Credit Card Rewards Programs

Cpt_Kirk

Cpt_Kirk

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Ted Striker
When I received my first credit card, I, like many others, was not responsible with it in any sense of the word. I stopped using them for years and after finally getting back into it, I find having multiple cards with various rewards programs being a small hobby of mine. My Quicksilver card is an unlimited 1.5% cash back card for anything and everything, soon to be replaced by the Citi Double Cash rewards card (essentially 2% back on everything with no limits). I just got my Discover it card in the mail which grants 5% cash back on rotating categories throughout the year up to $1,500 and then 1% on everything else with no limits.

I've only been doing this for a few months now and have finally convinced the wife to get into it as well. While a bit hesitant, one new card is in the mail for her. I've applied for cards with cash back rewards programs instead of ones with a points program. The cash back seems easier and more rewarding for someone like me, whereas I feel like a points program is similar to a kid spending $200 at an arcade and walking out with two pencils and an eraser.

Anyone else play around with this stuff? Any better cards out there? Tips? Tricks?

Sure, I'd like an AMEX Gold but I wouldn't benefit from the card as well as I would with the ones I already have.

Believe it or not, since I don't use my debit card anymore or even have an idea of what my monthly allowance would be, I've become more frugal and don't spend more than I would need for that month. My bank account just keeps going up...
 
I'd replace the Discover It card with a Chase Freedom card. They function a lot the same (5% on rotating categories, 1% everything else) except Chase Freedom is Visa and is accepted in a lot more places than Discover.

I also like Costco Citi Visa (4% gas, 3% travel, 3% restaurants, 2% Costco, 1% everything else) except it's really only worth it if you shop regularly at Costco.

I also pay most of my monthly utilities by credit card now for the 2% back.
 
asicer said:
I'd replace the Discover It card with a Chase Freedom card. They function a lot the same (5% on rotating categories, 1% everything else) except Chase Freedom is Visa and is accepted in a lot more places than Discover.

I also like Costco Citi Visa (4% gas, 3% travel, 3% restaurants, 2% Costco, 1% everything else) except it's really only worth it if you shop regularly at Costco.

I also pay most of my monthly utilities by credit card now for the 2% back.
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Good idea. I'll wait a couple of months on that one to let my credit scores rise mainly because of my limit/utilization has been in the 70%-90% range recently (personal + work expenses). With the four cards I have now, it should fall into the 20%-30% category.

We don't at the moment but that's always subject to change.

You don't get charged any fees for doing that? In that case, you can get I'm making the changes tonight.
 
Some of my utility bills charge a fee if you aren't on autopay and/or paperless billing. The rest don't charge a fee period.
 
If you travel (mostly commercially), AMEX platinum is hard to beat. Lots of free stuff like lounge passes, preferred status with car rentals and hotels, cash back, concierge ect,. $400 a year though. I utilize $400 worth of their perks, but it's hard to say if I'm getting my money's worth.
 
Depends on what the purchase is, but I've always thought, if I'm going to be spending the money, I might as well get some kind of interest or as they say 'rewards' in return. Of course it's mostly just a sales gimmick and the CC companies have their own tail in mind not the consumer.
 
We have the Citi Costco Visa. Previously Costco used AMEX and had their own card. We average around a $400 voucher each year. Our only other card is a GM Card.
 
I think we had a similar thread last year, but can't find it.

Same story, we were really really bad with credit cards in our youth. Now we use them to make ourselves money back on nearly everything and only get them if they are $0 annual fee or they pay back significantly above their fee.

Haven't run a balance in years. I don't even consider them for that purpose.

The best unintended deal was the old Costco Amex that's gone now, it gave 3% on fuel and it thought the self serve pump at the airport was auto fuel. Haha. Awesome.
 
AMEX platinum rewards are great, though I haven't compared in a long time. Great services if you travel, especially OCONUS, and they're hooked up with Amazon for "convenient" use of their rewards.
 
