Flying Keys/Caribbean - Meetup or Tips?

[JohnSBA]

For what may be our last Big Adventure in our own plane, my wife and I are ramping up to leave KSBA within a week and fly across the South to FL. We'll probably take a week or so to get there (about 3/22/2013), and might stay a day or two with family near Melbourne, FL. As you can already tell this won't be a tightly planned or scheduled trip because we're guided by whims and weather (and Meetups). My idea is to climb above the West Palm Beach airspace before topping out about 10-12k' flying the 55nm over water to Freeport and work our way down along the islands. We also hope to fly the Florida Keys (either before or after the Caribbean), and leave FL to head up the East Coast toward Boston sometime before 4/20.

I was happy to find a 2011 POA thread about a similar trip, and have started reading through that to harvest helpful info. I'm also of course starting to read everything available from AOPA & EAA that I can find.

I'm starting this thread in case anyone would like to plan a Meetup along the way, or has useful recent information about where to land/stay (or not!). We're wondering if there are any safe and affordable camping spots, both to save some money on hotels and for the delight of dreaming with surf sounds.

So do you have any experiences, information or tips you're willing to share? Are you interested in a Meetup anywhere along the way, or flying the water crossing(s) at the same time?
Updates:
•My Summary of the 2011 POA thread mentioned above.
•My collection of health related info.
•FoxMike's helpful tips.
•My summary and links to safety/crime related info.
•My partial list of stuff to bring.

To contact me directly or for more info about us, our beloved Tripp, and this or our other Big Adventures please see our blog via the link below.

 

[alfadog]

(snip fun)

So do you have any experiences, information or tips you're willing to share? Are you interested in a Meetup anywhere along the way, or flying the water crossing(s) at the same time? I might post summaries of things I learn, in case it's helpful for other pilots contemplating such flights.

To contact me directly or for more info about us, our beloved Tripp, and this or our other Big Adventures please see our blog via the link below.

I am in Miami and am available to meetup in that area or fly down to Marathon (KMTH) with you for some great seafood. X01 is also a nice destination.

 

[JohnSBA]

Stuff - Re: Flying Keys/Caribbean

I'm creating this reply as a place to collect a list of stuff we're bringing, in case it helps anyone or stimulates some suggestions from you. I'll edit it occasionally with new stuff.

Purchases:
*Bought Nexus 7 tablet and installed free Avare moving map GPS/EFB app with all charts (including Caribbean WACs) & EFB materials with backups on two old Droid X phones.
*Bought $300 PLB (ResQLink+ 375).
*Looking for CDC recommended insect repellent.

Bringing:
*Old AT&T cellphone to get SIM card (poor Verizon service out isl.).
*Handheld Nav/Com.
*Small food & water & first aid kit.

 

[JohnSBA]

I am in Miami and am available to meetup in that area or fly down to Marathon (KMTH) with you for some great seafood. X01 is also a nice destination.

So fun to already see a reply after I posted my Summary placeholder reply! Let's connect via email and set it up!

 

[Walt]

John,
January 2013 traveled to Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, St. Kitts, St Croix and back to Dominican Republic. Had a good time at each destination. Need to file EAPIS into and out of Puerto Rico. I have traveled a lot in Latin America and the Caribbean over the years and have noticed the ever increasing amount of paperwork and fees that are required. I can say the trip this year was much less onerous with respect to paperwork than the ones I have done over the last five years. Take a laptop and do EAPIS the night before. Some airports do not have very good wifi service. Have a good trip!

 

[flav8r]

Don't forget Sun 'n Fun in Lakeland, Florida on April 9th-14th.

 

[JohnSBA]

John,
January 2013 traveled to Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, St. Kitts, St Croix and back to Dominican Republic. Had a good time at each destination.

This is especially welcome news tonight, as we were starting to worry about malaria. Also wanted a recent pirep on the parts beyond Bahamas.

Would be very helpful to get a rough idea of the hotel and fuel prices if you remember or have receipts.

Need to file EAPIS into and out of Puerto Rico.

Also helpful to know, thanks. Hadn't thought of that, but hopefully would've remembered to check. Same with U.S. Virgin Islands I suppose.

