Don't be in such a hurry!

[flyingcheesehead]

Right on, Spike!

Back in school I remember talking with my CivE buddies, who told me there had been studies done showing the brake-light domino effect lasting several hours and over 100 miles!

WRT drive right, pass left... Ya know why trucks are always in the middle lane when there's at least 3 in each direction? Because nobody pays any attention to our turn signals (DON'T JUST STARE AT ALL THE PRETTY COLORED BLINKING LIGHTS, DO YOU THINK I'M JUST KIDDING???is usually what I'm screaming) and people on on-ramps think it's our job to move over and let them on. We've all had one too many instances where there's some space cadet to our left completely oblivious to our signal when we try to be courteous and move over for someone on the on-ramp and we end up with a ****ed off car on the left ("can't that @$$hole truck driver see me sitting here? HOOONK!) and another one on the right ("can't that jerk in the truck see that I'm trying to get on here? BEEEP!). So, we just ride in the middle and let y'all fight it out amongst yourselves.

So:

1. My turn signal means: "I'd like to move over please. Yes, now. Please get out of my way. NOW!" (maybe two blinks per sentence. ) I'm not asking you to slow down. I'm askiing you to make room. Speeding up or moving over a lane is fine. My signal is also a warning: If you've been next to me for a while, especially in one of my numerous large blind spots, I MAY NOT SEE YOU OR KNOW YOU'RE THERE. In that case, the pretty blinking lights mean WARNING! I'M COMIN' OVER!!! So do NOT ignore them.

2. When you're on an on ramp, TRAFFIC ON THE HIGHWAY HAS THE RIGHT OF WAY, REGARDLESS OF THE PRESENCE OR ABSENCE OF A YIELD SIGN. I'll do what I can to let you in, but it is YOUR job to fit into the flow of traffic. Also, one of the worst things I see in this situation is the person who hasn't looked at all, gets almost onto the highway, has room to get in front of me and is already going faster than me, then finally takes a last-instant glance in the mirror and goes "OH $#!+ A TRUCK!" and slams on their brakes. Pick your spot and GO!

And now I have to go. Student's first time driving in Chi(t)cago.

Signed,

Half-million-plus mile CDL-ABCD-PNHT driver trainer
AKA zero-AGL 12,000 hour ATP/CFII.

 

[jshawley]

I love driving in the snow. Back in winter '78 on the way down to Sandieggo from Bremerton, WA, we were north of LA heading on what's called, IIRC, the "Grapevine". A winter storm had blown in, and as we were climbing up the mountain you could see all the Volvos, BMWs, Mercs, &C off the highway where they had spun out; meanwhile, I just chug up steady state, my '75 Dart 4-door loaded down with wife and three months' worth of stuff.

Smooth is the word. Even if going fast.

 

[SCCutler]

LOL@Kent.

You should see the glares I get from people behind me when I ease up to let a signaling big-rig over for a pass. I used to do that frequently, now (yes, because of you, Kent), I always do.

 

[Ghery]

I love it when someone sees my turn signal and speeds up to cut me off. Does't work. My Jeep will beat your recycled Japanese beer can any day of the week. I'm telling you what I'm going to do, not asking your permission.

Keep up the good work, Kent.

 

[drafttek]

My Jeep will beat your recycled Japanese beer can any day of the week.

Apparently we don't drive the same type of Jeep!

 

[Obi Heed Kenobi]

LOL@Kent.

You should see the glares I get from people behind me when I ease up to let a signaling big-rig over for a pass. I used to do that frequently, now (yes, because of you, Kent), I always do.

I always try to do that, too. I know firsthand what a pain it can be driving a tractor-trailer and not being able to get a break. And, quite frankly, it makes me happy to see the people behind me getting mad.

The same goes for tailgaters. If I'm passing someone in the left lane, and somebody starts tailgating me, I'll block him in for miles (until traffic starts to back up - the people behind didn't do anything to deserve it). And maybe I'll see a nail in the road that I need to brake for. Nobody likes a tailgater.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

I love it when someone sees my turn signal and speeds up to cut me off. Does't work. My Jeep will beat your recycled Japanese beer can any day of the week. I'm telling you what I'm going to do, not asking your permission.

Keep up the good work, Kent.

Thanks Ghery.

