Cirrus "panic button"; good or bad?

AdamZ said:
I quietly wonder if all the opposition to the red button ( chute) and blue button ( wing leveler) isn't some kind of fals bravado or macho thing. They are like anyother tool in your bag.
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I think it's partly that, and there are also people who are purists who like to do things with the least amount of technology possible and take a lot of pride in it. I worked for someone like that for many years. There's nothing wrong with that, but these people probably wouldn't be inclined to get anywhere near a Cirrus to begin with. I don't understand why they object to safety features which other people may want to use. Of course you should be able to level the airplane by yourself, but as others have pointed out, there may be situations where you can't. Also, if you take the anti-technology argument far enough you will never get off the ground because you don't have wings.

I also don't agree with the premise that because you screwed up and made some bad decision, or were somehow unable to control the airplane, that you and your passengers deserve to die. It would be nice to have a final option.
 
Everskyward said:
I also don't agree with the premise that because you screwed up and made some bad decision, or were somehow unable to control the airplane, that you and your passengers deserve to die. It would be nice to have a final option.
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Very good point, Mari.
 
I think it's terrific, and think all GFC700's should have this function. I think it's terrific for passengers/Pinch-Hitters, pilots who might "lose it" while flying by hand, and other situations.

I also think I'm not likely to use it, as I strive to maintain proficiency in hand flying, AND I use the autopilot to the fullest extent possible, so the autopilot is already likely to be engaged in an appropriate mode with the appropriate goals set. If this seems like a contradiction to you, read on.

I divide my flying into three categories:
  • Flying for proficiency - this is done with a safety pilot or CFI, in simulators or simulated instrument flying, and concentrates on hand flying all manuevers and working simulated abnormal/emergency situations. The autopilot is used occasionally for enroute phases, or as needed to ensure proficiency with the autoflight systems if they're new, but otherwise left alone.
  • Flying for fun - flying short trips in VMC in a simple airplane - all hand flown.
  • Flying for real - VMC with passengers or in IMC. On these flights the goal is to maximize safety. That means the autoflight system is used to the maximum extent possible. If I want to hand-fly an enroute leg, the flight director is left engaged. All approaches are coupled. In a sophisticated airplane (like the G1000/GFC700s) the autopilot is engaged at around 1000 AGL and stays on until the MAP. I already know I can fly the plane by hand if needed. My first duty as captain is to get us there as safely as possible, not to be the bravest/hottest/best airplane handler in the sky.
Pilots who come to rely on this stuff and don't stay proficient will eventually die when it fails, just as pilots who don't have it and don't stay proficient will die when their nonexistent skills are tested. There's nothing immoral about doing everything that can be done to prevent crashes, so that only the REALLY negligent are killed.
 
Here's an interesting video overview of the new "Perspectives" system. It certainly is more than just another G1000 installation (bigger 12" screens, alphanumeric keypad (like the Columbia), knobs and joystick on center console instead of PFD/MFD bezel, a new autopilot control panel very "jet-like", yaw damper, brake temp sensors and O2 level gauges, etc:


The Perspective is an SR22-only upgrade—at about a $48,000 premium—that has what might best be described as a gen-and-half Garmin G1000. The new EFIS has been, in the words of Alan Klapmeier, "Cirrusized" with 12-inch rather than 10-inch screens and is thus the ideal platform for Garmin's recently announced SVT synthetic vision upgrade, which the perspective has. Terrain depiction is detailed almost down to rubber skids on runways and the new display also has highway-in-the-sky (HITs) boxes and an airdata-driven flight path indicator. To simplify operation of the EFIS, the Perspective has an alphanumeric keyboard which resides on the pedestal between the pilot seats, where a pair of GNS430s are found in an Avidyne-equipped airplane. Besides the keys, some of G1000's knobs and joystick have also been relocated to center section control. Cirrus has also directed Garmin to simplify the GFC700 autopilot control panel and it has one neat new feature: a dedicated blue button labeled LVL. By pushing that, the pilot commands the autopilot to level the wings and nose on the current heading and altitude. Although it's not billed as a recovery-from-unusual attitudes button, our sneak preview of the system at Duluth last week suggests it has that potential. Other Perspective upgrades include a yaw damper, brake temperature systems and spiffy new paint schemes.
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Just another crutch for this airplane and its pilots.
 