I racked up cash back on my Discover card since my training plane rental was billed as fuel. I cannot wait for the fuel to come back in the rotation.
 
I also have the capitalone quicksilver (GREAT for international travel) My alltime favorite is the fidelity rewards card. unlimited 2% cashback that can be put into a brokerage account (plane fund). My parents have the citi double card and are VERY unhappy with it and the customer service they received.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
I also have the capitalone quicksilver (GREAT for international travel) My alltime favorite is the fidelity rewards card. unlimited 2% cashback that can be put into a brokerage account (plane fund). My parents have the citi double card and are VERY unhappy with it and the customer service they received.
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That Citi card might bug people who aren't a little tech savvy. You have to log into their site monthly and click on crap to have them send the reward. The "Direct Deposit" feature is perennially "broken at this item" so my monthly routine is:

- Reminder in calendar to ding and tell me to do it.
- Clicky Clicky for free money. Usually on the same day I pay the airplane bill. Makes it feel better. Ha.
- Choose the paper check option.
- When check arrives, take photo of front and back to deposit to my Credit Union from my smartphone.
- And there was much rejoicing.

If you have them apply it as a credit to your account, technically since its 1% when you buy, and 1% when you pay, you lose a tiny fraction of a percent when you let them pay themselves. Plus I make them spend the money mailing me a dumbass old paper check in hopes they'll get all penny pincher and decide that doing that is costing them money and fixing the ACH direct deposit feature is in their own interest. Has to cost them a few pennies more than they make on the interest of holding that money for a few more days for the check delays.
 
asicer said:
I also like Costco Citi Visa (4% gas, 3% travel, 3% restaurants, 2% Costco, 1% everything else) except it's really only worth it if you shop regularly at Costco.
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I use both the Costco Citi visa and the AMEX Delta Skymiles Gold, depending on my goals, and I pass as many things through them as I can. I also keep one clean card, that never leaves my person, and is used sparingly in card readers that are known to be good. It's good to have a clean card in case something happens when travelling and you can't get your main card replaced in a timely fashion.
 
Its really worth $400 a year to play this game and be in debt?? Yeah, Yeah, I know: 'I pay it off every month, so I'm not in debt'....

Just not worth it to me.

Back to your regularly scheduled topic...
 
JCranford said:
Its really worth $400 a year to play this game and be in debt?? Yeah, Yeah, I know: 'I pay it off every month, so I'm not in debt'....

Just not worth it to me.

Back to your regularly scheduled topic...
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I use my credit card like a debit card. And I NEVER Carry a balance. They're also much safer than debit cards for the large amount of fraud protection you get. But credit cards are more important than the rewards they give(which are also nice) They help build credit which will help with things like getting a good rate on a mortgage or if you decide to get a loan for a car, plane etc a credit check will be run.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
I use my credit card like a debit card. And I NEVER Carry a balance. They're also much safer than debit cards for the large amount of fraud protection you get. But credit cards are more important than the rewards they give(which are also nice) They help build credit which will help with things like getting a good rate on a mortgage or if you decide to get a loan for a car, plane etc a credit check will be run.
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We're in the Dave Ramsey camp, but I see your point.

Here is my problem with debit cards: Risk. If you have fraud on a credit card, the risk is on the the credit card company, not on me. If my debit card number is stolen (and it has been), I have to wait for the bank to investigate and give me my money back, which, in my case, took 2 weeks. They did offer a temporary credit back to my account, but again, if they came down on the fraudster's side, I'm out the money.

However, we do have no consumer debt, working on 6 month emergency fund, and while in step 2 of the plan (pay off all your debts but the house), we continued to contribute to my 401(k), which, in the process, increased our net worth $150K over 2 years, rather than $70K, which paying off the credit card/student loan would have done. 1600 hours of overtime (over 2 years) paid off the debts.
 
