First Passenger As A Private Pilot (Or Lack Thereof)

Yep, if there's a destination involved, now they're throwing gas money at you.... What makes it cool is that a weekend trip to see a show or go golfing or fishing or whatever can now be done as a day trip.
 
I have a couple of times driven past the airport on a date late at night and said "Hey, you wanna go flying?" "Now?" "Yeah, that's my plane" "Hell yeah!" That's one of the nice things about owning, it's there for you 24/7.
 
I've had one non-pilot passenger in the six months since my ASEL checkride. She got sick 10 minutes before we landed for lunch :eek: (very mild thermal turb, absolutely no stupid pilot tricks)

I thought I might get more takers for the glider than the airplane. Though I go soaring almost every weekend and invite nearly everyone I know, no one has signed up for a ride. Like others have mentioned here, I'm not going to pressure anyone into it.
 
1200AGL said:
I've had one non-pilot passenger in the six months since my ASEL checkride. She got sick 10 minutes before we landed for lunch :eek: (very mild thermal turb, absolutely no stupid pilot tricks)

I thought I might get more takers for the glider than the airplane. Though I go soaring almost every weekend and invite nearly everyone I know, no one has signed up for a ride. Like others have mentioned here, I'm not going to pressure anyone into it.
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Wow, I didn't even think about sickness (I never get sick). Another thing to ask people beforehand, I guess.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Thanks. I *may* have a passenger or two now - but one is texting me "let me check my calendar" which I think means "let me get home and ask my live-in girlfriend if she will let me go alone with you."
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Take 'em both...

But you'll probably have to make sure the aircraft isn't fully fueled, since it's a Skyhawk. :)
 
denverpilot said:
Take 'em both...

But you'll probably have to make sure the aircraft isn't fully fueled, since it's a Skyhawk. :)
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It is a 152 and only has two seats. I have to pay for a checkout in the 172 which costs money, even though during training I flew it several times. Also, he says she is scared to death of small planes.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Wow, I didn't even think about sickness (I never get sick). Another thing to ask people beforehand, I guess.
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Actually, don't ask. Asking just plants the suggestion in their brain and they are more likely to get sick.

Better to strategically stow needed items (sick sacks, additional plastic garbage bags, ginger pills, bottled water, saltine crackers, chewing gum with a sharp flavor minty flavor) with easy reach and be ready to offer whats needed.

Also, plan the flight to get high enough out of the thermal and mechanical turbulence (and cooler ambient temp). And not too far from a paved strip should all of the previous fail.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Wow, I didn't even think about sickness (I never get sick). Another thing to ask people beforehand, I guess.
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That is something that I will be certain to ask about next time. I keep a few Sick Sac's stashed in my flight bag now, and I plan to bring Bonine just in case a passenger needs it.

It was no fun having a miserable passenger and discovering that there wasn't a whole lot I could do to help. I tried letting her fly, played with the vent to give her more fresh air, told her to look out to the horizon, and experimented with different altitudes and airspeeds on the return leg with no success. Trying to climb above the boundary layer wasn't a great option in this instance.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Wow, I didn't even think about sickness (I never get sick). Another thing to ask people beforehand, I guess.
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Grab a few puke sacks off the next flight in the mail tube and put them in your flight bag. There was one occasion I was glad to have them for a pax.
 
I think the nervousness combined with maybe a tendency for motion sickness gets to some people.

Hang in there Kimberly and just enjoy flying. Riders will come.
 
This thread is the total reverse of my experience.

I've had reasonable demand for flying from non-flying folks including a friend who asked about going on a cross-country to a convention having never flown in a small airplane. Sadly we've tried two years in a row and have been grounded each time due to fog.

The wife was the first passenger although she hasn't been up with me more than twice. The father-in-law was a former pilot and we try and sneak in a flight whenever he visits. I've also flown my brother-in-law and his wife over the Boston marathon course. Since she was pregnant I even have flown a fetus! :eek:

I've even managed to convince one of my former passengers to take a discovery flight and maybe start flight training.