Take a laptop and do EAPIS the night before.

Yes, also will have a Nexus 7 and a Droid X that could probably work in a pinch.

Have to find out what cellphone & data types and rates are like there. We're on Verizon and it probably will be very expensive and not much good there, as we've found in Canada. Might buy a cheapo SIM phone to carry for at least voice, and maybe data if there is any. Were you able to use a cellphone or data anywhere on the trip?

Some airports do not have very good wifi service.

I'll be happy to get any at all, especially if cell data's a problem.

Have a good trip!

You've already contributed to that! Thanks!

 

[JohnSBA]

Don't forget Sun 'n Fun in Lakeland, Florida on April 9th-14th.

Thanks for mentioning that. Definitely thinking about it. Have only done Oshkosh once, and would like to add SnF. If you've been to both, which do you prefer? What are your favorite things about SnF?

This trip is going to be pretty expensive and our aviation savings have already gone into prior trips. The one to Newfoundland really broke the bank but as this one's shaping up to be, it was well worth some hardship. I've grown to like beans.

With relatives in Melbourne area we might be able to swing a day at SnF if it's not too expensive. Which day would you recommend?

 

[JohnSBA]

Just discovered the My Out Islands site Grant P linked to in the other thread last year, and am wondering: Has anyone used the $300 fuel credit or any of their other services recently?

 

[flav8r]

Thanks for mentioning that. Definitely thinking about it. Have only done Oshkosh once, and would like to add SnF. If you've been to both, which do you prefer? What are your favorite things about SnF?

I have not been to Oshkosh yet but I'm told by those that have done both that they liked the scaled down version of Sun n' Fun since you can cover it in a couple of days.

With relatives in Melbourne area we might be able to swing a day at SnF if it's not too expensive. Which day would you recommend?

My personal favorites are Friday/Saturday but if you love seaplanes then you'll want to catch the Splash-in on Thursday.
There is a thread somewhere around here with POA members that are planning on meeting up if you're interested.

 

[Walt]

John,
Let me make a few more suggestions. Join the Caribbean Flying Adventures Group. Jim Parker (group leader) answers phone calls and has a web page that has a lot of helpful details. I do not know the range of your airplane but the long leg will probably be from the Bahamas to Dominican Republic. You could stop in the Turks and Caicos but I understand fees are high. Gas in January, was $6.75 to $7.40. You will pay much more if you do not plan your stops (I paid $10.00 in Guadeloupe on a prevouis trip). Use all the data sources at your disposal. Foreflight and the Caribbean Flying Adventures are good sources.

Use your Nexus Tablet to update your EAPIS password before you leave to make sure it will work on the EAPIS site. I carry a MacBook and my passenger had an iPad both worked on EAPIS site.

I use AT&T and coverage was good in most of the places we traveled so my iphone worked which helped for weather updates and city maps when driving a rent car. The iPad was using Verizon and did not work well. You need to look into data plans and phone plans as it is very expensive to roam in the Caribbean.

Hotels costs vary but plan $200/night and sometimes more. We paid about $250.00/night in St. Kitts This year we made no reservations but had researched some places on the web. Most times the FBO helped with suggestions. Budget for handling, ramp, customs fees. I was surprised we did not get hit more than $125.00 this year but other years it has cost close to a grand. Most airports took credit cards this year but I have had trips were cash was the only acceptable form of payment. I have learned to call or email the FBO and ask for an estimate.

Check with your Doc about Malaria and other current medical problems and stay out of Haiti.

You need to spend some time studying the airports where you will be landing. For the most part you will be sharing the airport with airliners and the pace is fast and most times the controllers are hard to understand. ATIS's are multi-lingual.

If you want to fly IFR you will need a trip kit from Jeppesen ($150). Altitude choice of 10-12K usually gives a good ride. Radar coverage is good. Miami Center and San Juan cover most of the ground/ocean you will be over. Radio reception is good at 10K except for a few spots. I needed a rely from an airliner once or twice.

