denverpilot
Tied Down
T’is true, t’is true.
Eliminating circling approaches... or not...
- Thread starter denverpilot
- Start date
T’is true, t’is true.
azure
Final Approach
Yeah, a 20 kt tailwind is above the "modest" range for me. I would CTL in that case as well. But anything below 10 kts, I'm landing straight in, unless I break out at pattern altitude and can stay there without risking going IMC again.
Plano Pilot
Line Up and Wait
Just talked to a friend based at Arlington, TX GKY. The only approaches they have are to the north.
DGlaeser
Pre-takeoff checklist
The paved runway at my home base - 57D - is only 2500 ft long. The only approach (GPS) is lined up with runway 09, but only circling minimums are given. Not sure why, obviously some criteria is not met ??
mtuomi
En-Route
I've done a few to actual circling minimums. Only easy ones though, last one I did was KUUU RNAV 16 circle to 4 at OVC008 2SM weather.
Our sim favorite is KICT VOR 14 circle to 1R. I wish I'll never have to do that in real life.
Our sim favorite is KICT VOR 14 circle to 1R. I wish I'll never have to do that in real life.
azure
Final Approach
I wonder which one. It is in fact a RNAV (GPS)-A approach. Another such approach is the RNAV (GPS)-B to 18 @ 1D2, well aligned with 18, yet circling only. I wonder if it could be the shortness of the runway?
We get circling approaches at PAO (Palo Alto) whenever the wind is favoring Rwy 13. Both of the published approaches are for Rwy 31, because a Rwy 13 approach would conflict with SFO traffic.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
If the MDA has to be high enough because of obstructions that it would be a real steep approach to go straight in they won’t publish straight in minimums. There are a lot of approaches like that. You can still land straight in if you want to. I think the length of the Runway can be a factor.
Tantalum
Final Approach
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San_Diego_Pilot
A handful.. there's no ILS at SEE and the LOC D is too high to actually make it at the VDP so that almost always becomes a circle to land. More often than not I am on the rnav 17 though however on IMC days SEE tends to be quiet enough that you can land on 17 without circling to 27L
Everskyward
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Everskyward
True, I forgot about that. I'll up my circling number to at least 100.
Kritchlow
Final Approach
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Kritchlow
Many moons ago Teterboro (KTEB) in Jersey used to constantly use the VOR/DME A, circle overhead to land 24. They used this even in good weather, but not due to lack of a 24 approach. Rather the seperation of aircraft from the nearby large airports. Probably did that one approach nearly 1000 times.So anyway... circling approaches...
How many have you done in real world conditions...?
flyingcheesehead
Touchdown! Greaser!
I'm pretty sure I've done a circling approach after training, but I can't remember where right off the bat.
But, it's been a long time. I don't think I've flown a non-IFR-GPS-equipped airplane IFR in a decade. Now that I have the GTN 750, I'm tending to go with LPV approaches over ILS approaches even. With the number of straight-in GPS approaches out there, I think the circumstances where I would ever fly a circling approach again are already exceedingly rare.
That said, it seems like there might be places where high MDA/steep descent would still preclude anything but a circling approach, so it's hard to imagine that they would go away entirely, and if they can't go away entirely that means you need to have one every 50-100 miles or so for training purposes...
But, it's been a long time. I don't think I've flown a non-IFR-GPS-equipped airplane IFR in a decade. Now that I have the GTN 750, I'm tending to go with LPV approaches over ILS approaches even. With the number of straight-in GPS approaches out there, I think the circumstances where I would ever fly a circling approach again are already exceedingly rare.
That said, it seems like there might be places where high MDA/steep descent would still preclude anything but a circling approach, so it's hard to imagine that they would go away entirely, and if they can't go away entirely that means you need to have one every 50-100 miles or so for training purposes...
Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
I suppose out of several million civil servants you might find a dozen who would admit that.
Ryan F.
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Ryan Ferguson 1974
Circling approaches: many, many times, usually for work, but also in little airplanes. The circling approaches which matter aren't going away. This is just removing what mostly amounts to fluff in the databases and reducing the burden to flight check a bunch of mostly unused approaches. NDBs have been going away, VORs are being reduced, and you need an IFR GPS these days in the NAS. That's just the way it is. Inexpensive, minimally compliant /G solutions exists even for the cheapest operators out there, so I don't much buy the argument that we need to keep servicing users who don't have that equipment. It's time.
Back to circling: obviously there's TEB but don't forget about PDK which has an ILS for 21L which often must be flown to a circle when the winds are out of the north and the weather is low (which seems to be frequent in Atlanta.) I've done that one many times, and always feel the subconscious urge to keep my circle tight on account of the tower farm south of the airport.
PDK has the "best" solution to the problem in the form of RNP AR serving RWY 3R but of course that's not going to help us piston folk. In fact out of the two types I fly only one (Gulfstream) has this capability and the other (Challenger) does not, and more often than not we fly the Challenger to PDK... so I'm still circling.
Of course ASE features circling minimums only but that's just because of the descent gradient. It's not really a "circling" approach in that you need to get down low beneath the clouds and maneuver close to the ground.
The "real" circle, even though it's not technically a circling approach, is the visual to 33 at ASE. I've only done that twice, once in a Hawker and once in a Challenger. Only pilots who really know the lay of the land as well as their aircraft's limitations should attempt that, and you'd better not have a tailwind component on the "base" leg or you'll get pushed into the hill. It's really fun, though.
Back to circling: obviously there's TEB but don't forget about PDK which has an ILS for 21L which often must be flown to a circle when the winds are out of the north and the weather is low (which seems to be frequent in Atlanta.) I've done that one many times, and always feel the subconscious urge to keep my circle tight on account of the tower farm south of the airport.
PDK has the "best" solution to the problem in the form of RNP AR serving RWY 3R but of course that's not going to help us piston folk. In fact out of the two types I fly only one (Gulfstream) has this capability and the other (Challenger) does not, and more often than not we fly the Challenger to PDK... so I'm still circling.
Of course ASE features circling minimums only but that's just because of the descent gradient. It's not really a "circling" approach in that you need to get down low beneath the clouds and maneuver close to the ground.
The "real" circle, even though it's not technically a circling approach, is the visual to 33 at ASE. I've only done that twice, once in a Hawker and once in a Challenger. Only pilots who really know the lay of the land as well as their aircraft's limitations should attempt that, and you'd better not have a tailwind component on the "base" leg or you'll get pushed into the hill. It's really fun, though.