Completely off topic

sba55

sba55

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sba55
This is completely off topic, but I'm just having too much fun with this not to share it.

I live in a college town, which means that a lot more vendors seem to think that they should ask for and can require ID for credit card purchases (MC and Visa's merchant agreement notwithstanding, which generally prohibits vendors from requiring ID and strongly discourages them from asking for it). It's really getting out of control in this town - you can't even buy a $3.50 coffee anymore without being asked for ID.

Up until now, my answer has been a simple 'no thanks', which usually gets me a perplexed look before they go ahead and charge my card. I've been getting too annoyed with this, though, and I just happened to go through some old boxes with stuff from my college time.

Among the things I found - a really fake looking and long expired "Emergency Identification" with my picture and the signature of the chief of police at the University of California.

Now, every time I get asked for ID, I tell them not to do that again since it violates their merchant agreement and show them my ID. The perplexed look has now given way to a "did I do something wrong" look.

I guess security theater works both ways....:goofy:

-Felix
 
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I like being carded. Makes me feel slightly better, since using someone else's credit card is way too easy.
 
SkyHog said:
I like being carded. Makes me feel slightly better, since using someone else's credit card is way too easy.
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Right, but in actuality, it doesn't make a difference since a simple 'no thanks' will work just as well as your ID. Besides, you're not liable, you will have to change your number anyways if your card is stolen, it's very easy to use your card without any ID, MC/V prohibits requiring ID, etc.

I was just reading that threat about the TSA stealing stuff and it made me think of this. We're really addicted to security theater, even if it accomplishes nothing....

-Felix
 
I once had a newly issued card I attempted to use at the post office. I had forgotten to sign it so they refused to accept it. I was told I could sign it then they could accept the card.

There was no request for ID.
 
SkyHog said:
I like being carded. Makes me feel slightly better, since using someone else's credit card is way too easy.
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In the next two months, I will spend over $30,000 on other peoples credit cards moving their boats. It's not a problem. I often will have several clients credit cards in my wallet to make purchases on their behalf.
 
KennyFlys said:
I once had a newly issued card I attempted to use at the post office. I had forgotten to sign it so they refused to accept it. I was told I could sign it then they could accept the card.

There was no request for ID.
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When we moved here to Western PA (work-related move) we had to spend a week in a the local Hampton Inn before the new house was available -- a hotel I had used many times before in the previous 2 years while working on-site.

When I checked in I put down our new address on the registration form.

"I'm sorry, we don't rent to locals."

Hunh?

"We can't rent rooms to locals."

"I heard you -- it just makes no sense. I'm here with my family, we just drove across Pennsylvania after a full day of cleaning out our old house -- we're moving here, and we need a place to stay until our house is ready."

"Sorry."

There are two other decent chain hotels in town, but we were all beyond tired. I grabbed the form, crossed out our new address and entered our old, and handed it back.

"OK, thanks."

Welcome to Fayette County, PA.
 
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I'm with Nick -- I like it when they ask for ID. The fact that I'm not directly liable for the unauthorized use of my credit card doesn't mean I'm not paying for that use, as well as paying for every unauthorized use of any card issued by that bank. It may be buried three layers deep in the percentage of the transaction charged to the merchant as a fee (and passed along to me in higher prices), but it's there. So I've got no problem at all with it, and wouldn't mind if the credit card companies just put some sort of biometric in the card (even a photo) so identity could be verified without asking for additional ID.
 
sba55 said:
I was thinking about the aviation theme of this board....

....well, that, and I couldn't come up with a better title :dunno: ;)
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S'OK. Hangar talk is for anything, as in you don't get thrown out of the FBO lounge for starting a conversation about something.
 
Teller1900 said:
What if Felix has been buying off politicians and hookers with his credit card? :dunno::goofy:
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Then both Felix and those politicians are idiots, because somebody always gets hold of the credit card records when someone does that, and then everybody ends up on the evening news.:D
 
That "no renting rooms to locals" is a "blue" policy enacted to keep people from shacking up in hotels with other people to whom they aren't married. Of course, it also puts a kibosh on anniversaries, "date nights", and other reasons where lawful carnal knowledge would take place.

I first ran into it in Hot Springs, Arkansas, when I was ferrying an airplane out west. Their policy extended to all the addresses in the county.
 
TMetzinger said:
That "no renting rooms to locals" is a "blue" policy enacted to keep people from shacking up in hotels with other people to whom they aren't married. Of course, it also puts a kibosh on anniversaries, "date nights", and other reasons where lawful carnal knowledge would take place...
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or husbands in the dog house - not that I have any personal knowledge of that.
 
TMetzinger said:
That "no renting rooms to locals" is a "blue" policy enacted to keep people from shacking up in hotels with other people to whom they aren't married. Of course, it also puts a kibosh on anniversaries, "date nights", and other reasons where lawful carnal knowledge would take place.

I first ran into it in Hot Springs, Arkansas, when I was ferrying an airplane out west. Their policy extended to all the addresses in the county.
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Whatever you call it, it's absolute horse effluent (and I shovel plenty of it daily).
 
