G5 and early Cirrus?

arnoha

arnoha

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arnoha
I noticed that the Garmin G5 doesn't have any Cirrus on its current AML. Which does not appear to have been updated since 2017!

I was looking wistfully into what plane to go into next as my family grows. I will need a real four seater and could probably use six. The early six-pack Cirrus are relatively inexpensive and carry enough load, so I wondered if they could also be upgraded cheaply and make a good choice. I guess there just aren't enough of them for Garmin to certify the G5 to them? Is there another path to installing them? This would really define how interesting these models would be to me.
 
Whoops, meant to put this in Avionics, not MX. Oh well. It's here.
 
Cirrus being a new design generally have updated avionics so the need for a G5 is probably low.


Tom
 
Evolution E5 asserting some sort of territorial aggression, perhaps?
 
I’d suspect the margin isn’t there.
 
G5 is prohibited or being installed in FIKI aircraft, I know all Cirrus aren't but that still eliminates a bunch of them.
 
bnt83 said:
I am stumped by the limitation as well. Me thinks it is a marketing limitation written into the STC via smoke & mirrors.
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I'd think a marketing limitation would be "no touch the fiki stuff" -- but excluding the more expensive airplanes means alienating the market that tends to have more income available for extras like G5s!

I wonder if it's a liability thing since the G5 can't interface ice detection systems, maybe? As if a round-dial could in the first place, either.
 
mkosmo said:
I'd think a marketing limitation would be "no touch the fiki stuff" -- but excluding the more expensive airplanes means alienating the market that tends to have more income available for extras like G5s!
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And forcing them to buy more expensive they offer.
 
mkosmo said:
Any idea as to why FIKI specifically?
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I don't know if this is still valid, but it was my understanding Garmin elected not to complete all the requirements (FIKI) under the TSO used for the design/production approval of the G5. As a comparison even antenna TSOs have certain FIKI requirements that not all OEMs complete.
 
Bell206 said:
I don't know if this is still valid, but it was my understanding Garmin elected not to complete all the requirements (FIKI) under the TSO used for the design/production approval of the G5. As a comparison even antenna TSOs have certain FIKI requirements that not all OEMs complete.
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Sure, but the G5 is entirely internally contained. It has no standalone antennas. So long as the installation uses a navigator that plays nice with FIKI, how would a G5 change the compliance story?
 
Bell206 said:
I don't know if this is still valid, but it was my understanding Garmin elected not to complete all the requirements (FIKI) under the TSO used for the design/production approval of the G5. As a comparison even antenna TSOs have certain FIKI requirements that not all OEMs complete.
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The Garmin G5 system and all of its components hold no TSO.
 
bnt83 said:
The Garmin G5 system and all of its components hold no TSO.
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I must of had it backwards then. Most instrument/equipment FIKI certification requirements are found in TSO documents. It has to do with the interface of the pitot/static system and how the instrument handles changes to the pressure/vacuum signals in icing conditions. FIKI tests are very expensive.
 
Bell206 said:
I must of had it backwards then. Most instrument/equipment FIKI certification requirements are found in TSO documents. It has to do with the interface of the pitot/static system and how the instrument handles changes to the pressure/vacuum signals in icing conditions. FIKI tests are very expensive.
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They are kind of an oddball considering how these systems were typically approved in the past.

Between Dad and I we have 5 of them, three magnetometers and two GAD29B (ARINC 429 adapter).
 
bnt83 said:
G5 is prohibited or being installed in FIKI aircraft, I know all Cirrus aren't but that still eliminates a bunch of them.
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None of the steam-gauge Cirri were FIKI.

However, the SR22 wasn't introduced until 2001 and it had a full glass panel starting in 2003, so there were only the first two years of production that would qualify for a G5 anyway. The SR20 was introduced in 1999 so has an extra couple of years, but they don't sell nearly as many 20s as 22s.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
None of the steam-gauge Cirri were FIKI.

However, the SR22 wasn't introduced until 2001 and it had a full glass panel starting in 2003, so there were only the first two years of production that would qualify for a G5 anyway. The SR20 was introduced in 1999 so has an extra couple of years, but they don't sell nearly as many 20s as 22s.
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This is what I figured, but the FIKI angle is also interesting. It really bites into the value of those early Cirrus. (Which, I suppose, is part of why they are so relatively cheap.)

What about the other half of my question? Is there a path to getting these in when it's not on the AML? Or is that a definite hard stop for certified aircraft?
 
arnoha said:
This is what I figured, but the FIKI angle is also interesting. It really bites into the value of those early Cirrus. (Which, I suppose, is part of why they are so relatively cheap.)

What about the other half of my question? Is there a path to getting these in when it's not on the AML? Or is that a definite hard stop for certified aircraft?
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All you can do is try for a field approval. The local FSDO will probably just send it to an ACO, then the ACO says yes/no.

Given the gov shutdown(s) I can't imagine getting a field approval is fast.
 
Call or write Garmin, I wrote them about including
the one Fleet Canuck 80 on the US Register and it came out in the next revision to the AML.
Heck, there’s less that 70 left total, must not have been a big deal for them.
Dave
 
d.grimm said:
Call or write Garmin, I wrote them about including
the one Fleet Canuck 80 on the US Register and it came out in the next revision to the AML.
Heck, there’s less that 70 left total, must not have been a big deal for them.
Dave
Click to expand...

Interesting. I wonder what the process is for adding something to the AML.

Either way, for now, I don't have a horse in the race. Early Cirrus are just one of many models I'm debating...and my timeline is around two years out.
 
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