I seem to encounter people who are outright against flying in small aircraft or love the idea. Sadly I think my parents are in the former group. I suggested taking them on a flight on the when they visit next week, but never heard about it again. If people are not instantly thrilled by the idea when you mention it I don't bring it up again.
 
My first passenger was my wife. My second and third were my kids. My fourth was my mom.

I did not take a non-pilot friend flying for quite a while. One guy in particular really wanted to go, and -- after I got him airborne -- I found that he was nearly paralyzed with fear. It was a beautiful, smooth day, with gorgeous Lake Michigan beckoning, but all he could do, through tightly-pursed lips, was mutter "Please land -- now!"

His death grip on the seat was a sight to behold.

I landed, only to have him tell me that he was terrified of heights. When asked why he hadn't told me this, he said that he was hoping to break his fear by flying in a small plane!

So, be thankful that some of these people aren't going up with you.

There is something else that you may experience. I found that, over time, my friendships grew away from kiwis (flightless birds, stuck on the ground, mostly by choice) to birdmen and -women -- those who choose to take to the sky.

In my experience, they are far and away more interesting people.
 
In 9 years, not,including charity flights, I have had less than 10 non-pilot passengers. And I offer A LOT.
 
Kinberely, let me put a slightly different prospective on this. I am sure you do not consider your flying particularly dangerous. However, statistics disagree with you. Low time private pilots do pose considerable risk to themselves and their passengers. Let me emphasize, they are safe private pilots out there, I am talking in general and painting with a broad brush. I have heard many times that it is more dangerous to drive to the airport. Actually as a per cent of mileage general aviation is much worse. If you remove private pilots and only look at corporate aviation flown by a professional crew then the statistics are much better. Just check on life insurance as a low time private pilot and you will see what I mean. My wife and I both ride a motorcycle. I know they are dangerous. I don't solicit passengers but, we both still ride. We both quit untill the kids were grown but, have started back. I personally am not fond of single engine planes. I have a couple thousand hours in them but all pilots have to crawl before they can walk. I have been in a single engine plane all of 45 minutes in the past 20 years. Now add to that, a non pilot is totally at your mercy with no control over the situation. Frankly, I wouldn't let my family fly with you and I don't even know you. In fact I suspect you are a very competent new private pilot. The basic problem is you don't have enough experience yet to know what you don't know and there IS a lot you don't know. My unsolicited advice is build time, perhaps you will meet other pilots who will fly with you and enjoy the experience. I think you are wrong to exclude other pilots. They will be more comfortable since they have a degree of control. As you build time, hopefully add ratings your reputation will spread and more people will seek you out to fly with them. You can not fault people for being people, they fear what they don't understand. I am still amazed that the person I fly for will put himself, his wife and two young kids in an aluminum tube and zip around the sky at 350 MPH in all kinds of weather with me at the controls and many times take a nap enroute. Not me, I am not setting in the back of a plane and sleep with anybody flying. I won't fly commuter and am a little nervous on majors in fact I rarely fly commercial. Many states don't let new teenage drivers take passengers (except parents). Don't take it personally, enjoy your new skills, learn all you can, fly all you can and become the best pilot you can be. Best of luck!!!
 
PPL since 12/31/2009, I've had at least 20 non pilots fly with me. Some even started taking lessons. I've taken up a few students in the flight school where I keep my plane, they're usually eager to ride along.
 
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So far I've taken 5 people. My parents, my G/F, my neighbor, and a co-op at work. (Well.... 6 people, the nice FBO secretary rode along on my last night flight for my complex training). Id agree that most people, when given the option, will back out. I've been asked many times "how long have you been flying" and when they hear "85 hrs"....... the response is always.... "Well, Ill wait until you have more experience."

I concluded that many people think a fresh pilot is like a fresh car driver. Almost no training and scary to ride with. But when you start explaining what you've been through (training wise), the safety checks, 100hr inspections (for the rentals), annuals, etc...... most will warm up to the idea of flying.

I've had more people than I can count back out of flying. The nice days at work, I always ask someone..... "Hey, its nice out.... wanna go flying this afternoon?" More excuses..... busy.... nervous... don't like small planes..... Even the guys that always talk about getting their license back out. Just the way it is.
 
