet!:
https://medxpress.faa.gov/medxpress/
But here is a paper copy of what it used to look like. You will fill in items 1-20. The medical examiner will do the rest. Item 18 is where people usually make mistakes that cost them. Read each one carefully and answer honestly, this will give you an idea of any surprises.
https://www.aviationmedicine.com/wp...PPLICATION-FOR-AIRMAN-MEDICAL-CERTIFICATE.pdf
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
1. get a medical
2. get a student pilot certificate
3. get enough training to convince my instructor that I´m safe to fly solo
4. pass a pre-solo written exam administered by my flight school
5. Do the official written test (somewhere in between 5. and 6.)
6. Fly solo for 10 hours, get the rest of the flying hours up to a minimum of 40 (which most of the time is rather around 60-70)
7. checkride oral
8. checkride practical
I hope this time i got it right
If so, when do i need to apply for the TSA-thing? Or is the TSA’s Alien Flight Student Program (AFSP) the actual TSA itself?
#9: Buy a big watch, hang around in bars, and tell the girls you are a pilot.
Hippike
Pre-takeoff checklist
Yes you did, except the TSA thing needs to come first.I hope this time i got it right
I was present when a Canadian lady walked into our flight school wanting to start training, and she was told to take care of the TSA first, then come back. Without the TSA, the school said, they are not allowed to give her any kind of training.
I started doing the Gleim online school before any kind of flying, but around level 2 or 3, there were so much stuff that did not make sense, that's when I started flying. You can start with the online ground school (the school that will prepare you for the written test) but when it comes to instruments/systems, you actually need the aircraft to make sense of it all.
And the visa needs to come before that.
Also, note that flight schools can give discover flights and ground school without TSA approval. But since it takes months to get approval there might not be not much point in doing a discover flight first.
Omfg you made me laugh so hard hahahahhaha
Also do you guys know how long it takes to apply for TSA and the medical thing? Do i need the visa first? I´m assuming the medical checkup needs to be done by an airplane doc, correct? - So it would have to be in states? Thanks guys!
Clark1961
Touchdown! Greaser!
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There appear to be 45 doctors in Germany who can do the exam.
http://ame.cami.jccbi.gov/amelist.asp?search=country&country=GERMANY
http://ame.cami.jccbi.gov/amelist.asp?search=country&country=GERMANY
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Thanks for that!
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
The way it will work:
Go onto the FAA website and start your MedXpress form. You sign on with an email address as an account. Fill out that form and then print it. It may have an activation number at the bottom of the form (if you print the form before you "submit" it, you shouldn't have that code number. If you print that form after you "submit" it, then you will have that number.)
If you go the the AME (the FAA doctor - "Airman Medical Examiner"), he will use that code to activate your exam. Once that exam is activated, you must complete the exam - even if it means you will fail. If you give the AME your form and tear off that number, he can't activate it. You can ask for a review of that form to make sure there is nothing that will cause you to fail, and THEN you can give him the number.
When you call to make an appointment, ask if the AME is willing to do a review FIRST, before the official exam gets activated. If a problem is found that you need to fix first, you can always start a new form with a different email. The old form, as long as the AME didn't activate it with that code, will be deleted automatically after 60(?) days. This is all optional.
Also, in the US, the AME fees are not normally covered by any insurance so you have to pay directly.
Something I noticed - in some parts of Europe eye exams use different criteria than a typical American exam. You'll need to pass the US vision test - 20/40 or better in each eye for class III - which might be slightly different from the way your German vision exams are measured. As long as you are not color blind and have "good" vision, you will probably be OK. This is another thing that you can ask the AME about - he can give you a quick eye test to make sure you will be OK when the official exam begins.
Hippike
Pre-takeoff checklist
Do what Matthew wrote!
If you are a young and healthy person, no need to worry about the medical test. I have an AME a block from my office. Made the appointment, printed the paper and during my lunch break I walked over to his clinic. They took a urine sample. I asked why, he said don't worry, we are not checking for drugs we are checking to see if you have diabetes (which I don't).
The AME is a pilot so we started talking about planes and nearby airports. He took my blood pressure, listened to my heart beat, looked into my ears/throat; asked a bunch of health related questions, then had me stand couple of feet from the vision test poster, asked me to read the letters and that was it. I have prescription glasses that I only use for night time driving, I brought my glasses, he had me read the letters with the glasses on/off, he said I don't need to wear my glasses for flying (it would interfere with reading the instruments anyway). I passed.
Since I did the exam before I turned 40, this medical (III class) is good for 5 years. If you do it after you turn 40, it will be good for 2 years only.
