fine...the results

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I realize I could've said no go to the DPE but figured what's the worst that'd happen...I fail. Well I failed anyway. So I guess no harm no foul.
 
So, when will you be flying again to get the trim all straight and get to retest. I'm thinking the sooner the better while you're still tuned up for everything else.
 
saracelica said:
I realize I could've said no go to the DPE but figured what's the worst that'd happen...I fail. Well I failed anyway. So I guess no harm no foul.
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The difference is a "discontinuance" which normally doesn't cost extra and a "re-ride" which does cost. The more important one is in decision making which is part of what the DE is evaluating. I've known quite a few DEs over the years and asked them all the same question, "What do you look for in a PP" and it's always "See if they are safe". Betty Faux put it best, "I ask, "Would I want my daughter in a plane with them?". Many of them say most of the time they know in the first 5 minutes if the pilot is going to pass or not and often before they get in the plane. Thing is, you failed this ride because you made a bad decision and that is harder to correct than bad procedure. You made a flight that you were not prepared for. THAT is what the DE saw. The DE is a passenger, they are your first passenger and you are to treat them as a passenger, and that includes having to say "no" when they are pressuring you to go.
 
saracelica said:
I have over 150 hours in the plane so I thought I could "wing" it (pardon the pun)
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Alright, nobody else is saying it, so I will be the one again.

Look, if you have 150 hours and just failed your PP ride, you need to do some serious re-evaluating of both your capabilities and commitment towards aviation. 150 hrs and you don't know how to trim??? This is UNACCEPTABLE LEARNING FROM YOU!!! Learning is YOUR responsibility, and you are waaayyyy behind the power curve. At 150hrs, this is no longer your instructors fault, this is your fault. At 150 hrs you should have been able to train yourself. This is about your commitment, or lack there of, or you lack of ability. The latter is nothing against you, we're all different and some people just aren't meant to be pilots. This isn't Hollywood where "will can over come all odds". Will has nothing to do with it, it's ability, commitment and effort, and when you are failing a PP checkride you are lack either one or both of them and from the sounds of things, you aren't into putting forth effort, even your thinking is lazy. It's time you do the proverbial "sh-t or get off the pot." From the mental standpoint of being PIC, you need to start from scratch because continuing with your attitude will have you in a grave in 3 years.

Aviation is serious business and there is nothing you don't need to know, and you aren't exhibiting signs of learning fast enough to keep you alive.

You need to change your attitude and approach towards aviation or you will die and take whatever passengers you have with you.
 
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Thanks for everyone's opinion. Can we close this now? Some people just learn a little slower then others. Some peoples' priorities are different. I am perfectly safe pilot. I will try it again. I just didn't use the trim wheel and attempted to fly it with the yoke.
 
saracelica said:
Thanks for everyone's opinion. Can we close this now? Some people just learn a little slower then others. Some peoples' priorities are different. I am perfectly safe pilot. I will try it again. I just didn't use the trim wheel and attempted to fly it with the yoke.
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Good, try a lot harder this time, and it's not just trim. Physically manipulating an aircraft is a minor portion of being PIC.
 
saracelica said:
Thanks for everyone's opinion. Can we close this now? Some people just learn a little slower then others. Some peoples' priorities are different. I am perfectly safe pilot. I will try it again. I just didn't use the trim wheel and attempted to fly it with the yoke.
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What's wrong with this picture?:)
 
I am so glad Henning spoke the truth. At 150 hours she should be working on her instrument. I hope she takes what Henning said to heart.
 
saracelica said:
Thanks for everyone's opinion. Can we close this now? Some people just learn a little slower then others. Some peoples' priorities are different. I am perfectly safe pilot. I will try it again. I just didn't use the trim wheel and attempted to fly it with the yoke.
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BTW, here's the problem with that, aviation does not care what your priorities are. Aviation does not care about anything but aviation. This is not super difficult, but it requires dedication and will like few other human endeavors, and you can never slack off on your strive for perfection. You have to work really hard at it all the time. If you don't the penalty is death.

Aviation is unfailingly brutal to those who fail to show full respect, it is heartless in its punishment of misjudgement.

Read this thread for a true picture of how this all works.
 
I don't really have anything to add to whats already been said, but, I would say, take a good hard look at how you've been approaching your flight training. Is it for your own reasons? Are you really just a slow learner, or do you not study much on your own/have too much going on to dedicate time to it?
 
Henning said:
Alright, nobody else is saying it, so I will be the one again.
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In my opinion, and my opinion counts, you blew it by making that post public. You should have sent those comments privately.

Here's why I say you blew it: statistically almost 1/4 of those who take the practical exam fail it on the first try (I posted that fact in another thread, several weeks back, yet no one picked up on those grim statistics.) Yet most who fail never make that fact known (for reasons that should now be obvious.) But little is to be learned from posts that say "Hey everybody, I passed my check ride!"

