Day/night currency

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RonP

Pre-takeoff checklist
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We had a raging debate this weekend regarding day and night currency amongst us non CFI’s.unfortunately no CFIs were around to settle the debate so I leave it up to the experts here. The debate is if one is out of currency and goes for a flight with his buddy that is a PIC. If the pilot that is out of currency does 3 takeoffs and landings is he now current? One half says a PIC is not a passenger and 3 landings is 3 landings. The other half states that the out of currency pilot was not acting as PIC and therefore the 3 does not count as currency. Which half is correct?
 
But I thought the non current pilot cannot act as PIC with a non-CFI passenger on board at night. So this scenario would not work. So the current pilot would have to hop out and non current pilot do three takeoff and landings to full stop to become current
 
NJP_MAN said:
3 landings are 3 landings
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:yeahthat:
Nothing in the regulation requires the person doing the landings to be PIC in order to count them for passenger currency.
benyflyguy said:
But I thought the non current pilot cannot act as PIC with a non-CFI passenger on board at night.
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Nothing about the current pilot allowing his "passenger" (the non-current pilot) to land the airplane morphs the passenger into "acting" as PIC. Are you thinking that, on an airline, when the FO does the landing , he suddenly becomes captain?
 
No where in 61.57 does it say the pilot must be acting PIC when making the requisite takeoffs and landings.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Are you thinking that, on an airline, when the FO does the landing , he suddenly becomes captain?
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You do realize that almost no airline pilots are legally current, as they’re never “sole manipulator of the flight controls”? :rolleyes:
 
kayoh190 said:
Is your Dad back flying? Are you gonna get to fly with him?
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He’s actually on the 75/76 now as of December. He got surgery back in October and is waiting to get his medical back. I’m sure I’ll run into him on a layover and make him buy me dinner lol.
 
RonP said:
We had a raging debate this weekend regarding day and night currency amongst us non CFI’s.unfortunately no CFIs were around to settle the debate so I leave it up to the experts here. The debate is if one is out of currency and goes for a flight with his buddy that is a PIC. If the pilot that is out of currency does 3 takeoffs and landings is he now current? One half says a PIC is not a passenger and 3 landings is 3 landings. The other half states that the out of currency pilot was not acting as PIC and therefore the 3 does not count as currency. Which half is correct?
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Just read what the regulations say, and don't add extra words or scenarios, and the answer is clear.

(b) Night takeoff and landing experience. (1) Except as provided in paragraph (e) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of an aircraft carrying passengers during the period beginning 1 hour after sunset and ending 1 hour before sunrise, unless within the preceding 90 days that person has made at least three takeoffs and three landings to a full stop during the period beginning 1 hour after sunset and ending 1 hour before sunrise, and—

(i) That person acted as sole manipulator of the flight controls; and

(ii) The required takeoffs and landings were performed in an aircraft of the same category, class, and type (if a type rating is required).
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Where does it say the person must be acting as PIC?
 
I once got night current in a sim session. The Sim instructor was a fellow company pilot (135) that I had flown with before. My job at the time allowed take offs no more than 30 minutes prior to sunrise and all landings must be before sunset. Could not maintain currency.

All requirements of the session complete. Norm moved me out 20 miles on one of the KIAH ILS's and set up "Night" with 200 & 1/4 mile WX and started me in. He promptly blew up one of my engines and set me on fire. Then selected No. 2 Hydraulics out. Had to blow down the wheels. next, he killed the AFCS. The next two "landings" were along those lines. If you can get an IPC in a sim, night currency is OK, but you have to be a masochist.
 
Maxnr said:
I once got night current in a sim session. The Sim instructor was a fellow company pilot (135) that I had flown with before. My job at the time allowed take offs no more than 30 minutes prior to sunrise and all landings must be before sunset. Could not maintain currency.

All requirements of the session complete. Norm moved me out 20 miles on one of the KIAH ILS's and set up "Night" with 200 & 1/4 mile WX and started me in. He promptly blew up one of my engines and set me on fire. Then selected No. 2 Hydraulics out. Had to blow down the wheels. next, he killed the AFCS. The next two "landings" were along those lines. If you can get an IPC in a sim, night currency is OK, but you have to be a masochist.
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That’s interesting. In the 121 world, there’s no such thing as night currency. We just have to do our 3 takeoffs and landings in 90 days. Doesn’t matter if they are day or night.
 
jordane93 said:
That’s interesting. In the 121 world, there’s no such thing as night currency. We just have to do our 3 takeoffs and landings in 90 days. Doesn’t matter if they are day or night.
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Interesting. Probably because 121's mostly use runways. Some 135's operate in what FAA calls a "Hostile environment." Don't always have runways. Further, Ops manual requires it.
 
Maxnr said:
Interesting. Probably because 121's mostly use runways. Some 135's operate in what FAA calls a "Hostile environment." Don't always have runways. Further, Ops manual requires it.
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More likely because 61.157(e) provides exceptions...
(2) This section does not apply to a pilot in command who is employed by a part 119 certificate holder authorized to conduct operations under part 121 when the pilot is engaged in a flight operation under part 91 or 121 for that certificate holder if the pilot in command complies with §§121.436 and 121.439 of this chapter.
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