FAA Based Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

jshawley

jshawley

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Nov 26, 2005
Messages
470
Location
Bolivar, MO
Display Name
Display name:
Jim Shawley
"The City of Bolivar will be conducting hangar inspections at the Bolivar Municipal airport on Friday, September 3rd, 2010. The Fire Chief, Police Chief and I will be performing the inspections. The scope of the inspections will be to comply with the FAA National Based Aircraft Inventory Program, a basic fire and safety inspection, lease compliance, passage and bi-fold door inspection and interior wall and structure inspection.

"Prior to the day of inspection, I will be checking the access to the hangars with our master key system for each hangar. Any locks that have been modified to deny the use of the master key will be rekeyed as it was originally installed prior to the date of inspection.

"Due to the number of hangars to inspect and potential emergency calls that may demand the attention of the fire and police chief, [sic] scheduling of inspections with individual owners is impractical. If you are at the airport on the morning of inspections and would like us to perform our inspection of your hangar while you are there, please let us know and we will do our best to make that happen.

"If you have any questions please do not hesitate to contact me. I appreciate your cooperation in regard to what will be a yearly inspection.

"Sincerely,

"XXXXXXXXXXXX
"City Administrator

"Cc: Mayor YYYYYYY
"City Clerk"

So, how many of youse guys have had to tolerate this kind of "inspection?" I've just gone out and locked the door of my plane; no petroleum-based fluids, save for 100LL in the tanks, and 15W-50 in the oil sump are present. All tools have been removed. Aviation-related literature/periodicals are still present, and the trash in the metal trash can is more than one day old. Some of these are potential violations per the city's draft of their new "Rules and Regulations."

I learned just a few minutes ago that yet another person has chosen to move his plane to SGF, where the hangar lease is nearly twice what M17's is. Our city's leadership has decided that they can make money at an airport that's all but deserted. 20 of our 54 hangars are already empty, when in the recent past there was a short waiting list.

The politics here has become onerous, and before the city's done, M17 will be the safest touch-and-go field around--there will be nobody in the pattern. I'm leaving much unsaid, as it would fill a book.

What say you? Inspections of your hangars is the norm, or not?
 
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Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

jshawley said:
...

What say you? Inspections of your hangars is the norm, or not?
Click to expand...

With the rent north of $600/month here at KBED, forget the inspections,
I'd want them to sweep out the hangar and wash the airplane.

:mad:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Wow, Bob, you can rent a nice little house here in Bolivar for those kinds of bucks!!

Nope, they won't be washing the plane or anything; I suspect they'll be trying to violate anyone who is not in "compliance"

Sigh. They are really trying a lot of people's patience...
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Just about everything in America that local and state governments can declare to be a "privlege" has turned into a shakedown racket in recent years.

I was talking to a woman today who was a former cashier at the Santa Barbara Superior court. She said that the court office pulls in over $300,000 dollars a day in criminal fines, just for the city of Santa Barbara alone!!

Of course most of that money goes to Sacramento... :rolleyes2: :incazzato:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Leave a tray of brownies for them, then complain about the theft of your property.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

I can pretty much sit at my desk and do the based aircraft inventory. I try to remember to update it each year but no one is bugging me to do it. The hangar inspection isn't related to it or required to do it. I know what airplane is in each hangar.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

kkoran said:
http://www.basedaircraft.com/public/FrequentlyAskedQuestions.aspx
Click to expand...

So I went and read this. This Q & A sort of says it all:

"5. Doesn't the FAA already have N-Numbers and their owners in their database of registered aircraft?

The FAA’s database of registered aircraft does contain N-Numbers and the owner’s name; however, that database does not contain a field called “Based Airport” – thus the purpose of this survey initiated by the FAA."

Since nothing {yet} calls for a "lockdown" of the airport, aircraft "out-of-area" will not be counted. Since the FAA is going to require re-registration, why not simply add a "based" field? It is interesting that this whole mess was developed by a contractor that probably made big bucks for this drill.

... just think, this is the kind of genius that is going to be taking care of your health in just a "lil bit":hairraise:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

In theory, each hangar on our airport must have a safety inspection each year to ensure the contents are in compliance with local fire regs (materials properly stored, fire extinguishers, etc). And, on the FAA website is this notice (my emphasis):