JCranford said:
Its really worth $400 a year to play this game and be in debt?? Yeah, Yeah, I know: 'I pay it off every month, so I'm not in debt'....

Just not worth it to me.

Back to your regularly scheduled topic...
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After posting this thread, i spent a few hours watching Dave Ramsey's videos and his opinions regarding credit cards (as well as sifting through the comments)... and while I've successfully used his ideas for getting my other debts under control, i just cant seem to agree with him on these cards.

As i got through everything, it just seems this topic is one of those that can be argued until the end of time...
 
I have two credit cards with no foreign transaction fee; Barclaycard Arrival and Capital One World. This is convenient when one is compromised the first day of a three-week international trip...

I also like Chase Freedom. I have accumulated quite a few others, but I always pay them off, and I don't have any with yearly fees.
 
I picked up the Costco Citi card though they had been on my blacklist for two decades for having late fee'd me on a 2 cent balance. What most people don't seem to take advantage of are the purchase protection and other insurances. They do price protection, two years of warranty, and 90 days of accidental damage or loss, trip insurance and concierge, along with some other goodies for no annual fee. My quick read was this meets or beats Chase Sapphire Preferred.
 
Brian's rules for credit cards
1) no annual fees.
2) they get paid off every month or they get closed.
3) they are not a source of credit, they are a means of payment. Think check, not savings account.

Otherwise - pick one that matches with what you do. I travel a lot and credit cards add to loyalty points. In the last 15 years I can count the number of times I have had to pay for a hotel room on one hand.

The place people get into trouble is using the card as a way of financing emergency things. You're much better off taking the money out of your emergency fund and then forcing yourself to pay it back.
 
Rewards cards are a great option for those that are responsible with their money.

I am more of a fan of getting a card that gives you rewards towards something that you will use...like airlines or hotels...rather than straight cash back.

I have the AMX Platinum card that I use for my company...I put every business expense on that possible.

I have both Southwest and Marriott cards that I put every personal expense on those that I can...mortgage, utilities, gas, groceries...if they take CC, I pay with CC (and pay them off in full every month)

I travel ton for work but between those three I have not paid for a personal flight, hotel or vacation expense out of pocket since 2012.

If you understand the game, the rewards cards can be a significant value. A few yeas ago I took 8 friends on a three day New Years Eve vacation all expense paid costing close to $13,000 and all on points without making a dent in my balance. Some of my cards have annual fees, but I get exponentially more value out of the cards than the fees cost.
 
I've had one card since I'm 18, never had a need for another one. It used to be 5% off on gas but now it's gone to the rotating categories thing which sometimes does include gas.

There are no annual fees, if there were I'd drop it. I've never carried a balance in all that time either, why would anyone ever do that with the high interest rates? That's insane! Yeah I was aware of that at 18 when I got the card... I guess my father had pounded that concept into me for enough years before I got it that I didn't go out and do anything dumb. I am always hearing about college kids getting a credit card and putting themselves into huge debt and that blows my mind. I can't comprehend how someone could be unaware of the consequences of doing that and be so foolish but... well.. I was raised differently.

So to put this back on an aviation theme... in the first quarter of this year the card was giving 5% cash back on gas stations. I was reviewing my statement and noticed they'd tagged my last couple of FBO charges as "gas station" and given me the 5% on it. I had just had my annual done... I went into the FBO and had my whole annual inspection put on the card. Sure enough I got 5% off of my annual inspection and actually maxed out my rewards for that quarter.
 
JCranford said:
Its really worth $400 a year to play this game and be in debt?? Yeah, Yeah, I know: 'I pay it off every month, so I'm not in debt'....

Just not worth it to me.

Back to your regularly scheduled topic...
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For the purchase protection, price protection (kinda - read on), and being able to make my little "problem" the merchant's "problem" with a single phone call? Absolutely.

I've reversed charges a handful of times on morons who thought they'd get away with something. Haven't lost one yet.