The whole thing took about 30 minutes (including walk time) and cost $125 (back in 2016).
If you are a young and healthy person, no need to worry about the medical test. I have an AME a block from my office. Made the appointment, printed the paper and during my lunch break I walked over to his clinic. They took a urine sample. I asked why, he said don't worry, we are not checking for drugs
we are checking to see if you have diabetes (which I don't).The AME is a pilot so we started talking about planes and nearby airports. He took my blood pressure, listened to my heart beat, looked into my ears/throat; asked a bunch of health related questions, then had me stand couple of feet from the vision test poster, asked me to read the letters and that was it. I have prescription glasses that I only use for night time driving, I brought my glasses, he had me read the letters with the glasses on/off, he said I don't need to wear my glasses for flying (it would interfere with reading the instruments anyway). I passed.
Since I did the exam before I turned 40, this medical (III class) is good for 5 years. If you do it after you turn 40, it will be good for 2 years only.
The whole thing took about 30 minutes (including walk time) and cost $125 (back in 2016).
WannFly
Final Approach
TSA takes about 3 weeks the first time, but it’s their timeline, so don’t quote me on this one. The flight school have to accept u as a student first before u can apply. This friend of yours who will teach u in his own plane, check with him first if he is aware of this or not. If he is not listed as an approved school(or whatever the term is that TSA uses) it’s not gonna happen. Some CFI who don’t know the process thinks it’s a piece of cake, it’s not, trust me, they think they can just make a call to DHS and get approved, that’s not the case.
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Okay guys, so far it all looks like I won´t be able to do the license with my friend as a CFI. Also, I think I won´t be able to do the license in California in general--> too expensive.
The other day I met some german guy working together with a flight school in Florida. The link is: https://www.fliegen-usa.de
He said costs would be 8000€ including living and the license itself. He said thats the price if I´d need around 60-65 flying hours.
What do you guys think about that offer? I´m kinda indecisive right now.
Thanks for your help!
The other day I met some german guy working together with a flight school in Florida. The link is: https://www.fliegen-usa.de
He said costs would be 8000€ including living and the license itself. He said thats the price if I´d need around 60-65 flying hours.
What do you guys think about that offer? I´m kinda indecisive right now.
Thanks for your help!
The key question is what you intend to do with the US certificate once you have it ? Are you planning to return to the US every couple of months to go flying or are you looking to use it to fly in Germany. In the 'good old days' there were plenty of US registered planes in germany and if you knew the owners there were opportunities to rent. The EU has limited the use of non-EU licenses by EU residents so I am not sure how much of that is still around. So before you invest that kind of money, get a clear understanding of what you can do with the license.
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
I just looked at the Euro:dollar rates. 8000 Euro = $9800. For 60-65 hrs, plus instruction, plus lodging (might not include food).
Weilke already mentioned it, be very careful about pre-payments. More than one student has pre-payed, then found out the school either went out of business and kept their money, or the student had to change plans for different reasons and couldn't get his money back. You might be able to prepay for certain blocks of time so you don't tie up all your money at once.
I don't know anything about Florida Aviation Career Training, Inc.
http://www.florida-aviation.com/
http://www.florida-aviation.com/flight-training/private-pilot-certification-course-part-141/
Their website estimates $7444 for Private in their 141 program...if you don't take too long.
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Have you had bad experiences so far?
So, the idea is to occasionally fly in the states during holdiays and visits (max 1-2 times a year) and then fly the absolute minimum in Germany to not lose the license. (Maybe I´ll fly more once i earn my own money and well, more, obviously
)Also i really enjoyed it when my friend in the states flew me around to show me the area. Exactly this is my plan too, have a license, show people or friends the area from above, and by that also get some of the money back to pay the rent for the plane and to get my hours. I need to find out if it´s really that simple to rent a plane with the us-transferred license. Or to transfer the license at all...
That would quite obviously be a No-Go, if i couldn´t use it in Germany.
Not personally, but there is a long line of Florida flight schools catering to overseas customers who failed to deliver what they promised. Some of the schools went out of business, others started playing games once the student arrived. Putting a $1000 payment on account for the next couple of scheduled lessons can be a reasonable risk. Putting $25,000 down for a 'commercial pilot course' is insane.
So, the idea is to occasionally fly in the states during holdiays and visits (max 1-2 times a year) and then fly the absolute minimum in Germany to not lose the license. (Maybe I´ll fly more once i earn my own money and well, more, obviously
The FAA has no minimum hour requirement to maintain your license. You just need to do a flight review with an instructor every other year.
Have you looked into what it takes to convert your FAA certificate into a local German license ?