Hate to burst your bubble, but your logic won't work with those folks... They try to pull the same crap on me, often when my tractor is already partway into their lane and my trailer's coming over whether I want it to or not.

 

[KennyFlys]

I'm all for truckers needing to pull around slower traffic. The action that gripes me is by some of these local haul trucks (aggregate, trash, etc) and occasionally other semis. They are headed up a hill and at the last minute pull out into the left lane and there's someone right up on their tail already in the left lane, effectively cutting off the vehicle already set to pass both vehicles in the right lane. Or, they pull into the left lane with no prayer for enough power to pull forward and they end up blocking the left lane traffic.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

I'm all for truckers needing to pull around slower traffic. The action that gripes me is by some of these local haul trucks (aggregate, trash, etc) and occasionally other semis. They are headed up a hill and at the last minute pull out into the left lane and there's someone right up on their tail already in the left lane, effectively cutting off the vehicle already set to pass both vehicles in the right lane. Or, they pull into the left lane with no prayer for enough power to pull forward and they end up blocking the left lane traffic.

If it's right at the top, I agree. If not, well, suck it up and wait. Please. With any significant amount of weight on board, we can't accelerate going uphill, and any momentum lost means we're stuck going 20 up the rest of the hill if we wait for you to pass. On the other hand, if you wait for us, you can accelerate up the hill just fine.

Most places with significant hills will add an extra lane and keep trucks out of the left lane, though...

 

[mikea]

I love driving in the snow. Back in winter '78 on the way down to Sandieggo from Bremerton, WA, we were north of LA heading on what's called, IIRC, the "Grapevine". A winter storm had blown in, and as we were climbing up the mountain you could see all the Volvos, BMWs, Mercs, &C off the highway where they had spun out; meanwhile, I just chug up steady state, my '75 Dart 4-door loaded down with wife and three months' worth of stuff.

Smooth is the word. Even if going fast.

Not only those but the Excy-Tundra-Mega-Jumbo-Baloomo-4-tonno really safe 40 foot long SUVs that pass you churning up salt spray going 65 will be found exactly one mile ahead in the ditch on the right with their headlights pointed up searching the sky like the Germans looking for B-17s...and I get to LAUGH!

 

[tonycondon]

yea mike one snowy night i was trudging along with everyone else down highway 30 in 2-3 inches of snow. a bronco goes screaming past. about 25 miles down the road we pass the bronco, as theyve crashed into some other car, cops are all over the place.

ha ha ha is what i thought

 

[mikea]

Right on, Spike!

Back in school I remember talking with my CivE buddies, who told me there had been studies done showing the brake-light domino effect lasting several hours and over 100 miles!

WRT drive right, pass left... Ya know why trucks are always in the middle lane when there's at least 3 in each direction? Because nobody pays any attention to our turn signals (DON'T JUST STARE AT ALL THE PRETTY COLORED BLINKING LIGHTS, DO YOU THINK I'M JUST KIDDING???is usually what I'm screaming) and people on on-ramps think it's our job to move over and let them on. We've all had one too many instances where there's some space cadet to our left completely oblivious to our signal when we try to be courteous and move over for someone on the on-ramp and we end up with a ****ed off car on the left ("can't that @$$hole truck driver see me sitting here? HOOONK!) and another one on the right ("can't that jerk in the truck see that I'm trying to get on here? BEEEP!). So, we just ride in the middle and let y'all fight it out amongst yourselves.

So:

1. My turn signal means: "I'd like to move over please. Yes, now. Please get out of my way. NOW!" (maybe two blinks per sentence. ) I'm not asking you to slow down. I'm askiing you to make room. Speeding up or moving over a lane is fine. My signal is also a warning: If you've been next to me for a while, especially in one of my numerous large blind spots, I MAY NOT SEE YOU OR KNOW YOU'RE THERE. In that case, the pretty blinking lights mean WARNING! I'M COMIN' OVER!!! So do NOT ignore them.

2. When you're on an on ramp, TRAFFIC ON THE HIGHWAY HAS THE RIGHT OF WAY, REGARDLESS OF THE PRESENCE OR ABSENCE OF A YIELD SIGN. I'll do what I can to let you in, but it is YOUR job to fit into the flow of traffic. Also, one of the worst things I see in this situation is the person who hasn't looked at all, gets almost onto the highway, has room to get in front of me and is already going faster than me, then finally takes a last-instant glance in the mirror and goes "OH $#!+ A TRUCK!" and slams on their brakes. Pick your spot and GO!

