Cutting a path for the Shuttle

Pi1otguy

Pi1otguy

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http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/19/uk-usa-space-shuttle-idUSLNE88I01I20120919
Reuters said:
Clearing an unobstructed route for the retired spaceship to take from Los Angeles International Airport to the California Science Center will require cutting down nearly 400 trees in all, and the temporary removal of hundreds of utility poles, street lights and traffic signals, officials say.
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So basically they are clear cutting a path through one of our poorer neighborhoods for this in addition to the traffic nightmare it'll cause. Did the other cities experience this when receiving their shuttles?
 
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Pi1otguy said:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/19/uk-usa-space-shuttle-idUSLNE88I01I20120919


So basically there they are clear cutting a path through one of our poorer neighborhoods for this in addition to the traffic nightmare it'll cause. Did the other cities experience this when receiving their shuttles?
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The California Science Center has provided for a generous compensation package, including 4:1 replacement of trees, several scholarships, and science training for teachers in the impacted areas. Sounds like a very reasonable compromise for such a long term benefit to the community (note that the California Science is very close to the impacted community).
 
why didn't they just trim the wings of the shuttle and then reattach them? These things are grounded for good - no one is going to be flying them ever again - whats it matter if they trim the wings and put them back on? Its Hollywood - someone could do it and you would NEVER KNOW it ever happened?
 
There is apparently an issue with the tiles getting obliterated. Those are historical artifacts. A tile that has been through reentry is not replaceable.

Hollywood is really good at making images, but not so good at making real objects.
 
I knew about the 4:1 replacement of trees except that we are talking about 30-40+ foot decades old trees being replaced by 10-14 foot trees.

Had no idea about the other items they included scholarships and such in the package. Obviously, I don't believe the CSC is attempting to screw people over. I'm just surprised that such a clear cutting effort is required to move the shuttle. Plus I'm still a bit weary of the new tree's ability to survive to maturity.
 
MAKG1 said:
There is apparently an issue with the tiles getting obliterated. Those are historical artifacts. A tile that has been through reentry is not replaceable.

Hollywood is really good at making images, but not so good at making real objects.
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Plus each tile will eventually be sponsored by someone (starting at $1000 for random lower tiles up to $25000 for your pick of leading edge tiles with custom message).
 
Very cool that it will be on display, upright, connected to the boosters and the fuel tank.
 
Pi1otguy said:
Did the other cities experience this when receiving their shuttles?
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No. Well, in Houston they had to move some stuff, but it was mostly on the grounds of the space center.

For the one in NY, they landed it at JFK, hauled it across the airport to a waiting barge, then towed it through the waterways to the carrier. Only hitting one bridge on the way.

For the one at Dulles, Udvar-Hazy has direct taxiway access to the airport. This is the only orbiter going someplace that doesn't have (almost) completely unobstructed access.

comanchepilot said:
why didn't they just trim the wings of the shuttle and then reattach them? These things are grounded for good - no one is going to be flying them ever again - whats it matter if they trim the wings and put them back on? Its Hollywood - someone could do it and you would NEVER KNOW it ever happened?
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That was one of the mandatory terms of donation for NASA. The orbiter had to make its entire trip, completely in tact. No disassembly allowed.
 
In New York, they put it on a barge from JFK to Intrepid.
 
comanchepilot said:
why didn't they just trim the wings of the shuttle and then reattach them? These things are grounded for good - no one is going to be flying them ever again - whats it matter if they trim the wings and put them back on? Its Hollywood - someone could do it and you would NEVER KNOW it ever happened?
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That's sort of what New York did with Enterprise, though it wasn't intentional.
 
Dave Theisen said:
Very cool that it will be on display, upright, connected to the boosters and the fuel tank.
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That may be one of the key reasons it got a shuttle (that and it was in a major metro area). Atlantis is going to stay at Kennedy displayed at an angle as in flight with the bay doors open. If you hit the space-flown shuttles you'll see three different orientations. The one at Udvar-Hazy is sitting on it's gear behind the SR-71 as Enterprise has since 2003.

Poor Enterprise gets all sorts of indignities dumped upon her. After being retired she was crammed into a dusty hangar with just about every other piece of junk NASM had to store (the shipping crates for the Gossamer Condor were above the wing and there was one of the Apollo capsules stuffed underneath.
Prior to the space hanger at UHC opening, NASM staff spent a lot of time with toothbrushes cleaning her up.