I think the guy that really had guts was the one who was my first helicopter passenger. When I asked if he had ever been in a helicopter before he said, "Only Flight for Life." Years before he had been in a microburst accident during his second (airplane) lesson.
 
kontiki said:
No dating women to speak of ever go, same with the pistol range too. I even bought a nice date gun, that was a waste.
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OK, I belong to a gun club, I am an active shooter, and compete on occassion, but never bought a "date gun". Can I ask what is that? If you don't want to hijack this thread, please start another. I gots to know.

Hmmm, thinking....hmmm, date gun..... Flying date gun, or shooting date gun, or just a going out on a date, date gun???

1911? No something smaller, more concealable. Or maybe not, as this was a shooting friend, maybe you wanted her to see it??? Revolver? Python? No, too old school. Got it. No, not a Glock. Let's see. HK would fit the bill. Yes, you bought an HK, dropped a grand, and it still didn't produce the desired, results? Right? :D
 
EdFred said:
In 9 years, not,including charity flights, I have had less than 10 non-pilot passengers. And I offer A LOT.
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Maybe its the planes you fly? People hear I have a Grumman, and just want to fly in it. Then again, maybe its you? Do you shower before flights? Clean underwear?


:D
 
Anthony said:
OK, I belong to a gun club, I am an active shooter, and compete on occassion, but never bought a "date gun". Can I ask what is that? If you don't want to hijack this thread, please start another. I gots to know.
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pink-gun.jpg


:D
 
I got to go on a number of flights with a new PPL friend, once with him PIC, and he's flown with me in my airplane more. It's actually a good learning experience for both people if no one has an enormous ego.

I'd forgotten the things that were "hard" back when I was a new pilot, and he said he got to see what flying underneath an overcast he may not have otherwise launched in, was like.

It's fun to watch other folks and try to keep mouth shut and study. Or joke with 'em a bit if you know 'em well enough when they do something silly. It's also interesting what a new pilot will see as "criticism" versus what you meant, and good to show them when you do something wrong that it's okay to say it, and humble yourself a bit as they say something like, "I wasn't sure I should say anything." Hell yes man, now that you've pointed it out I'm going to kick myself mentally for the next three days trying to figure out how that fell out of my mental checklist, behavior, and habits! Good catch!

We're both pretty conservative safety-wise but my weather knowledge is a bit further along than his. He's got other stuff totally nailed that I don't anymore. It's fun.

I'm still learning to let him run my radios for me and struggle through waiting for him to key up and reply, 'cause I have tons of radio background and I'm pretty well practiced at it, so I hammer myself pretty hard (mentally) on phraseology just to keep myself entertained and as he says, "You've already replied and I'm just finishing up thinking about what I was going to say!"

It's also shameful that I briefed that the radios were his and then still smash the PTT. Oops. Same thing with the flaps.

It's just a fun learning experience and I highly recommend going flying with other pilots.

The only warning is to watch out for the ones that have reputations of doing stupid stuff. Unfortunately that's somewhat hard to judge. With less and less folks hanging out in the airport lobby and hangar flying, it's hard to just ask the group what they think of so-and-so's flying before accepting a ride.
 
I did end up flying a couple people who don't know me from Adam up to the Shuttle launch a couple months back...
 
Well Kim, you got me thinking about how it hasn't been a problem for me. My mom went up with me on my first lesson and has been asking to go up again. My wife went up with me on a night XC that I asked my instructor to do with us "just for extra training" (prior to my checkride). After my checkride, I posted on PoA and sent a link to the post and didn't think much of it and wasn't soliciting. I got a fair amount of response.

Awhile back (I think it was Jeanie) I picked up a suggestion about how to introduce people to flying. Give them a quick blurb about training requirements and then SHUT UP. Afterwards, let them know they have to initiate and ask you. I have made it clear that this is my policy with adults, they must ask because it must be their decision and then I am free to accept if I want to fly with them.

When asked about my experience, non-fliers find it easier to accept that I spent a little over 2 years training. 40+ hours in a syllabus means nothing to them.

