Consumer law question

Frank Browne

Frank Browne

Final Approach
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Okay, this may not be a law issue just yet, but it seems to be rapidly heading in that direction. On August 11, I had a local heating and air conditioning company install a brand new Trane system in my home. The compressor outside and the air handler in the garage. It has not worked properly since it was installed. The unit will cool for a couple of hours then the airflow subsides to virtually nil, and all cooling stops because the unit keeps freezing up. A few minutes ago, I called them seeking service for the 5th time and they will be sending a technician out this afternoon for the 3rd time to try to diagnose the problem. I really do want to give this company every reasonable opportunity to make this system work properly, but my patience, not to mention confidence, is rapidly running out. I paid with a check for the full amount when the unit was installed and the check has cleared my bank. So they have 4,950 of my hard earned dollars and I still do not have a working air conditioning system.:mad::mad:

So, how many more chances should I give this company to remedy this situation?


I understand that any response by our forum attorneys will not be taken as legal advise, but rather as advise on how I should handle this matter from this point forward.
 
We had the company back out 3 or 4 times for our new AC. So long as they were willing to honor their warranty I was willing to let them. It worked out in the end.
 
Frank,

Do you know FlyingGator from the red board? Rick Marcus, East Coast Heat and Air 247-0033. He's got an AC company and did my house. Even though he didn't install it, he'll probably help you out.
 
Frank Browne said:
On August 11, I had a local heating and air conditioning company install a brand new Trane system in my home. The compressor outside and the air handler in the garage. It has not worked properly since it was installed. The unit will cool for a couple of hours then the airflow subsides to virtually nil, and all cooling stops because the unit keeps freezing up.
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Sounds like they didn't put enough coolant in the system and it's creating excess condensation on the A-coil. *

* I didn't stay in a holiday-inn-express last night - nor am I an air conditioning systems expert. YMMV.
 
Frank,

Sounds like the company is trying to get the issue fixed, so let them keep doing it. It would not hurt to document the problems in a nicely worded letter to them that states in effect:

1. You installed an air conditioning system on mm/dd/yyyy
2. It is not working and I called you to report this on these days...
3. You sent a technician out to my house on these days...
4. It is still not working and needs to be...
5. If it is not working by mm/dd/yyyy (give a reasonable, achievable date) I will have to call another company and you will be responsible for the costs to get the unit fixed.

FWIW, it sounds like you might have a leak in the system and it is losing it's charge, causing the system to ice up.

Good luck.
 
Thanks everyone! Ken, thanks for the contact. I may PM him if they can't fix the unit today.

Mike, the first guy that came out said it was overcharged with refrigerant, and took some out. He left without even checking to see if I had cool air coming into the house! The next guy said it was undercharged. He filled it up and adjusted the fan speed speed. It then blew nice chilled air at a very good volume for a few hours before freezing.

I have begun writing down in chronological order all phone calls and service visits. But like I said, I really do want to give them every chance to make this good.
 
NC Pilot said:
Frank,

Sounds like the company is trying to get the issue fixed, so let them keep doing it. It would not hurt to document the problems in a nicely worded letter to them that states in effect:

1. You installed an air conditioning system on mm/dd/yyyy
2. It is not working and I called you to report this on these days...
3. You sent a technician out to my house on these days...
4. It is still not working and needs to be...
5. If it is not working by mm/dd/yyyy (give a reasonable, achievable date) I will have to call another company and you will be responsible for the costs to get the unit fixed.

FWIW, it sounds like you might have a leak in the system and it is losing it's charge, causing the system to ice up.

Good luck.
Click to expand...

That's excellent advice. I'd very carefully document everything - dates/times of the problems, dates you called, dates they responded, who you talked to, etc. I'd give it another week, and then send the above letter.

You might want to inquire into the possibility of getting a new unit installed. It sounds like the one you've got has some serious defects, and it's my experience that means the problems will be recurring, often right after the warranty expires. That has the added advantage of putting the burden on the manufacturer (to replace a defective unit via warranty), as opposed to the local distributor/installer, which sounds like it is trying to resolve the situation.
 