I think you mentioned you had a PLB. You will need life jackets and I would recommend a raft. This is probably enough information to get you started. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

[Dave Siciliano]

We've done this several time beginning in 1971 in a Cherokee 235. Couple times in my A-36, the P baron and are schedule to go to Green Turtle and Atlantis in August. We always have a wonderful time. Of course, you need a Customs Decal for the plane, should have a radio operator's permit but I've never been asked for one. As has been said, file with the customs flight plan and call before you leave to let Customs know when you'll be arriving. Get the name or badge of the person you coordinate with. The AOPA site is a great resource.

We'll have an overflight permit this year; so, we won't stop in south Florida on the way coming or going. I like the Caribbean Pilot's Guide for it's wealth of information, airport information and contact numbers http://www.pilotpub.com/

Have a great trip!

Best,

Dave

 

[JohnSBA]

In case it's useful for anyone else, here's a summary of the info in the long POA "Caravan" thread, that I found the most helpful and relevant to our trip.

7/2011
Dominican Republic: Puerto Plata fuel was cash only, no change available.
Puerto Rico: Aguadilla cheapest fuel in the Caribbean.
XM weather & radio: lose coverage soon after leaving the Bahamas.
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=737320&postcount=34

2/12
If you get a group you can get nice discounts and extras, especially in the bahamas. Check out the Bahamas ministry of tourism.
Usually stop at one of the out islands (Abaco, Cat Island, or Staniel Cay).

6/12
Mosquitoes can be bad after rain, worse May/Jun, even undeterred by 25% Deet.
Eleuthera bar/restaurant reco:Tippy's & Club Med, avoid Cocodimama.
Valentines at Harbor Island

8/12
Camping typically discouraged.

9/12
FCC Restricted Radiotelephone Op. Lic. & aircraft Radio Lic. required.

11/12
Turks and Caicos: Providenciales, pilot+3 = $485 fees +$45 after 4:30pm or weekend/holiday, Fuel stop $282 fees. Comparable fees Bahamas: $115, Dominican Republic $40, Puerto Rico $20.20, Fuel Stops $0. Details:
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1058720&postcount=232

2/9
Gas low side $6.75, high side $7.40. Stopped in Stella Maris, Puna Cana DR, San Juan PR, St. Kitts (no 100LL), St. Croix, Puerto Plata DR.
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1091689&postcount=255

---
One post linked to this report from a 2009 flying club trip:
http://www.aandmaviation.com/bahamas09_1.html
*Need a way to secure aircraft.
*Pop-up squalls complicate things.
*Crosswinds can be strong at Staniel Cay.
*Gas not available at Cat Isl. despite claim, not a port of entry, malaria found there [not shown on CDC map I just checked. -JW].
*AT&T cell worked best in islands, Verizon not at all some places.
*Andros had good wind/runway alignment and was very quiet, few tourists, Kathleen's had good food.
*Abacos, Treasure Cay is a condo community with grocery, bakery, liquor store, restaurant & bars, car/scooter rental, the jewel of the trip.

 

[JohnSBA]

John, Let me make a few more suggestions.

Wow! Thanks for the very informative post!

Join the Caribbean Flying Adventures Group.

Thanks for the extra nudge. I'd already been pondering that.

I do not know the range of your airplane

172Q with long-range tanks. I'm planning for 600nm with reserve. Plan is to follow the island chain low & slow VFR, climbing to glide distance for crossings, so I'll be burning more than in cruise.

long leg will probably be from the Bahamas to Dominican Republic.