AdamZ said:
And Nick guys or gals who are single may not think of this right off. But Those of us who have families that we fly with think about this ( at least I do but perhaps I'm a bit neurotic) what if I become imcompacitated in the plane and I have Tamson and /orRachel in the plane. The Pinch hitter thing can only take you so far. If I had the $$ to protect them it is definitly something I'd seriously consider.
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I don't get it, Adam, I agree with y'all. I don't have kids or a wife, but I understand that if I am taking a friend or something flying and I pass the hell out, that they could press a button and fly straight a bit longer...
 
If folks want to think that cockpit automation makes one "less of a pilot", they're free to do so. But the decision to give up on maintaining basic pilot skills is a personal one, not automatically imposed by the gadgets.

Frankly, in my mind, being a master of the airplane AND a master of the systems makes one MORE of a pilot. It doesn't have to be one or the other. And what I'm hearing from CAP squadrons going through the G1000 training process is that many of their experience pilots aren't able to transition to the glass.

An over-60 friend of mine reminds me that people in the airlines said similar things when they transitioned from pistons to jets, that the folks going to jets had it too easy and didn't have the skills to handle weather. And of course some folks couldn't make the transition to flying at jet speeds.
 
TMetzinger said:
If folks want to think that cockpit automation makes one "less of a pilot", they're free to do so. But the decision to give up on maintaining basic pilot skills is a personal one, not automatically imposed by the gadgets.

Frankly, in my mind, being a master of the airplane AND a master of the systems makes one MORE of a pilot. It doesn't have to be one or the other. And what I'm hearing from CAP squadrons going through the G1000 training process is that many of their experience pilots aren't able to transition to the glass.

An over-60 friend of mine reminds me that people in the airlines said similar things when they transitioned from pistons to jets, that the folks going to jets had it too easy and didn't have the skills to handle weather. And of course some folks couldn't make the transition to flying at jet speeds.
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I didn't have ANY difficulty transitioning to glass. But you obviously haven't been doing community BFRs and IPCs.

The Average GA pilot flies about 60 hours per year and is barely competent. It's very, very depressing. The average Cirrus pilot...........no different. He just has more crutches. Man the look on the face when you disable the VCU......

The reason CFIs do each other's IPCs FOR each other is that it's a pleasure to fly with another competent airman.
 
In my four months as a CFI, I've done three BFRs. All three were pilots who had not flown in two years or more.

I have a fourth who could legally get by with a BFR but has chosen to undergo training from scratch given he has not flown in nearly twenty years. On top of that, his last flight resulted in a fuel exhaustion accident which got his certificate suspended for all of thirty days. I hope it's not that light these days. Fortunately, no one was hurt.

I fear I'll see something even closer to home in time. Last week, one of my students chose to have the C-150 topped off before our flight without consulting me. Good call! The line guy put 23 gallons into a set of tanks holding only 24 and 22.5 of it usable. The last guy to fly it went up for 3.2 hours after it had flown just over an hour on a full set of tanks. I had no clue it had happen as I was off with my students. I'm told he's a competent pilot. That little scenario my student stumbled upon indicates otherwise.
 
Did you guys see this? Sounds like Avidyne is nervous...

My favorite quote:

Originally posted by AvWeb
"Among other benefits," the company said in a news release on Tuesday, "the easier-to-use Entegra-equipped Cirrus SR22 is $48,000 less expensive and provides an additional 42 pounds of useful load, both critical factors for many potential Cirrus customers."
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It's like the older child when the newborn arrives trying to point out faults as an effort to say, "We're still here! Give us attention!"
 
t0r0nad0 said:
Did you guys see this? Sounds like Avidyne is nervous...
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As well they should be. :yes:

"Avidyne is very confident that pilots will continue to select their avionics packages based on core value propositions such as price, ease of use, interoperability, performance and future upgradeability," the statement said.
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Ha ha ha. Pilot's DON'T select Avidyne when given the choice. Diamond and Columbia offered the choice. Diamond built ONE airplane with the Avidyne in it. I don't have hard numbers from Columbia, but what I've heard is that they were at least 98% Garmin.

There were only ever two manufacturers that offered exclusively Avidyne: Piper (who is now offering the G1000 as an option on some models), and Cirrus who is giving folks the chance to have the whiz-bang latest thing and be BETTER than the Joneses.

Avidyne is soooooooo screwed.
 
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