Re: Price protection, retailers have caught on. They ask manufacturers to make identical products with different model numbers that only exist in their stores. Most price protection schemes require you find the exact same model at another retailer for less. A simple swap of what's on the sticker on the back at the manufacturer and suddenly it's impossible to find that item at another retailer. Brilliant.

I will say this on price protection, though. It does pay to keep shopping for a while after a forced big ticket purchase. I got about $500 back on my refrigerator from holiday prices when I had no choice on when to replace it a month earlier. Walked into the big box store, handed them my receipt and the flyer from their competitor, and walked out with cash. Total extra time invested was about ten minutes and a stop there after going to the haircut place across the street.

The other one if you get the right cards and read the fine print, is warranty extension. With many things being designed to fail right around warranty time, the hassle of making a claim is well worth getting a new, or if discontinued, better thingamajig.

I don't see my cards as credit cards. I see them as money laundering. Hahaha. Someone else is dumb or desperate enough to pay 28% interest compounded monthly or higher to pay for my perks. Thanks to the new generation of suckers, whoever they are! I paid for someone's perks a couple of decades ago, so it's just the circle of life when being credit-dumb. Used to pay for the system, now I work the same system to my advantage.

You're correct in one part, however. Some of these perks are meaningless if they take a lot of time. Reversing charges on a $5 item isn't a good use of time unless you're really bored. Reversing charges on a few hundred dollar item that was destroyed by a shipper and the original merchant won't engage... Priceless... As the commercial says... :)

There's also various travel insurance perks and other things offered with many cards, documented in that pamphlet that most people throw away without reading. ;)
 
cowman said:
So to put this back on an aviation theme... in the first quarter of this year the card was giving 5% cash back on gas stations. I was reviewing my statement and noticed they'd tagged my last couple of FBO charges as "gas station" and given me the 5% on it. I had just had my annual done... I went into the FBO and had my whole annual inspection put on the card. Sure enough I got 5% off of my annual inspection and actually maxed out my rewards for that quarter.
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Love it! I want someone to buy a new panel on their card and make an extended warranty claim when something in avionics dies long after Garmin's warranty is up, and see if the card's insurance processor balks at replacing a $10,000 box. Haha.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
As i got through everything, it just seems this topic is one of those that can be argued until the end of time...
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Oh, true that! I'm pretty solidly in the Ramsey camp, but there *are* people disciplined enough to pay off the card every month and carry no balance. If if works for you, great, keep on keeping on. I will admit I got antsy and financed my new truck recently, but I put half down and paid it off in 6 months. Probably do the same thing with a plane when / if we buy one. So I cant admit to being 100% Ramsey-ite. ;)
 
JCranford said:
I will admit I got antsy and financed my new truck recently, but I put half down and paid it off in 6 months.
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I'm avoiding that temptation these days. Usually that means it's time to go spend $1000 on a new gadget for the 2001 Dodge Cummins to keep me from spending $50,000-$70,000 on a new diesel. Haha. But right now, the Yukon won't idle right and I think Karen's Lincoln LT needs new front brakes. Guess I'd better fix those first. :)
 
denverpilot said:
I don't see my cards as credit cards. I see them as money laundering. Hahaha.
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Yup. Several years ago I had a major medical issue that resulted in large co-pays, deductibles, and hitting my max out of pocket two years in a row. I had to pay for it anyway, so why not run it through my rewards card? When I was better I flew to the islands for free.
 
JCranford said:
Oh, true that! I'm pretty solidly in the Ramsey camp, but there *are* people disciplined enough to pay off the card every month and carry no balance. If if works for you, great, keep on keeping on. I will admit I got antsy and financed my new truck recently, but I put half down and paid it off in 6 months. Probably do the same thing with a plane when / if we buy one. So I cant admit to being 100% Ramsey-ite. ;)
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And if you buy that truck with 50% down, then pay off the balance over 6 months on your rewards credit cards vs sending a check, then pay off the credit card as you go just as you would your truck payment so you do not incur interest charges...you could wind up with a free vacation out of the deal as well if you play your "cards" right for the same money spent.
 
