The 260C (maybe all 260's?) have a longer fuselage (and an additional window) that accommodates the third row. I don't think the 250's or 400's have the room behind the rear row.
Comanche v. Cherokee 6/300
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The 260C (maybe all 260's?) have a longer fuselage (and an additional window) that accommodates the third row. I don't think the 250's or 400's have the room behind the rear row.
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Pilawt
I believe it was only in the Comanche B and C, the 260 hp models built from about mid 1966 on (Piper didn't hold to strict model years in those days), with the third side windows.
The 260B is listed as 6" longer overall, but the difference is all in the longer prop spinner, not in the fuselage. The interior is larger, because the rear bulkhead was moved aft, not because the airframe is longer.
There was a short-lived PA-24-260 built around 1965, between the last of the 250s and the introduction of the B model, without the third window.
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poor man's Comanche.....they're bout the same
I purchased the Bo for $5K less than I sold the '64 Six.It was a good exchange for an upgraded GNS530W and STec 60-2 autopilot.
What year is your Bo? I love the V tail look.
Checkout_my_Six
Touchdown! Greaser!
mine is a '69 (not the one pictured above).
but, unless you're an aficionado....they're hard to tell the difference in years.
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Kristin
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The fuselage was the same length on all the Comanches.
I have flown both. If you need six seats, you need the Six. The 5th and 6th seats in the Comanche are only suitable for small children and take up ALL the baggage space.
The Six can be compared to a Chevy Suburban while the Comanche is a big Beemer, in the way they both fly. If the Six is older than a 1978, the speed difference will be 20-25 kts in favor of the Comanche. You will seriously love hand flying the Comanche. I haven't met anyone with experience in a lot of different aircraft that rate the Six as sexy to fly.
The Comanche is better built. They are stronger and have better corrosion protection. The negatives are that they are more expensive to maintain and it is harder to find a mechanic who knows what they are doing with a Comanche. You have to be more involved as an owner. Connecting with the Comanche fanatics is a near necessity as the tribal knowledge is vast and usually exceeds what the professionals can offer. Insurance will be higher in the Comanche.
The Comanche is a much better high altitude aircraft. It is really happy at 12-13K where the Six starts to wheeze above 10K.
The Six is better on shorter and rougher fields than the Comanche and it has a higher useful load. The cargo door is hard to beat. That gives a lot of flexibility for hauling that the Comanche does not have.
As for these specific planes, I prefer the high time engine and avionics over the low time engine. The low time engine is a gamble. Depending on the quality of the overhaul and how much it has been flown, you may or may not make TBO. Odds are probably 50/50. The high time engine doesn't owe you anything. If you get a couple of hundred hours, great. If not, no big lose. When the engine is overhauled, you know what you are getting. Also, the cheapest way to buy avionics is already installed.
If you need help rationalizing the Comanche :wink2: you can find the fanatics by Googling "Airworthy Comanches". It is a forum over on Delphi. I know, as I am one.
ChemGuy
Cleared for Takeoff
Can you rent or borrow a six if needed? If so buy the Comanche and rent/borrow a six for the few times you need that much space.
If everyone bought cars like we buy planes, we would almost all own large ass trucks for that 1 time a year we need to haul plywood or drywall or mulch home. Instead we beg, borrow or rent a truck or van.
Good luck and enjoy your Comanche....
If everyone bought cars like we buy planes, we would almost all own large ass trucks for that 1 time a year we need to haul plywood or drywall or mulch home. Instead we beg, borrow or rent a truck or van.
Good luck and enjoy your Comanche....
Spotter626
Pre-takeoff checklist
Watch what you ask for when looking at new avionics. A small upgrade can be $20,000 and I have a good friend in the middle of a electronic upgrade in a nice Cessna 180 bought with sad electronics. OVER $50,000 for the electronic upgrade, so far, as labor becomes a large part of the equation.
PS: Buying what you want is way cheaper almost always!
PS: Buying what you want is way cheaper almost always!
Chip Sylverne
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Quit with the negative waves, man.
About what I pay for the Comanche with 100+ hours time in type. About $1800 for the first 100 hours, plus 5 hour checkout minimum.
Checkout_my_Six
Touchdown! Greaser!
btw.....about that for the Bonanza too.
James331
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Airframe wise is take rh Comanche all day, just a much better flyer and design.