Yes, I've been starting to notice that, given the T&C fees.
Updated 3/11: The only part of the CDC malaria map for DR that's clear as of last night is around San Pedro de Macoris, but the closest airport is Las Americas (MDSD wiki says it is Int'l, and CDC has in a malaria warning area) in Punta Caucedo. The DR Airport Info site seems to indicate that Punta Cana (MDPC) is the only international airport (in a malaria danger area) so we might have to stop there for fuel and try to avoid mosquitoes (more details to follow). I'll need to look into overflight rules for Haiti & DR to see if I can shorten the coastal route first imagined, sufficient to go Long Island (Stella Maris, MYLS, closest to PR with 100LL not in Turks, listed in Bahamas Airport Guide) to TJBQ Rafael Hernandez (wiki) in Aguadilla, PR said to have cheapest fuel in Caribbean IIRC (if CBP will let us fly to/from there).
Update 3/12: Maybe the malaria in DR isn't a big deal after all based on this CDC item "none in the cities of Santiago and Santo Domingo.Estimated relative risk of malaria for US travelers: Low"
But then there's this: "In 2012, dengue cases have been reported in most countries in Latin America. Confirmed dengue cases have been reported in US travelers returning from Brazil, Cuba, the Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Haiti, Jamaica, and Puerto Rico. ... Look for a repellent that contains one of the following active ingredients: DEET, picaridin (KBR 3023), Oil of Lemon Eucalyptus/PMD, or IR3535. ... For more protection, clothing may be sprayed with a repellent containing permethrin. (Don't use permethrin on skin.)"
Hope winds won't be a problem, since I like to cruise at 100kias or less.

AT&T...coverage was good... Verizon...did not work well.

This pirep is much appreciated. Guess I'll dig out our bag of old phones and find one with a viable battery that can take an AT&T network SIM chip.

Hotels costs vary but plan $200/night and sometimes more.

Also quite helpful. We'll probably have camping gear, but I gather most islands discourage it and mosquitoes can be a big issue.

Quite a surprise about the fees, so getting current details on that alone is probably worth the CFAG membership.

For the most part you will be sharing the airport with airliners

Good to know, because I'd imagined sleepy dirt strips. I trained here at Class C KSBA and have flown into some Class B airports (including bilingual Canada) so hopefully I'll do ok on that part.

Altitude choice of 10-12K usually gives a good ride.

Perfect for the longer water crossings.

Again, thanks for all the helpful info. If you think of anything else, I'd greatly appreciate it and thanks also for the invitation to ask any questions I come up with.

 

[N801BH]

......
Good to know, because I'd imagined sleepy dirt strips. ......

Back 30 years ago when I lived down there any "sleepy dirt strips" you stopped at would lead to death for the pilots.............. And your plane would be gone in 60 seconds....

 

[JohnSBA]

Customs Decal...radio operator's permit

Can't find our decal but if we don't find it at least we'll have the paper one. Tempted to skip the radio op & a/c licenses since nobody mentions having been asked, but I guess the fine could be substantial.

AOPA site is a great resource.

So much to read! There's probably stuff on EAA too, but I was surprised how little on Baja Bush Pilots (basically, "buy the book").

We'll have an overflight permit this year

Is that U.S. or Haiti/PR? I'll need to be looking into that.

Caribbean Pilot's Guide

Leaving in a few days to head toward FL, so I'll have to decide between chancing delivery or finding one on the way.

Thanks for all the help!

 

[JohnSBA]

Back 30 years ago when I lived down there any "sleepy dirt strips" you stopped at would lead to death for the pilots.............. And your plane would be gone

Yikes! Guess I'd better check the State Department website and see if that sort of thing is still going on!
Update: Looks pretty bad in Haiti. Haven't read it yet but here's info on DR, and here's Bahamas.

 

[JohnSBA]

April Blackout - Re: Flying Keys/Caribbean - Meetup or Tips?

FYI - Noticed that the $300 fuel rebate Out Islands promo offer has an April "blackout" when it's not available, so we called for details. There's to be a regatta for the month that goes from island to island, but we're told rates will be higher during the whole period on all the islands. Between that and Spring Break it looks to be busy season starting on April Fool's Day.

So we're going to aim for completing our Caribbean tour by the end of March. Probably too short notice for anyone to join us or meet up, but I hope to post updates anyway. Even if we're solo out there, I'm hoping the info may be useful to those who follow.

 

[ajudge@grovenetworks.com]

I'm leaving Saturday at 8:00am to MDPP from KTMB. Should be fun!

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

Floridians have known for decades that "skin so soft" lotion from avon keeps the bugs at bay better than anything from OFF. It is much cheaper and effective. No camping trip is complete without it.

The cheapest fuel in Florida is near Orlando at Aoploka.

You can rent a raft from Ft Lauderdale FBO I believe. We had some from our Air Caribbean Adventure to Grand Cayman Islands in 2005, who did that but it was a bit pricey.