And now I have to go. Student's first time driving in Chi(t)cago.

Signed,

Half-million-plus mile CDL-ABCD-PNHT driver trainer
AKA zero-AGL 12,000 hour ATP/CFII.

K.

Today's rare trip to Chicago.

- Ohio ramp from the Kennedy express lanes. I note that most people are signaling and merging to get into the right lane to go down the Dan Ryan. The Ohio split is left and a short time after the right exit you see "Left Lane Closed ahead" because it comes down to a single lane to merge. The two lanes were empty and rolling fine so I take the right lane. The left lane is going to be no more. Of course, from a mile behind comes a Lexus SUV that pulls directly alongside me, drives at my speed for a half mile and is determined to make me stop so he can have my right lane. Guy had to go out of his way to cut off the only other vehicle within a 1/2 mile of him.

- Now we're down the Ohio overpass. I take the middle lane. At the river traffic is backed up a half mile from the light at Ontario. We stop and go for a few light changes until we're about 200 feet from Orleans. At this point one of Kent's brothers in the far right lane SIGNALS with the "get the hell out of my way" message and turns sharply left to bring the trailer over the roof of my car. I slam on my brakes, fall behind and escape into the left lane. Then HE DOES IT AGAIN! In other words he got within two truck lengths of the corner in the far right lane of a four lane ramp and decided to proceed with his left turn at the intersection right over the top of cars stacked up bumper-to-bumper.

- Coming home. I learned the rules of the road. If you make a ghetto left turn - where you tromp the gas when the signal changes and zip left across oncoming traffic - if you can't clear the intersection and the oncoming traffic dares to proceed, stop dead with your car blocking all oncoming lanes and lean on your horn! The traffic laws in every state say cars turning left have the right away and you should sure as hell let them know you have it. (It wasn't me first out. The guy in front of me had to slam brakes and I nearly rear ended him with everything in the car flying.)

- Some aftermarket genius sells a custom-fitted opaque black plastic cover that fits over the tail lights in your black Jeep Cherokee. Don't want that red to clash with your stealth-mobile decor.

Stop the planet. I want off.

 

[drafttek]

Not only those but the Excy-Tundra-Mega-Jumbo-Baloomo-4-tonno really safe 40 foot long SUVs that pass you churning up salt spray going 65 will be found exactly one mile ahead in the ditch on the right with their headlights pointed up searching the sky like the Germans looking for B-17s...and I get to LAUGH!

Yup, I see that every year with the first good snow. These idiots figure they have four wheel drive so they're immune to the snow. Sure a 4x4 will get up 'n go better in the snow but it won't stop any better than your grandma's '74 Impala.

 

[rottydaddy]

It never fails to amaze me: if you ask any given driver "Are you willing to kill- or die- to shave a few minutes off this trip?" They will all say "hell, no!"... yet this is how many people drive.

My philosphy: be assertive (safer than being overly cautious, like those dingbats who seem to think a YIELD sign means STOP), but not aggressive (like those dingbats who will shoot across two lanes so they can be first at a red light).

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Kent, you are 100% flat-out correct.

I see it all the time too - but folks are usually luckier than the ones in your story. What really infuriates me is seeing people fly into a right-on-red as if it were their birthright, while talking on the cellphone.

I almost removed one from the gene pool yesterday in Clearfield, UT. I was going down a street trailing most of the traffic as they were able to accelerate from the previous light faster than me. Approaching an intersection, white minivan comes from the right and flies around the corner without stopping. He had to put his foot down a bit to keep my grille out of his tailgate. Then, as I'm crossing in front of the right turn lane, a dark green minivan came flying out. I simultaneously swerved left and laid on the air horn. Had I not done so, she'd have gone right under my trailer and either been decapitated by the frame or crushed when the trailer tires hit her. As it was, I got most of a lane over and my air horn woke her up enough that she tightened her turn way up and went up on the curb.

According to my trainee who was riding at the time, she never once looked. That lady is very lucky I was the one driving at the time, as trainees and inexperienced drivers tend to panic and brake hard. That would have left her going under the trailer and getting decapitated. I did turn it into a teachable moment though: "That is why you always need to be checking your mirrors and staying aware of the traffic around you. I did not have any time to be checking my mirrors before swerving into the other lane, and had I not already known it was empty I may well have caused another accident trying to avoid the first one."