Ron Levy said:
Then both Felix and those politicians are idiots, because somebody always gets hold of the credit card records when someone does that, and then everybody ends up on the evening news.:D
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I liked when Jerry Springer paid a hooker with a check. Cost him the Mayorship, but it got him where he is now....
 
Dan, I think your example is quite similar to mine. It's really not a useful measure because you can put any address you like on the form and get around this policy.

Ron, your argument just doesn't work. If vendors actually had a way of verifying that your authorized to use the card, I'd agree with you. But they don't have any way to do that. Right now, they can be fined $1000 or more by MC/V if they require ID. A simple 'no thanks' will work just as well as showing your ID. And if it doesn't, I'll just try it down the road. It's security theater. By the way, how easy do you think it is to spend lots of money at places where asking for ID isn't even possible?

Luckily, this discussion has been preempted by the card issuers anyways - requiring ID is a breach of their contract.
 
Talk about irony. I was denied cc usage yesterday at Kohl's for refusing to show i.d. I contact my cc company and they said the business has the right to decline doing business with anyone they please. I referred them to page 29 of the visa merchant agreement. They said, to effect, yep it's in there but they don't have to do business with you if they so desire.

WTF is the purpose of page 29 in the merchant agreement???????? Never did receive an answer of that question. :redface:
 
kevin47881 said:
Talk about irony. I was denied cc usage yesterday at Kohl's for refusing to show i.d. I contact my cc company and they said the business has the right to decline doing business with anyone they please. I referred them to page 29 of the visa merchant agreement. They said, to effect, yep it's in there but they don't have to do business with you if they so desire.

WTF is the purpose of page 29 in the merchant agreement???????? Never did receive an answer of that question. :redface:
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In my experience, many card issuer support people don't know their own policies. Mastercard Worldwide has a website where you can report this. I've done this a few times and it works. Never was asked again.

Usually, I only have problems with small stores. The big chains actually read their contracts, although the local store management can be ignorant. I'd complain to corporate - that usually fixes it.
 
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sba55 said:
If vendors actually had a way of verifying that your authorized to use the card, I'd agree with you. But they don't have any way to do that.
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Ummm....let me see -- they can't tell if I'm authorized to use my own card?:confused:
 
Ron Levy said:
I'm with Nick -- I like it when they ask for ID. The fact that I'm not directly liable for the unauthorized use of my credit card doesn't mean I'm not paying for that use, as well as paying for every unauthorized use of any card issued by that bank. It may be buried three layers deep in the percentage of the transaction charged to the merchant as a fee (and passed along to me in higher prices), but it's there. So I've got no problem at all with it, and wouldn't mind if the credit card companies just put some sort of biometric in the card (even a photo) so identity could be verified without asking for additional ID.
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My old BofA card had my photo on it. I freaking loved it.

And I'd be just fine if the credit card companies required IDs....in Henning's Case, there is a way to do just what you're talking about:

Get an extra card with your name on it. Then, you're an authorized user of the account.
 
smigaldi said:
BoA did that? I thought that only Citibank had the photo.
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Yep. The old blue ATM/Debit card, with the gold Visa logo, and the photo in the top left corner.
visa.jpg
 
I don't know, Felix, trying to point out the rules to retailers can be a frustrating experience.

Here's another one, find a gift card/certificate with an expiration date and try to convince the retailer that, by law (California), these cannot expire.
 
woodstock said:
I have written on the back of my card "request photo ID". It rarely happens though...
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I remember reading somewhere that is supposed to void your card, since it requires a valid signature to be used, and CID or See ID is not a valid signature.

I can't recall where I read that though
 
SkyHog said:
Yep. The old blue ATM/Debit card, with the gold Visa logo, and the photo in the top left corner.
visa.jpg
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LOL! I just received a Citibank M/C with the pic of the owner on it. He's a little fat bald jewish guy, been using it for 3 seasons now, never a problem.
 
woodstock said:
I have written on the back of my card "request photo ID". It rarely happens though...
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Per the merchant agreement they are required to have you sign the card in front of them. If you do not, the card is considered invalid.

Page 29 of Visa's merchant agreement is attached for reference.
 

Attachments

What am I missing here? Why would you NOT want to show your ID? Or have the store ask for it?
When my credit info was stolen I wish Home Depot had asked the dude for ID, maybe he wouldn't have spent $1200 there.
 
Did I say I DIDN'T sign the card? I just said I wrote check ID...

ps. thanks, but I'm not reading a 29 page Visa document. I've used this card in each quadrant of the globe, something tells me I'm fine... :D
 
woodstock said:
Did I say I DIDN'T sign the card? I just said I wrote check ID...

ps. thanks, but I'm not reading a 29 page Visa document. I've used this card in each quadrant of the globe, something tells me I'm fine... :D
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No, no...it is page 29, a single page. This page addresses your statement as it relates to what the merchant is obligated to perform.
 
woodstock said:
Did I say I DIDN'T sign the card? I just said I wrote check ID...
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No, you didn't...but all of the other folks I've known who have used the "See ID" business have written it in place of the signature. They thought it was enforceable for some reason.
 
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