Now she's been slammed into a bridge and is sitting rather unceremoneously in a tent on the Intrepid deck awaiting funding and legal wrangling for her permanent display.

I was there for the swap at UHC. One problem is they found that the notch in the back hangar doors on the space hangar where the shuttle tail must pass had gotten welded together at some point in the construction. Other than that, it was a pretty smooth roll-in/roll-out. They did have to move some of the exhibits behind it out of the way and some of the satellites that would hanging from the ceiling that would have become giant wind chimes when they opened the door.

Yes, there's a taxiway (they actually call it a tow road, though a number of planes have taxied down under their own power) between the south end of taxiway J at Dulles and the museum. I've been down it a few times.

Trivia time: There has been only ONE aircraft that has moved into the Hazy center under it's own power....which was it?
 
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If Angelinos don't want the shuttle, there are a bunch of cities that would be happy to have one. We wouldn't even have to cut down any trees.
 
It's a funeral procession. Let the vehicle have it's last moments outdoors in peace. The 10 million hourly drivers that drive around like PO'd ants on an anthill that's been stepped on can wait a few hours.
 
Amen, Steingar!

When the were taking requests for the Shuttles, I was CERTAIN that one of them would be donated to the US Air Force Museum in Dayton, OH. After all, the Air Force was the shuttle's biggest customer, and the museum itself is first class. I was absolutley shocked when I the museum was not offered one of the shuttles.

Obviously, no cutting trees would have been required there. They could have flown it right in to the base. Heck, they've got a 12,600 ft runway there. The shuttle could almost have flown into there on it's own power!

Yeah, I know Dayton isn't Washington DC, Or New York, Or L.A., but it just makes me sick that the AF Museum didn't get one of the shuttles.
 
KRyan said:
Yeah, I know Dayton isn't Washington DC, Or New York, Or L.A., but it just makes me sick that the AF Museum didn't get one of the shuttles.
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Yeah right....what has Dayton ever contributed to aviation???? Oh yeah, there were these two bicycle mechanics....... :D

I can't get my mind around the decisions that went into the final disposition of the shuttle fleet.
 
steingar said:
If Angelinos don't want the shuttle, there are a bunch of cities that would be happy to have one. We wouldn't even have to cut down any trees.
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Personally.... I would have left one shuttle attached to the transporter 747 and had it make the rounds at every city / airshow / event / etc ,that wanted to host it.... That way more people could have viewed it and NASA would have had a better PR image to try and keep some decent funding.


As for the trees, especially in California, if a land developer had proposed to cut down hundreds of trees to pull off a deal I can assure you, he would have been tarred and feathered and hung up for buzzards to eat his gizzards.... Funny how the guv is immune to the same rules they force down our throats.:yesnod::eek:
 
N801BH said:
As for the trees, especially in California, if a land developer had proposed to cut down hundreds of trees to pull off a deal I can assure you, he would have been tarred and feathered and hung up for buzzards to eat his gizzards.... Funny how the guv is immune to the same rules they force down our throats.:yesnod::eek:
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I'd love to read how this got massaged in the environmental impact study and traffic survey I'm sure they must have done.
 
Pi1otguy said:
I'd love to read how this got massaged in the environmental impact study and traffic survey I'm sure they must have done.
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I'm sure the 4-1 ratio of new trees had a lot to do with it. As with most things, money talks. Not enough, how about a few scholarships....
 
Threefingeredjack said:
I can't get my mind around the decisions that went into the final disposition of the shuttle fleet.
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No bucks, no Buck Rigers, even in the death of the U.S. manned space program.

We now send up drones, UAV's, probes, whatever you want to call them so we can sit in the safety of some basement looking at a computer screen.
 
PilotAlan said:
Bill Kershner's 152.
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Nope. While Kernsher's plane was there, it was delivered relatively late to the museum, and after he died.

Bob Hoover taxied his Shrike into the building.
 
flyingron said:
Nope. While Kernsher's plane was there, it was delivered relatively late to the museum, and after he died.

Bob Hoover taxied his Shrike into the building.
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Ahh, gotcha. I was there the day after Bill Kersher's 152 flew in. It was just inside the doors on the far left end, cones around it. It did fly in to IAD, and taxied to the Museum under its own power, but not into the building.

VERY cool that Bob got to fly his plane in and taxi it into the building. If anyone deserves it, Mr. Hoover does.
 
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