As for the two you are looking at, I'm not a fan of buying a plane with a basically timed out engine, unless the plane is priced accordingly.
If I were you I'd just find a better PA24.
As for the two you are looking at, I'm not a fan of buying a plane with a basically timed out engine, unless the plane is priced accordingly.
If I were you I'd just find a better PA24.
As for the "Poor Man's Bonanza" comment, this Bonanza owner notes that the C-model Comanches are *very* resilient in holding value. Near-cult status, seems to me. Roomy, too, with a great panel layout.
Chip Sylverne
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Quit with the negative waves, man.
Those C's with the shark nose are very desirable airframes. What's the info on the prop?
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I love the lines on the Comanche. It's really a sweet looking plane. The C in particular. Time on prop is low. 2 blade.
Kristin
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If you move on the Comanche, you absolutely, positively, need a pre-buy inspection by someone who really knows the Comanche. I might be able to point you toward someone who is known to the Comanche community. You can PM me and I will give you my contact info.
Tflhndn
Pre-takeoff checklist
Listen to Kristin on this. I bought a Comanche in September. Didn't get a good enough pre-buy. It went in for repairs two days after I bought it and hasn't come out yet.
Big dogs ?
The Six will allow you to take everyone, the dogs, and the stuff that comes with kids and dogs.
With the Six, you'll spend a little bit more money on fuel and and little bit less on maintenance. The yearly expense for either plane will depend more on the particular example you end up with rather than the aircraft type.
mkosmo
Pattern Altitude
What got missed that bad? I mean, we're talking single engine light pistons here...
Kristin
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There are two problems with finding someone to do a competent pre-buy inspection. The first is finding a mechanic who knows how to do one. They don't teach it in A&P school, so you have to have learned it through practicing and screwing up on someone else's dime or buying your own airplanes and learning that way. Too many mechanics are out of ideas other than doing an annual inspection to minimum standards of airworthiness.
The second challenge is finding someone who knows your aircraft. Not hard if you are talking a 100 series Cessna or a PA-28. Anyone who meets the first criteria can do a decent job on one of those. But when you get into old, complex, and likely highly modified aircraft, you need someone that knows the ins and outs of the particular make and model.
For example on a Comanche, unless you have overhauled a few landing gear systems, you really don't know what to look for. Unless you know where the floor supports crack, you are not going to have the right equipment and know where to look to see any. There is an AD on the landing gear that most mechanics think requires the replacement of the landing gear bungees every 3 years or 500 hours. It does, but they miss the paragraph that requires an overhaul of the landing gear every 1000 hours. Half the Comanches I do a pre-buy on have not had this done or had it pencil-whipped or badly done.
Just like in the V-tail, the third 'row" was nothing more than an advertising gimmick. You can put a kid in there for a short flight to the beach, but you better have someone drive as well to take the towels.
n9144p
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N9144P
I agree that the third row in the comanche's aren't meant for adults. However I raised 3 kids and flew them to adulthood. They always drew straws for seating. The winner got to sit with "mom" in the middle row, and the loser had to sit next to me. They liked the quiet(er) back seat and to be able to look down behind the wing. We took one seat out and stacked luggage in the empty space. With little kids I could fly with full fuel and the same amount of luggage you can put in a normal car trunk. Made over a hundred long distance trips, so I would say it wasn't a gimmick for us.
As they got a little older (heavier), we allowed for less luggage, but only the last couple of years when my son got bigger did I have to leave any fuel off. It is a great 5 place family plane.
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2 70lb labs. I'm in the process of negotiating for the purchase of a straight tail Lance but my heart still likes the idea of the Comanche. Head over heart at this point.
Two kids and two midsize dogs. That's going to be tight in a Comanche. Make sure it's one with the open baggage area (iirc starting with the 'B') so you can put a blanket and the dogs back there.
I would get the PA32.
drotto
Cleared for Takeoff
The family owned plane is a Saratoga SP. Not the fastest, not the most "fun", but 1300 lbs of useful load, and an extremely stable IFR platform. Not much you can find fault with. May not be the pilot's favorite, but it will be the passengers.
I personally have a fascination with Moonies and the baby Bonanzas (fa33's).
I personally have a fascination with Moonies and the baby Bonanzas (fa33's).
Jaybird180
Final Approach
This is very encouraging. I think I am keeping my eye on the C Models.