"Airport Certification Information Bulletin 2009-08

During periodic safety inspections, your FAA Airport Certification Safety Inspector (ACSI) or State Aeronautical Inspector will be updating and verifying information on the Airport Master Record (5010). If your airport is a Primary NPIAS airport there will be no change, however the nonprimary NPIAS airports will be required to submit an N-Number in www.basedaircraft.com for every single engine, multi-engine, jet or helicopter based aircraft being claimed at the airport. If any of these counts need to be updated then the Airport Manager (or designated representative) should log into www.basedaircraft.com website and edit as needed. To that end, single engine, multi-engine, jet and helicopter based aircraft fields can no longer be changed by your ACSI or State Aviation Inspector. It is important to note that BasedAircraft.com is not directly connected to the main FAA airports database and therefore a change in this database does not automatically get sent to the FAA. As soon as the airport has updated this information, please contact your respective FAA or State Aviation inspector to finalize submittal of the changes. An aircraft entered in BasedAircraft.com is only verified and counted as based aircraft if it is found in the FAA Aircraft Registration Database, and not duplicated at any airport. If your airport has not received a user name and password and/or have any questions or echnical difficulties, please contact BasedAircraftSupport@BasedAircraft.com or (504) 304-0749."
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Pretty much every airport does fire safety inspections of the hangars periodically, and that's usually a requirement of local laws and spelled out in the lease agreement you signed. Ditto the routine mechanical/structural inspections. Other than looking to see what airplanes are in their hangars for that FAA inventory thing, it's all pretty straightforward and typical. I would also point out that knowing how many airplanes are actually based at the airport helps the airport obtain funding for improvements, so cooperation on that score is to everyone's advantage (unless you bugger the numbers by moving your plane off the field so it isn't counted).

Also, it sounds like allowing the airport master key to open your hangar is a lease requirement, so if you've rekeyed the lock so it won't, you're in violation of the terms of your lease and they might have the right to boot you out if you don't let them rekey it back to master key compatibility. How long is the waiting list for hangars at your airport?
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Ron Levy said:
How long is the waiting list for hangars at your airport?
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Probably pretty short, if there are 20 empty hangars.:wink2:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

murphey said:
In theory, each hangar on our airport must have a safety inspection each year to ensure the contents are in compliance with local fire regs (materials properly stored, fire extinguishers, etc).
Click to expand...

My hangar has an airport supplied fire extinguisher inside that has been recently inspected.

I can't have upholstered, wooden or plastic furniture...

http://www.grosseileairport.com/safreqmt.htm

It remains to be seen if they will notice / complain about some of the stuff I have in there now...
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

chucky said:
Probably pretty short, if there are 20 empty hangars.:wink2:
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Then you may have some leverage with the airport management, but that doesn't help Jim out there in Bolivar.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

jshawley said:
20 of our 54 hangars are already empty, when in the recent past there was a short waiting list.
Click to expand...
Missed that part. FWIW, our airport offers the option of either providing a key to them or making yourself available to open the hangar when needed for maintenance or inspection -- most choose the former out of convenience. Also, if I were in charge out there, I'd be trying to find out why 25 people (20 empty hangars plus the waiting list) chose to go elsewhere, and if I were on the airport commission, I'd be pressuring the manager to find out.

But I still don't think the city is likely to back off on the annual safety inspections -- too much at risk for them.
 
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Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Drive em away, show the airport usage is down, sell to a developer. That's probably the plan.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

EdFred said:
Drive em away, show the airport usage is down, sell to a developer. That's probably the plan.
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It could be, but I don't see annual safety inspections being evidence of such a plan.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

seems the problem with this particular airport may be the way they are "selling" the local pilots on the inspection, not the inspection itself.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Ron Levy said:
It could be, but I don't see annual safety inspections being evidence of such a plan.
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If the "safety inspection" is just a cover to make people not have anything in their hangar (no chairs, no tools, no cases of oil, etc...) except a plane, it's an easy way to drive people away.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

EdFred said:
If the "safety inspection" is just a cover to make people not have anything in their hangar (no chairs, no tools, no cases of oil, etc...) except a plane, it's an easy way to drive people away.
Click to expand...
Fire marshalls usually have pretty clear guidelines about what's allowed and what's not, and those aren't locally generated (NFPA, etc). If being forced to play by those rules is enough to "drive people away," I'd just as soon not have those folks in the adjoining T-hangar. OTOH, if the fire marshall is writing up stuff not covered by those safety rules, then the folks have a legitimate complaint to take to the airport manager or airport commission, but nothing Jim's posted suggests that's what's happening.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

One part of the hangar lease agreement at KBED that I did like was the
requirement that anything stored in the hangar had to be necessary
for the operation or maintanance of the aircraft. Thus, having a case
of oil, or some gas for the tug was perfectly acceptable, as were tools
and parts.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Bob Noel said:
One part of the hangar lease agreement at KBED that I did like was the
requirement that anything stored in the hangar had to be necessary
for the operation or maintanance of the aircraft. Thus, having a case
of oil, or some gas for the tug was perfectly acceptable, as were tools
and parts.
Click to expand...

But having a computer for flight planning would not be allowed. Nor would a chair, or a coffee maker, or microwave...
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

EdFred said:
But having a computer for flight planning would not be allowed. Nor would a chair, or a coffee maker, or microwave...
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All depends how you define the need to support your flying operations...some folks really need that cup of coffee to be fit to fly.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Ron Levy said:
All depends how you define the need to support your flying operations...some folks really need that cup of coffee to be fit to fly.
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Like you've always said Ron, it doesn't matter what WE think, it matters what THEY think. They being the FAA, Airport Authority, etc...
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

EdFred said:
Like you've always said Ron, it doesn't matter what WE think, it matters what THEY think. They being the FAA, Airport Authority, etc...
Click to expand...
When "they" make you remove the computer you use to do preflight weather/planning, let me know.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

EdFred said:
But having a computer for flight planning would not be allowed. Nor would a chair, or a coffee maker, or microwave...
Click to expand...