Frank Browne said:
Mike, the first guy that came out said it was overcharged with refrigerant, and took some out. He left without even checking to see if I had cool air coming into the house! The next guy said it was undercharged. He filled it up and adjusted the fan speed speed. It then blew nice chilled air at a very good volume for a few hours before freezing.
Click to expand...
I suppose the other alternative is that the unit is undersized and you're trying to achieve too much of a temperature difference. This causes the unit to run continuously - which will also cause a freeze up... (This happened to my neighbor).
 
I agree that, so long as the contractor appears to be making good-faith efforts to resolve the issue, it is reasonable to allow them the opportunity to do so. As noted, document very well all events, including (if there are verbal exchanges) the names and titles of people with whom you are dealing. If you have been dealing only with the dispatch personnel, you might (politely but firmly) ask to speak with the owner of the business; they are in a service business, and most owners want happy customers.

You may also consider whether, if none of the above helps, you might want to make a complaint to the State of Florida's Contractor Licensing department. I am fairly certain that FL licenses A/C contractors.

See https://www.myfloridalicense.com/entercomplaint.asp?SID=

If they replaced the outdoor unit (condensing unit) and the indoor (air handler and evaporator), but did not touch the ducts, you might look at (1) whether the return-air duct and filter are flowing freely, and (2) whether the supply ducts (cold air to the various rooms) are adequately-sized for the capacity of the system. If the air handler is trying to move more air (and extract more BTUs) than the ducts can handle, you can easily get a freeze-up.

Refrigerant charge can be an issue, as noted above, but I presume that the contractor is working that angle.

Also, worthwhile to check whether there is some sort of air leak allowing ambient outside air into the return air plenum; non-stop humid outside air could be a problem.

Let us know what happens!
 
I'd put a small wager on the leak in the system possibility. Had the same thing happen to me. Called service out 3 times before the leak was discovered upstream of the condensor. We had new siding installed and the line got pinched. Replaced the leaky line, recharged the system, and TA-DA! Nice cold air in the OK summer.
 
Since it is a TRANE, call them! Give them the story and have them contact the vendor. The last thing TRANE needs is a dissatisfied customer.
 
Frank, you might also check to see what sort of filter you have in the house. If the filter is dirty, or too dense, then the unit can freeze up. We HAD a Trane and that happened to us on a regular basis until we switched filters.

Won't be buying Trane tickets again. :no:
 
I was told similar in the rental home I'm in. I'm forced to use the cheap, very loosely dense filters. My opinion is if the air handler is too weak to blow through a decent quality filter, someone was cheap in what unit to install. Between the two cases, I'm betting it was the recommendation of Frank's sales person to help close the deal and in my case, the landlord on building a decent home.
 
absolutely - the unit should have been bigger, better so as to be able to handle the space. I was just letting Frank know of a potential fix to the freezing problem, if not the "what did y'all just sell me??" problem.
 
I don't think it is the filter. I changed the filter after two weeks because I've been doing a lot of cleaning and dusting inside, and I was surprised to see a very thin filter that had come in the unit. I replaced it with a much better one. When the system is first turned on after thawing all day, it blows a lot of cool air. The guy just called me a few minutes ago to ask me exactly how it was behaving and to tell me he'd be here in a few minutes, so hopefully I'll have some news shortly.
 
Frank Browne said:
.... so hopefully I'll have some news shortly.
Click to expand...

Good news! The guy came out and closely inspected the system, condenser and air handler. The air handler is an R22 unit and the condenser is for 410A refrigerant. The two types of refrigerant work at completely different pressures. The condenser unit appears to have been mislabeled at the factory. He will have the condenser unit changed out tomorrow.

I might add, that this gentleman was very apologetic about the inconvenience it has caused me and is giving me a years worth of free cleaning and maintenance for my troubles. I'm glad now that I remained patient with them and didn't try to be a jerk and gave them a chance to figure it out.

Thanks to all of you for your advise. :yes:
 
Frank Browne said:
...

I might add, that this gentleman was very apologetic about the inconvenience it has caused me and is giving me a years worth of free cleaning and maintenance for my troubles. I'm glad now that I remained patient with them and didn't try to be a jerk and gave them a chance to figure it out....
Click to expand...

Glad to hear it worked out. It's good to know that there are some decent folks out there - I'm convinced that's what you get when you deal with the local guys (doesn't really apply to well in the AC setting, but still). Also, it shows it always pays to be reasonable (aka, nice).
 
In the house, humidity right now... 29%. Outside, it's 59%. That's pretty low for Jawjuh!
 
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