Shawn said:
And if you buy that truck with 50% down, then pay off the balance over 6 months on your rewards credit cards vs sending a check, then pay off the credit card as you go just as you would your truck payment so you do not incur interest charges...you could wind up with a free vacation out of the deal as well if you play your "cards" right for the same money spent.
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There's usually upper limits on the dollar value of the perks. But not always. Have to be careful which type of card you do this with, or your free vacation will be to the Best Western in Kearney, NE. :)
 
JCranford said:
I will admit I got antsy and financed my new truck recently, but I put half down and paid it off in 6 months.
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When I bought a new car I was planning on using all cash but the dealer offered $300 off if I got their financing. I asked what's the smallest loan (highest down payment) I could take and the soonest I could pay it off. In the end I spent 2 months and $70 in exchange for $300.
 
asicer said:
When I bought a new car I was planning on using all cash but the dealer offered $300 off if I got their financing. I asked what's the smallest loan (highest down payment) I could take and the soonest I could pay it off. In the end I spent 2 months and $70 in exchange for $300.
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Wife needed a new car last winter, was going to pay cash, but Ford offered 0% for 60mo. Sure, I'll use Ford's money for free.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Wife needed a new car last winter, was going to pay cash, but Ford offered 0% for 60mo. Sure, I'll use Ford's money for free.
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I thought about that. The only way I could make it worth the hassle for me is if I could take the cash I was going to spend and put it in an interest bearing account, set up autopay on the loan to withdraw from there, then at the end of 5 years cash out the remainder. In the end I couldn't find on short notice an account that bears enough interest to make the excercise... (pardon the pun) interesting.
 
asicer said:
I thought about that. The only way I could make it worth the hassle for me is if I could take the cash I was going to spend and put it in an interest bearing account, set up autopay on the loan to withdraw from there, then at the end of 5 years cash out the remainder. In the end I couldn't find on short notice an account that bears enough interest to make the excercise... (pardon the pun) interesting.
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Right now, you're correct, it is hard to find high yielding investments. But, cash preservation is cash preservation. And, the way I look at it, 0% financing and all the other incentives aren't really free, they're baked into the price of the car to begin with. So by not taking advantage of every incentive I'm paying too much.
 
Shawn said:
And if you buy that truck with 50% down, then pay off the balance over 6 months on your rewards credit cards vs sending a check, then pay off the credit card as you go just as you would your truck payment so you do not incur interest charges...you could wind up with a free vacation out of the deal as well if you play your "cards" right for the same money spent.
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Most cards/banks don't allow you to pay a loan off using a credit card. I tried that once. It's robbing Paul to pay Peter, or the other way around, who knows.:confused:

It takes a certain type of person to have the discipline to not go crazy when they have credit cards. I know too many people that can't have any cards or they can't help themselves. I currently have 21 open credit cards, something like $195,000 of available credit. I owe a grand total of maybe $600 (my cable, cell phone, car insurance) that I put on the car each month to get the JetBlue miles. In the past 10 years, I had 56 or 57 different cards. I get them just for the opening bonus miles (20-30k miles if you make $1000 of purchases in first 90 days). I meet the opening spending requirements, get my points/miles, and close it, long before the annual fee next year. (No fee in first year) The CC shuffle is like a hobby for me.:cool: I have had probably 6 free international round trips in the past 4 years. I pay it off each month. I have NEVER missed a payment and only been late once (by accident when I was 19) in 22 years of having credit cards. I use less than 1/100th of 1% of my total credit limit. My credit score is 832, nearly perfect. It would be perfect but I have student loans from grad school that I'm still paying off (2 1/8% so no hurry to pay them off-- my money is growing faster than that) and also it seems that I've opened too many new CC accounts in the past 2 years which lowers my score a little. LOL
 
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Funny thing, a couple of years ago I bought a new truck and had intended to pay cash. They offered me a significant factory rebate if I financed it, so I financed the minimum amount, carried the balance for the minimum time required(6mo IIRC), then paid the whole thing off.