My wife was my first post checkride passenger. The idea was to GO SOMEWHERE. She's sold on the usefulness of quick getaways now.
2nd flight added her mother and our daughter (asleep shortly after takeoff). My wife conveyed my asking policy and in her own way, she brought up the idea of going flying. Again, we had a destination.

My wife's grandmother brings it up every time she sees me with the grin of a teenager with an offer of gas money.

I know it probably doesn't make you feel much better with the stories, but I suspect that you take it personally and it comes through in your posture, countenance and choice of words with your friends. Some will, some won't....NEXT!

Best advice I got on PoA:
Enjoy your new certificate. PILOT.
Congratulations.
 
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My first passenger was a PPL holder who hadn't been current in a while. When he flew along with me, and then told all of my friends at church that I did a nice job, it was pretty easy to get folks to fly along.

Ryan
 
I just realized ..... You've already had your first passenger.....the DPE!
 
That's why I always say landings aren't really that important. It's just a moment. What people remember is the destination and the time. That's what clicks with most people. They tolerate small planes because they serve a function. Some people love to go flying. I had a Japanese crewmate on the old schooners, Hiro Aki Katchi. I used to take him flying aerobatics, he loved it, he'd be over there or back there hootin and hollerin making machine gun noises...:rofl: If I went to practice aerobatics and didn't ask him along it would hurt him. He barely spoke English at the time, FOB as is said now, but he came as a seaman and schooner rat.
 
Get into the Young Eagles program.

You'll never run short of passengers again.
 
Kim,

The fact that so many of your friends are hesitant is no surprise, and in fact, no disappointment. The fact that your Dad has bailed made me sigh. If my daughter had the gumption, character and determination to go through all that you went through and gave me the distinct and excited honor of such a flight, the National Guard wouldn't be able to keep me out of that plane, much less a nagging spouse. I'm sorry if this sounds like a shot at your Dad. I'm sure he's a great guy.

I haven't been to the Bay Area in about 8 years. Maybe I need to go out there and be your surrogate Dad for the flight.

I hope you enjoy your vacation.
Doc
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Thanks, but not really - I don't have many friends and the ones I asked I see perhaps once every few years. Day to day, I live alone and lack a social life due to the fact that all my friends are getting married and having kids and can't relate to the single girl thing.
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Wow it is amazing how much you have in common with Ed!;)

Seriously Kim, First congrats Pilot! I'll look forward to your write up. A super accomplishment. My first Pax was my neighbor. A great guy who was always interested in my lessons and what I was doing. He had not a moment's hesitation when I asked him. Then I took my wife and daughter. My wife was very non plussed had not issues about getting up in the air but is not an oh ahh look at that kind of excitement. My daughter was beside herself with excitement. Then I started looking for other non pilots and it did take sometime. Its a lot of fun to share your passion with someone you care about but you can also find others. When folks you meet or know at work or the gym find out you are a pilot at somepoint someone will ask for a ride or you can say " hey if you ever want to go let me know" You will usually be able to tell by their reaction if they are serious. The " oh man that would be awesome" will usually go the person who says "Yea that might be interesting" or uses the word interesting ain't gonna go.

Have you asked your snowmobiling friends? They seem adventurous. Anyway don't look at it as a failure it happens to most pilots. I had a nighbor who gave me crap because I didn't invite him to go flying then I did twice and it was a no go. Just last week I saw him ( his wife is pregnant with his second) I said you aren't ever going to be allowed to go are you? oh well.

Again Kim, congrats on passing the check ride.
 
On my friend's first flight, I plan to limit it to maybe 1/2 hour like an intro flight, just to see how they do.

To actually do anything from here (N-Memphis), it's takes maybe an hour to get anywhere. Were not even going to get out from under Class B.

I know some people are very susceptible to vertigo/dizziness. I folk dance. There are lots of spins. Some women are very physical and will spin like crazy (luv them).

