MultiMediaWill
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Will
Is it possible to fly a pattern in a 172 only touching the yoke to turn and using the trim only for elevator?
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Is it possible to fly a pattern in a 172 only touching the yoke to turn and using the trim only for elevator?
Yes, you can do it without touching the yoke at all, just use the rudder to turn.
Nope. Can't flare adequately that way. Not enough nose-up trim. In many aircraft, you'll be close to full nose up trim on final with good approach speed and full flaps. In a Cessna or Piper even without flaps, you can't trim slower than best glide.
And crosswind landings are gonna be real fun with no aileron.
Is it possible to fly a pattern in a 172 only touching the yoke to turn and using the trim only for elevator?
Can someone explain how the rudder would effectively turn you? Also wouldn't you be asking for a spin on base to final using rudder only?
Only if you're an idiot.
Can someone explain how the rudder would effectively turn you? Also wouldn't you be asking for a spin on base to final using rudder only?
As noted above, the biggest risk is pranging the nosewheel on touchdown.
Would this be a good thing to practice in case of full control failure?
Would this be a good thing to practice in case of full control failure?
Wrong, and wrong. In fact in my training I was required to do it with trim and runner only before getting signed off.
And there is no need to flare. Just keep the nose wheel from hitting first at an appropriate airspeed. In my PA28 and my PA24 I can trim to way way way below best glide, and in the PA24, I actually trim to flare - though I don't actually flare. But I have zero back pressure on the yoke on final, and I still have about 25% more nose up trim I can use.
Umm, in that PA28, when you do engine-out practice, where is the trim?
I flew with a wise, old CFI who has roughly 6500 hours in a 172 and one day with me in the left seat he showed me a lap around the pattern without touching the yoke at all. He used just power and rudder and touched the trim wheel twice. He's the same guy who had me do a pattern with a towel covering the entire panel.
Not correctSimply put, the rudder pushes one wing forward into the airstream (relative wind), which causes the other to be partially blocked by the fuselage. More airflow equal more lift, less airflow equal less lift, ergo bank. Yes, you want to take it easy on the rudder.
So wrong one wonders if sarcasm is involved.It moves the nose of the plane. Rudders turn boats don't they? I've never seen ailerons (waterons?) on a boat, and those turn. The thrust moves you the way the nose points. Second question: Only if you're an idiot.
Application of rudder yaws the plane, advancing the outside wing and retarding the inside wing. That creates a difference in airspeed between the two wings, with more speed on the outside wing. Since the two wings are at the same angle of attach, the extra speed on the outside wing creates more lift on that wing, rolling the plane around its longitudinal axis.Can someone explain how the rudder would effectively turn you?
Not as much as using ailerons only. While there is a bit more drag on the outboard wing due to the greater airspeed, the fact that the rudder is applied in the direction of the turn pretty much coordinates the turn. While there is still a bit of a skid, it's not nearly as out-of-coordination as using aileron with no rudder at all. This is pretty easy to test yourself in flight by first rudder-rolling with ailerons neutral, and then aileron-rolling with the rudder centered, and comparing how far out of center the ball is in each case. If you're concerned about a spin, just keep your speed up near cruise when you try this, since you can't spin without stalling first.Also wouldn't you be asking for a spin on base to final using rudder only?
Certainly, but be spring-loaded to the grab-the-yoke position, especially as you get close to the ground lest you plant the nosewheel and damage the aircraft. It might take a few tries ending in a hands-on-yoke go-around before you get it to the point where you can land it gently enough not to hurt anything this way.Would this be a good thing to practice in case of full control failure?
Between the seats. It's also there when I'm flying normally.
There are a few ways to demonstrate this does not have a significant effect. Many RC planes are designed with zero dihedral so that a rudder induced yaw has little or no roll effect. There are full scale airplanes designed simularly.Application of rudder yaws the plane, advancing the outside wing and retarding the inside wing. That creates a difference in airspeed between the two wings, with more speed on the outside wing. Since the two wings are at the same angle of attach, the extra speed on the outside wing creates more lift on that wing, rolling the plane around its longitudinal axis.
There are a few ways to demonstrate this does not have a significant effect. Many RC planes are designed with zero dihedral so that a rudder induced yaw has little or no roll effect. There are full scale airplanes designed simularly.
Application of rudder yaws the plane, advancing the outside wing and retarding the inside wing. That creates a difference in airspeed between the two wings, with more speed on the outside wing. Since the two wings are at the same angle of attach, the extra speed on the outside wing creates more lift on that wing, rolling the plane around its longitudinal axis.
Not correct
So wrong one wonders if sarcasm is involved.
Ya think?
Stupid questions get stupid answers. Sorry, I am a believer that there *are* stupid questions.