Thanks for your help! Well, i know a german guy, who works together with a flight school in Florida, and i´ve read a pretty decent review from a german student mentioning the german guy who works with the school, so i hope i can trust them. I will definitely not put a lot of money in there as long as i don´t know for what it´ll be in the end.
I do know it takes 100 hours to transfer it to an european license. What else is needed I don´t know yet, i guess nothing?!
To keep the license in Germany its different. You´ll need at least 6 flight hours per year,or a total of 12 hours per 2 years, meaning i could do 1 year break and then fly 12 hours in the following year. Otherwise you lose the license, not sure if you´d have to completely do it again then or just do some studying to get it back.
Just to be clear, i have no opinion good or bad on this particular flight school. My comments apply to all flight schools that cater to overseas customers.
You always want to be careful with testimony of 'a guy who knows a guy'. That kind of testimony can be the sign of something known as the ''affinity scam'.
My guess would be at a minimum a written test on local aviation law. Back in the days you also needed a radio telephone operators certificate (Funksprechzeugnis) from the postal service (which back then controlled the radio spectrum). Not sure what's needed now. Contact your local authorities (depending on your 'Land' this may be the 'Regierungspraesidium' or whoever is now in charge of issuing private pilots licenses) on what exactly is required.
In the old days you lost it alltogether. Around 2002 germany went to a system similar to the FAA where you can reinstate flying privileges through a flight review with a instructor.
Nice! Funny you are american and know more than me
Not sure how I could make sure the school is not a scam.. any ideas?
Also i´m concerned about the costs. He said 8k, but what if its really like 10k?
cant just stop doing the license then...
Good thing that you can´t completely lose it anymore.
Not sure how I could make sure the school is not a scam.. any ideas?
Also i´m concerned about the costs. He said 8k, but what if its really like 10k?
cant just stop doing the license then...
Good thing that you can´t completely lose it anymore.
DesertNomad
Pattern Altitude
I rented a 172 at about $140/hr, my CFI charged $45/hr and with my headset, books, exams etc it cost me about $12K in 2012.
Never pay a school everything upfront. Pay by the hour as you go.
Never pay a school everything upfront. Pay by the hour as you go.
Was that in Cali?
Also did that include living ?
Jonas:
Inasmuch as your original plan has fallen through, you might give a call to these guys:
www.monarchair.com
They have been in business for a long time, and I can personally vouch for their quality, as both a flight school and as a shop.
They cater to a great many students from other countries, and the place is owned by airline pilots who conduct business professionally.
Weather here is good most of the time, and the cost of living is not ridiculous.
Inasmuch as your original plan has fallen through, you might give a call to these guys:
www.monarchair.com
They have been in business for a long time, and I can personally vouch for their quality, as both a flight school and as a shop.
They cater to a great many students from other countries, and the place is owned by airline pilots who conduct business professionally.
Weather here is good most of the time, and the cost of living is not ridiculous.
Do you by any chance know their prices to do a license in about 5 weeks? (or 4 if possible?) In Florida, the offer is 8k in euros for 4-5weeks including living.
Thanks so much!
DesertNomad
Pattern Altitude
Reno, Nevada. We are only 10 miles from California, but the economies are much different (and even more so in 2012). Things are generally much cheaper here, but we only have two schools and I am aware of only one foreign student... who may be a US resident - not sure.
Reno is generally a more difficult place to learn - lots of mountains, high winds, and a field elevation of 4415'. Great to learn here, but plan on an extra 5-10 hours. Part of this is because your cross country flights will generally be longer than if you do it in more urban areas. Airports are simply further apart here.
You can check with these guys:
https://www.greatbasinaviation.com
WannFly
Final Approach
Have you had bad experiences so far?
So, the idea is to occasionally fly in the states during holdiays and visits (max 1-2 times a year) and then fly the absolute minimum in Germany to not lose the license. (Maybe I´ll fly more once i earn my own money and well, more, obviously
Also i really enjoyed it when my friend in the states flew me around to show me the area. Exactly this is my plan too, have a license, show people or friends the area from above, and by that also get some of the money back to pay the rent for the plane and to get my hours. I need to find out if it´s really that simple to rent a plane with the us-transferred license. Or to transfer the license at all...
That would quite obviously be a No-Go, if i couldn´t use it in Germany.
OP, plan on staying proficient (not just current). This skill degrades fast, especially for a low level pilot (speaking from experience). dont think you are the master once you get the license.. its the other way around. after getting your license if your plan is to fly bare minimum, you will soon find out that you are falling behind
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
Thats true, its the same with driving or even more the case while flying
Thanks for that!