You can take I-10 the whole way from Calif. To Florida pretty much an easy flight.

If I were going that far at those altitudes I would have O2 on the plane particularly for the last 30 minutes before decent and landing if not the whole route.

 

[alfadog]

So we're going to aim for completing our Caribbean tour by the end of March. Probably too short notice for anyone to join us or meet up, but I hope to post updates anyway. Even if we're solo out there, I'm hoping the info may be useful to those who follow.

Floridians have known for decades that "skin so soft" lotion from avon keeps the bugs at bay better than anything from OFF. It is much cheaper and effective. No camping trip is complete without it.

So both of you are going to be in South Florida very soon, if not already, right? Shoot me a PM or post here if y'all would like to get together even if only for a burger. My son will be with me next week and I need to save my money for some things we are planning to do together so I cannot swing any flight time but I can afford a burger I can also take you up in the Luscombe, just not up for any cross-country on my dime. It sucks to be broke.

 

[Alexb2000]

Re: April Blackout - Re: Flying Keys/Caribbean - Meetup or Tips?

FYI - Noticed that the $300 fuel rebate Out Islands promo offer has an April "blackout" when it's not available, so we called for details. There's to be a regatta for the month that goes from island to island, but we're told rates will be higher during the whole period on all the islands. Between that and Spring Break it looks to be busy season starting on April Fool's Day.

So we're going to aim for completing our Caribbean tour by the end of March. Probably too short notice for anyone to join us or meet up, but I hope to post updates anyway. Even if we're solo out there, I'm hoping the info may be useful to those who follow.

I got stiffed on the $300 fuel credit last year. The booking agent said the hotel was participating, the Bahamas website listed the hotel, we got all the required paperwork done when we cleared customs inbound. We tell the hotel when we check in..... nothing. The last day there the manager tells us that they are no longer participating in the program and that the website is just slow to update. Typical of the Bahamas arguing did no good.

I would call the hotel and make sure that they are participating if you want to use the credit. Also, make sure you have the copies of the inbound paper work for the hotel so they will give you the credit on your bill immediately. I can't imagine once you leave ever seeing any kind of credit.

 

[JohnSBA]

if y'all would like to get together even if only for a burger.

Would very much like to meet up!

I've had fun planning this trip, and greatly appreciate all the tips shared here. Today we're in St. Augustine (blog) and decided on impulse to check into riding the tailwind to Marsh Harbor. The FBO guy has gone many times and says you basically don't need to plan much. Just show up and it's all good. Assuming of course you've done the EAPIS outbound, file flight plan, have the CBP sticker or receipt (we have both), and have your passports (oh, and some cash).

If we're not in jail tonight and can find wifi I'll post an update here and on the blog.

If we don't end up going to Marsh Harbor from St. Augustine today we might linger a night or two with friends at Coco Beach, in which case I'll check back here to see if we can arrange a meetup. Otherwise hopefully on our return. Looks like camping Bahamas may not be an option and we can't afford many nights in hotels so it might be only a few nights in Bahamas.

Hope to meet you and the Luscombe.

Happy Flying -j

 

[jonnyjetprop]

The cheapest fuel in Florida is near Orlando at Aoploka.

X04- Orlando Apopka

 

[flav8r]

X04- Orlando Apopka

New flight plan for Sun 'n Fun.... KFHB-X04-KLAL

 

[JohnSBA]

PIREP - Re: Flying Keys/Caribbean - Meetup or Tips?

Well, we'd planned to stop for a day or two near West Palm Beach and plan our crossing. But due to encouragement from a pilot at Galaxy in St. Augustine and strong tailwinds aloft today I decided to just go for it. I'm glad we didn't buy the $60 book because it was a short and simple hop with the combination of all charts & A/FD loaded into Avare (all free!) on the Nexus 7, the panel GNS430 with 2010 world Jep, and my trusty old Lowrance 1000 with really old Jep. Each had strengths, but Avare was the most useful and the N7 cost half what the antique Lowrance did when I bought it on clearance at "end of life" several years ago. Did eAPIS outbound before takeoff and filed in-flight with FS when we neared Ft. Pierce.