Others, one turn and they need to go to the ladies room, like my sister. I am very surprised at that kind of frailty, but I do not want to torture anyone. If someone tells me they are uncomfortable, I accept that at face value (vs argue with them about how they actually feel as people sometimes do).
 
kontiki said:
I am very surprised at that kind of frailty, but I do not want to torture anyone. If someone tells me they are uncomfortable, I accept that at face value (vs argue with them about how they actually feel as people sometimes do).
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You know, that reminds me of something. I would always tell my new passengers to tell me right away if they were uncomfortable and that I would turn around land as soon as we could. I wanted to make sure they understood I was in control and that flying was to be enjoyed, not some macho exercise in toughing out an unhappy situation.
 
Everyone is different. I've had a bunch of guys tell me they want to go fly, then when I say, hey I'm going, there's always an excuse. Then people, I'd never expect, just jump in the plane and go with me.

Thank the media, and our "safe at all cost" society.
 
Anthony said:
OK, I belong to a gun club, I am an active shooter, and compete on occassion, but never bought a "date gun". Can I ask what is that? If you don't want to hijack this thread, please start another. I gots to know.
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If I had to classify one of my pistols as a "date gun" it would be the Ruger .22. Lots of fun, cheap ammo, never a malfunction of any kind, and not a lot of noise or recoil.

Of course in MY case, any "date" had jolly well better be with my lovely wife, who has her own... :) She says she'll fly with me once I get my license. We ride a motorcycle together, so she's used to doing things a little out of the ordinary.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
So . . .

Let me start by saying "I knew this would happen."

I am NOT taking this personally - well I'm trying not to - because I understand the issue at hand.

Here is what is going on:

I had two friends and also my Dad - so three people - all "ready to go" on an awesome sight seeing flight around the Alcatraz / Golden Gate Bridge area, weather permitting. My plane seats only myself and one passenger, so I planned to do one of these flights each month for three months - something I could hopefully afford by taking on a second job working at my Mom's office on the weekends for some side money.

Then came the checkride, on Sunday, and I passed.

Logically, I contacted the first person with a date / time for the flight - after I get back from the POA fly-in at 6Y9 for Labor Day. I texted this person (who had solo'd years ago but never continued training due to cost) on Sunday - asking them to be my very first passenger.

The texts were very wishy washy and finally said "Let me think about it and get back to you" - which eventually turned into "you should ask your Dad to be your first passenger."

So: failure number one.

I contacted my Dad, who seemed very excited to go, and confirmed with the flight school that I could have the plane. This was looking great! Then today, I called him again to firm up the time and - wouldn't you know it - he said that his wife was not comfortable (he re-married). He told me he could not be my first passenger, but maybe if I did this exact same flight a few times she "might" change her mind down the road.

So: failure number two.

In the meantime, I had been texting the OTHER friend who is not a pilot. I have not heard back from that friend AT ALL and that is very "unlike" this person.

Conclusion: they were all "being nice" during my training but now they are very nervous to go up.


Result: I am keeping the plane, keeping the reservation, and either doing the flight by myself (if weather allows) - or finding another passenger. I have a few other people I could ask who are on my Facebook friends list, but . . . there are reasons I may or may not want to see them (it is complicated).


Have any of you experienced this? I do not want to "force" the issue on people and am happy to fly alone. I just thought it would be cool to share my flying - something I've worked on for a long time - with the people I care about.
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Focus on being a better pilot, loosing sleep over people backing out of a free airplane ride in not productive..... There are 7 billion people in the world and I bet the VAST majority would love to fly with you. IMHO
 
N801BH said:
Focus on being a better pilot, loosing sleep over people backing out of a free airplane ride in not productive..... There are 7 billion people in the world and I bet the VAST majority would love to fly with you. IMHO
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The reality is, out of those 7 billion people, a few million want to fly or even be flown in a small plane. They don't even particularly want to get on a big plane and even today, many won't. The only reason the vast majority of people get on a plane is because it's the quickest way to get somewhere.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Day to day, I live alone and lack a social life due to the fact that all my friends are getting married and having kids and can't relate to the single girl thing.
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I can relate to the single girl thing. The good news is that eventually your female friends will get divorced and their children will get older and move away so you'll have more in common again. :rofl:

As far as men go, I work with and have had a number of male friends and acquaintances but when they acquire girlfriends or get married its awkward to spend much time with them outside work because even if your relationship is purely platonic there is something uncomfortable about being the third wheel.
 
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