Sure it would, after all, service manuals are stored on the computer,
right?

The coffee maker, microwave, and refrig are all necessary bribes
for the A&P and IA.

Of course, the hangars only have a single circuit in them for
the overhead lights and outlets (not including the electric door
opener).
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Back online now. Some of the back story is, morale is quite low here. Used to be a waiting list, but many have chosen to go to fields where rent is much higher. Our local pilots' club used to meet on the field; we used to give rides for $__.__ to raise monies for our private pilot scholarship, of which we have had several recipients. We used to have many type clubs and specialty clubs come to our little cafe for fly-in meetings. People came here! Now they leave here.

We used to be thriving! Now we're just waiting for the extra land to be bought in order to expand to 5,000ft, so corporate aircraft can and will land here. "If you'll build it, they will come," or some such thing. Meanwhile people who were the engines who powered this airport for over a decade are now persona non grata, and the overwhelming sense is that the powers that be are not yet prepared to face some realities, nor act on them in a way that will save our airport.

Sigh.

Well, thanks for the data points. I think much of this is personality-driven, and that makes for poor morale amongst the natives.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Around here most (all?) of the airports are locally owned (counties, mostly).

One airport nearby has Very Visually Stunning ridge to the east. It also has more antique cars and stored goods than airplanes.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

I wonder if beer in the refrigerator would be considered contraband?
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Ron Levy said:
Fire marshalls usually have pretty clear guidelines about what's allowed and what's not, and those aren't locally generated (NFPA, etc). If being forced to play by those rules is enough to "drive people away," I'd just as soon not have those folks in the adjoining T-hangar. OTOH, if the fire marshall is writing up stuff not covered by those safety rules, then the folks have a legitimate complaint to take to the airport manager or airport commission, but nothing Jim's posted suggests that's what's happening.
Click to expand...

Unknown to the airport commission or local pilots, the city fathers passed an ruling and defined "aircraft hanger as an area to store and maintain aircraft to include welding." Then the fire capt wrote up every hanger leasee for not having a welding permit with appropriate fine even though there was no welding equipment in the hanger.

They did not write up the county management that oversees the airport and leases the hangers.

Everything was quickly squashed when the County District Attorney got wind of it and told the city fathers they overstepped their authority. :goofy:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

dmccormack said:
Around here most (all?) of the airports are locally owned (counties, mostly).

One airport nearby has Very Visually Stunning ridge to the east. It also has more antique cars and stored goods than airplanes.
Click to expand...

If it is county owned and managed, they can lose their federal funding.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

It is obvious that you are considering your civic leaders as being public servants, and are now surprised that they can perform compliance inspections at their convenience. You should feel lucky, that you were not ordered to be standing at parade rest in front of your hanger for whenever they decided to arrive.

We give them power at the polls. With each election, they gain more power over us. It seems to be what "the people" want.

Airplane owners are a minority at the polls, therefore we are considered fair game for public revenue enhancement schemes. Rich airplane owners, an easy target.

John
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

City of Houston's Ellington field has a years long waiting list.. slightly above market prices.. and has restrictions just as comprehensive as what has been mentioned already.

They inspect annually and for cause. There is a wash pad. Flammables must be in a flammables cabinet. No fuel storage outside of the aircraft. No addons attached to the structure - in the event of a fire everything can be pulled/dragged out. Insurance required. Its a superior field in my mind - tower, 747 capable runways. ILS. Better CFR than the nearby international airports because of the based ANG and NASA assets.. Its all about supply, demand and convenience.
 
Bolivar has a screwy manager; fuel wsales went down so he raised the price. The restaurant, the big draw for that airport, closed. They won't even let the girl who runs the restaurant sell anything because "it costs too much to light the grill." So while we would like to buy something to eat if it were available,and fill up our plane, now we won't do either.

But, the paranoia about the hanger inspection is silly. There are hangers at some airports who are filled with non aircraft related crap, while legitimate airplane people need hanger space. At one airport there is a car wash using a hanger as a warehouse.

Even if Bolivar has run off most of the local pilots, they still have paperwork to fill out. Our airport manager knows how many planes are on the field and what we have in our hangers. I wish they'd inspect the hangers because then they might fix something...
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

somorris said:
I wonder if beer in the refrigerator would be considered contraband?
Click to expand...

It would here.. no booze on county property. County owns the airports.
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Ron Levy said:
All depends how you define the need to support your flying operations...some folks really need that cup of coffee to be fit to fly.
Click to expand...

I guess they would frown on my beer fridge :goofy:
 
Re: FAA Baed Aircraft Inventory Requirement...

Baron2PG said:
I guess they would frown on my beer fridge :goofy:
Click to expand...

That beer is for the A&P after completing work on your aircraft.
 
Jim, Move your plane to Stockton, the hangar the city booted me out of is still open.
 
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