Why do 23% of applicants fail a test whose scheduling they have 100% control over? The only way to know that is via data - and publicly beating up on the data sources doesn't bode well for more data.

Lastly, to call the expenditure of 150 hours of training a lack of commitment is so self-referentially contradictory that I don't know how you managed it with a straight face. Maybe the word "commitment" means something different to you?
 
Okay, so Henning got a little ambitious. I agree Jim with your idea of sensitivity toward the OP's post in effort to find out WHY she failed, however sometimes we need to make a point. Additionally, there are others reading our words that we never hear from and they are learning too. I stand by my original assertion that it was ADM.

My DPE gave me a lecture about his limits as a DPE. He said that although it is human to prejudge, he cannot ACT on the prejudgement. I had enough sense to know that many people will try to flim-flam their way through the cracks in the system, but this DPE was no crack and I better bring my A-game, which is why after a 6.5 hr oral greuling I told him that were scrubbing due to weather (although I was confident I could handle the winds and they went calm 1hr after I decided no-go). I had a lot of self induced pressure to get my ticket, but it wasnt to be that day.

After the ride 2 weeks later, he congratulated me on the no go and told me the story of a guy he had to fail and how sorry he was.

DPE's know. I suspect yours was looking for a justification for the failure after he recognized the poor choice and was probably hoping you'd recognize the error before he said something.
 
Jim Logajan said:
In my opinion, and my opinion counts, you blew it by making that post public. You should have sent those comments privately.

Here's why I say you blew it: statistically almost 1/4 of those who take the practical exam fail it on the first try (I posted that fact in another thread, several weeks back, yet no one picked up on those grim statistics.) Yet most who fail never make that fact known (for reasons that should now be obvious.) But little is to be learned from posts that say "Hey everybody, I passed my check ride!"

Why do 23% of applicants fail a test whose scheduling they have 100% control over? The only way to know that is via data - and publicly beating up on the data sources doesn't bode well for more data.

Lastly, to call the expenditure of 150 hours of training a lack of commitment is so self-referentially contradictory that I don't know how you managed it with a straight face. Maybe the word "commitment" means something different to you?
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Spending 150 hrs flying around not learning is not 'commitment", it is "killing time". Most people who fail beat themselves up, not say "oh well, I have to learn how to trim" which is something they should have figured out pretty much 135 hours ago. When your instructor warns you "You are not ready for this flight" and you determine you should go anyway because "What's the worst that can happen" shows a serious flaw in ADM. That's the kind of thinking that kills people every week. As is, the OP is a future statistic in the NTSB database. Even addressed in a public forum she is trying to sweep reality under the rug by entreating for a closure to this thread with reassurances (mostly to herself) that "she is a safe pilot" when she is clearly not, her CFI said so, the DE said so but she knows better than both of them. A PM would be simply ignored and wished away. There are also other students lurking reading this thread and without anyone saying anything but positive reinforcement of her poor ADM and performance, they may believe that what is going on here is "Ok" and to some acceptable standard. This is not acceptable, so once again I take the roll of the evil oger stomping on someones dream, and I'm ok with that, at least my conscience is clean.
 
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Henning said:
Alright, nobody else is saying it, so I will be the one again.

Look, if you have 150 hours and just failed your PP ride, you need to do some serious re-evaluating of both your capabilities and commitment towards aviation. 150 hrs and you don't know how to trim??? This is UNACCEPTABLE LEARNING FROM YOU!!! Learning is YOUR responsibility, and you are waaayyyy behind the power curve. At 150hrs, this is no longer your instructors fault, this is your fault. At 150 hrs you should have been able to train yourself. This is about your commitment, or lack there of, or you lack of ability. The latter is nothing against you, we're all different and some people just aren't meant to be pilots. This isn't Hollywood where "will can over come all odds". Will has nothing to do with it, it's ability, commitment and effort, and when you are failing a PP checkride you are lack either one or both of them and from the sounds of things, you aren't into putting forth effort, even your thinking is lazy. It's time you do the proverbial "sh-t or get off the pot." From the mental standpoint of being PIC, you need to start from scratch because continuing with your attitude will have you in a grave in 3 years.

Aviation is serious business and there is nothing you don't need to know, and you aren't exhibiting signs of learning fast enough to keep you alive.

You need to change your attitude and approach towards aviation or you will die and take whatever passengers you have with you.
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100% Wrong.

I took my checkride with north of 100 hours myself (IIRC), and I'm glad no one gave up on me. Everyone can fly, some just take a bit longer to get the finer points.
 
Due to some rather inflammatory remarks made by a few individuals, it has been decided to close this thread. Some of the content is unbecoming of the image we are supposed to be fostering here. We should do our best to build people up when they are down, not do our best to tear them down.

Greg Bockelman
Management Council
Pilots of America
 
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