 

[tonycondon]

all this crash talking is making me think i oughtta finally re hang my rear view mirror...

 

[t0r0nad0]

Couple of things.

First, foremost: Slower traffic keep right.

Amen.

Try it yourselves. When you see brake lights ahead, don't just jump on the brakes- be ready to brake if needed, but just lift off of the gas. In most instances, you won't need the brakes, and you'll be able to proceed back on the gas (less than you would have needed had you actually braked) in a brief moment.

Part of me wonders why they never installed the flashing lights on cars for when you lift off the gas like you see on most city buses. Do they have those in most other cities? You know, on the back of the bus, whenever the driver lifts their foot off the gas, there are one or two yellow lights that flash to warn drives behind them that "I'm slowing now, though I'm not using the brakes." I wonder if that would be a good idea to have on cars or not? What do you all think? Would we just get the same problems where if someone sees the lights, they will automatically touch their brakes?

I also think that there should be more "type-specific" training or type-ratings for vehicles. Kind of like flying... you learn in something small and low-powered, then when you want to jump in that V8 Camaro you have to get further instruction and a "high-performance" endorsement. If you want to get a huge SUV, then you need a "large vehicle" endorsement. I know, it would never come to be in this country, but I definitely think that it would help to lower insurance rates.

Last thing - Kent, perhaps you could enlighten me on this...

When I see a semi signaling and I go to let them over, I typically will flash my brights (in the daytime) or flip my lights off and back on again (at night). Is that a pretty universal message that it's okay to come over? Are there times that I should or should not use that signal?

 

[mikea]

...
Last thing - Kent, perhaps you could enlighten me on this...

When I see a semi signaling and I go to let them over, I typically will flash my brights (in the daytime) or flip my lights off and back on again (at night). Is that a pretty universal message that it's okay to come over? Are there times that I should or should not use that signal?

Truckers use that as the "Go ahead. You're clear" signal. I've done that signal - from my car - on interstates. You usually get the trailer light flashing back as a thank you.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Part of me wonders why they never installed the flashing lights on cars for when you lift off the gas like you see on most city buses. Do they have those in most other cities? You know, on the back of the bus, whenever the driver lifts their foot off the gas, there are one or two yellow lights that flash to warn drives behind them that "I'm slowing now, though I'm not using the brakes." I wonder if that would be a good idea to have on cars or not? What do you all think? Would we just get the same problems where if someone sees the lights, they will automatically touch their brakes?

I've never seen those at all. Are you sure they're not just putting their flashers on when they make a stop?

I think people would just hit their brakes if everyone had those anyway.

There also exist 3rd brake lights that have various methods of indicating how hard the brakes are being applied. Studies have not yet shown an increase in safety from their use, though.

I also think that there should be more "type-specific" training or type-ratings for vehicles. Kind of like flying... you learn in something small and low-powered, then when you want to jump in that V8 Camaro you have to get further instruction and a "high-performance" endorsement. If you want to get a huge SUV, then you need a "large vehicle" endorsement. I know, it would never come to be in this country, but I definitely think that it would help to lower insurance rates.

Amen, brother!

I've wanted the large vehicle endorsement for a long time. My mother, an otherwise safe driver, is just not safe when driving a full-size van. In fact, I refuse to ride in the van if she's driving. She's had two accidents in it, and never an accident or ticket otherwise the rest of her life. Why? Because she drives it like a 4-banger riceburner instead of the beast that it is.

The extreme example: You can buy a 45-foot motor coach (like the newer Greyhounds) that normally requires a class B CDL, passenger endorsement, and "FedMed" (DOT medical) card to operate, which in turn requires training, testing, and at least age 21... But if you register it as a motor home and paint "not for hire" on the side, your 16-year-old who passed his driver's test this morning can drive it.

Last thing - Kent, perhaps you could enlighten me on this...

When I see a semi signaling and I go to let them over, I typically will flash my brights (in the daytime) or flip my lights off and back on again (at night). Is that a pretty universal message that it's okay to come over? Are there times that I should or should not use that signal?

Pretty much what Mike said. "Come on over."