Financing is where the money really gets made on a lot of things these days, they really push it. If you are careful you can beat them at their own game but you gotta be sure of what you're doing before jumping into it. There are often variables one wouldn't have even thought of that come up.
 
orange said:
Most cards/banks don't allow you to pay a loan off using a credit card. I tried that once. It's robbing Paul to pay Peter, or the other way around, who knows.:confused:

It takes a certain type of person to have the discipline to not go crazy when they have credit cards. I know too many people that can't have any cards or they can't help themselves. I currently have 21 open credit cards, something like $195,000 of available credit. I owe a grand total of maybe $600 (my cable, cell phone, car insurance) that I put on the car each month to get the JetBlue miles. In the past 10 years, I had 56 or 57 different cards. I get them just for the opening bonus miles (20-30k miles if you make $1000 of purchases in first 90 days). I meet the opening spending requirements, get my points/miles, and close it, long before the annual fee next year. (No fee in first year) The CC shuffle is like a hobby for me.:cool: I have had probably 6 free international round trips in the past 4 years. I pay it off each month. I have NEVER missed a payment and only been late once (by accident when I was 19) in 22 years of having credit cards. I use less than 1/100th of 1% of my total credit limit. My credit score is 832, nearly perfect. It would be perfect but I have student loans from grad school that I'm still paying off (2 1/8% so no hurry to pay them off-- my money is growing faster than that) and also it seems that I've opened too many new CC accounts in the past 2 years which lowers my score a little. LOL
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Don't you take a pretty big hit when you close an account? I've always thought it was best to just cut the card up.
 
No, and it may actually help you because you have less open accounts. But you are right, for accounts with no annual fee, yes, just cut the card up and keep the account active. You are building your credit history and length of open accounts, which is part of the credit score.

You take a hit (in your wallet) when you get the statement after month 12 that has the annual fee of $75 (or more) for the rewards card that you didn't close. :eek: But you can also call them and close the account on the spot and the fee is waived. Sometimes, they just want you to keep the card that they will waive the fee and let you keep the card for another year for free. I keep a couple rewards cards, even with the fee, but sometimes I call them and threaten to close my account if they don't waive the fee. They usually do. Lots of stuff you can pull on these banks, like they pull on us.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
Don't you take a pretty big hit when you close an account? I've always thought it was best to just cut the card up.
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Depends on if you have the magic number of open credit accounts, and also the longevity of all of your accounts, amongst other voodoo. Closing your oldest account if the next oldest is many years younger can hurt more than keeping it open, but if you have too many accounts, closing any account may help more.

It's a moot point for anyone paying things off monthly, since it's pretty rare that personality type will do much in other areas of their personal finance to have a score lower than 800.

Doing the 50 card thing I would not do, but that's more because it sounds like work. I don't ascribe to the silly notion that time is always money, and one should value all of one's time at one's per hour salary rate like some do... "You could be making more money working than messing with those cards!"

But there is a value on time all by itself, and I'd rather be goofing off on PoA or even picking out belly button lint than keeping track of 50 cards and their renewal dates, and points systems, and talking to bored CSRs in call centers reading from retention scripts.

They'd have to offer a lot better than a free airline ticket and a hotel room to convince me that belly button lint isn't more interesting. Especially at the ultra-competitive airline and hotel prices today.

Make it guaranteed first class on an international route so I don't die of DVT, and staying at the Ritz-Carlton and you're just starting to get my attention. I haven't found a card that will do that yet. Heh.
 
orange said:
The CC shuffle is like a hobby for me.:cool:
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As the banks are consolidating they are catching wind of this and starting to put a stop to that practice as many individuals have figured out the sign up bonus scheme thanks to the interwebs.
 
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