I'm blogging the trip and will put most of the details and all pix there. Another thing I'll mention here is that customs was a cake walk. Daron the helpful line guy says June is mosquito season and this is the "windy month." Every one of the seven different people we talked with at the airport was extra friendly and helpful, including Tynes the taxi guy. About 15 minutes from leaving plane to boarding taxi. We decided before departure to book at the Castaway so we'd have a solid reservation, and it's both comfy and relatively affordable ($145 with all the taxes, which are substantial). A/C works, close to the airport (2.1 miles or so), short taxi ride to Lucaya where there's a beach casino and an array of tourist stuff. Seems safe to wander at night, and we saw a variety of people walking comfortably everywhere.

We ate at Zorba's in Lucaya, where an ample greek salad with chicken was $18 with beer. We hear the Coral Beach Condos rent at $80 or so right now, and I think they don't have to charge the taxes: 373-2468. We drove by to get that number we couldn't get online before the trip (or we'd have stayed there instead of Castaway). Total taxi to hotel, then CBCondos, Lucaya and back to hotel after dinner was $40, both fun and entertaining talking to Tynes.

My take away as of today: extremely easy to get here, hotel prices relatively high for the quality level. Fuel is expensive, but lower than many U.S. airports we've visited in our adventures including coming across from the west coast this time. Unless you really enjoy planning, I agree with the St. Aug. pilot: just do it.

 

[JohnSBA]

Pirep - Re: Flying Keys/Caribbean - Meetup or Tips?

Again, I'm blogging our Bahamas trip and have just posted an update with some details that may be useful for GA pilots. I'll add any subsequent info to my Pirep summary there (and a little more in this earlier post) if you'd like to Subscribe to it and be notified of Updates. I welcome any questions or comments.

Happy Flying -j

 

[flav8r]

Thank you so much for your blog, I have been living vicariously through your updates.

What I don't know is, if I were to make the same trip could I return to the same old grind of work?

 

[AdamZ]

John, I can't WAIT to read the blog. That looks like SO much fun!

 

[JohnSBA]

Wow thanks for the encouraging feedback.

We met for drinks with Kent and Kelsey tonight, and it was the perfect cap to a glorious time here. We're hoping to have decent VFR for the flight back to FL tomorrow afternoon. Then on with the rest of our trip. Hope to fly the Keys soon and get that off my bucket list too. Of course, like the Bahamas it will probably end up even higher on my bucket list for a re-do.

In the morning I'll try to think of a way to choose a CBP airport with short wait times, and hopefully will remember adding an update about that on my blog and/or one of the two threads here on POA. Still haven't looked at the AOPA forum either. Too busy having fun today!

 

[flav8r]

I was reading your latest blog and noticed that you took a picture of a famous Miami landmark (1549 Happiness?), this is actually now a museum called Vizcaya. It is the former villa of James Deering (circa 1919). Very much worth a look at if your traveling back through Miami.

 

[rwellner98]

In the morning I'll try to think of a way to choose a CBP airport with short wait times, and hopefully will remember adding an update about that on my blog and/or one of the two threads here on POA. Still haven't looked at the AOPA forum either. Too busy having fun today!

For the sake of others, Ft. Pierce has an excellent reputation for short waits.

Nassau has a terrible one for both customs and ATC. Clear into the bahamas elsewhere if at all reasonable. I cleared at governors harbor and they were fantastic. My buddy went through Nassau and spent four hours there between getting cleared and getting back out again. Two hours alone just trying to get a VFR clearance out. I came back through a few days later and it took 1.5 hours to get out.

 

[JohnSBA]

Ft. Pierce has an excellent reputation for short waits.

Thanks for the followup. I hadn't seen any posts here so I forgot to update. We flew from St. Augustine to Freeport on Grand Bahama Island, and had no trouble at all. Cleared in a few minutes, with plenty of help from the friendly people at the airport and customs. Coming back we flew from there to Ft. Lauderdale Executive and again the customs process was quick and painless. It's a very busy airport though, so taking off again took quite a while. Also, I highly recommend you buy fuel elsewhere unless money is no object. See the bottom of my 2013/04/01 blog post for details.