Basic Med may not catch on

paflyer said:
Are anal exams required for sports physicals?

Basic Med is a PoS IMO, with possible exception of the few % aldready on a SI. Anyone new to flying still has to run the MedEx gauntlet, and the stated physician (not NP, PA...) exam requirements go beyond a Class 3 AME medical. Next thing you know they're sending you off for unfunded (if you are on Obama"Care") full blood workups, chest xrays, EKG, etc to cover their asses. Don't think their malpractice ins co's aren't going to demand that, to cover their asses.

Anything other than DL "medical" is a FAIL.
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https://www.faa.gov/about/office_or.../offices/aam/ame/guide/app_process/exam_tech/

These are the AME instructions for a medical exam. The BasicMed exam checklist is essentially the same. They don't actually examine your anus at the AME office and BasicMed will be no different. So no, the exam requirements do not go beyond Class 3 AME. Also NP's and PA's can perform the exam, as long as a physician signs off.

You can assume all you want that doctors will send people for a bunch of extra testing to cover themselves but you can't back that up. I spoke with my doctor about BasicMed and I don't see that happening. They sign forms like this all the time. This has all been hashed over in many different threads.
 
MassPilot said:
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_or.../offices/aam/ame/guide/app_process/exam_tech/

These are the AME instructions for a medical exam. The BasicMed exam checklist is essentially the same. They don't actually examine your anus at the AME office and BasicMed will be no different. So no, the exam requirements do not go beyond Class 3 AME. Also NP's and PA's can perform the exam, as long as a physician signs off.

You can assume all you want that doctors will send people for a bunch of extra testing to cover themselves but you can't back that up. I spoke with my doctor about BasicMed and I don't see that happening. They sign forms like this all the time. This has all been hashed over in many different threads.
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And furthermore, there is no rejection, denial, etc., so if your doctor is not comfortable with the idea of signing off the medical exam without ordering a bevy of unnecessary tests, it is your right as a consumer to select another physician. The thing is this: under BasicMed, the airman swaps FAA aeromedical standards for their doctor's clinical judgement in seeking an evaluation of their fitness for flight. The other 1,460 days the airman is on their own to comply with 14 CFR 61.53.
 
Brad Z said:
And furthermore, there is no rejection, denial, etc., so if your doctor is not comfortable with the idea of signing off the medical exam without ordering a bevy of unnecessary tests, it is your right as a consumer to select another physician. The thing is this: under BasicMed, the airman swaps FAA aeromedical standards for their doctor's clinical judgement in seeking an evaluation of their fitness for flight. The other 1,460 days the airman is on their own to comply with 14 CFR 61.53.
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So when you report prior medical visits to the "next guy" what do you say about the one where the doc refused to sign off?
 
paflyer said:
So when you report prior medical visits to the "next guy" what do you say about the one where the doc refused to sign off?
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My doctor said he would do the BasicMed exam as part of my checkup. If for some reason he decided not to sign me off and I ended up going to a different doctor, I would report the visit as "Annual Physical".
 
My AME is not in my insurance pool, thus I pay approx $175 for a class 3. Since the AME is obviously a physician, and presumably doesn't want to loose a bunch of his clients, maybe he'll offer a say...$50 basic medical option. Of course if ones primary doc will sign off and insurance covers all/most of this visit, than that is the best cost option.
 
Badger said:
My AME is not in my insurance pool, thus I pay approx $175 for a class 3. Since the AME is obviously a physician, and presumably doesn't want to loose a bunch of his clients, maybe he'll offer a say...$50 basic medical option. Of course if ones primary doc will sign off and insurance covers all/most of this visit, than that is the best cost option.
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My AME also charged $175. Insurance pool or not I don't think any AME will bill the exam to insurance since it's definitely not medically necessary. My primary doctor said he would conduct the BasicMed exam as part of my annual physical which is completely covered by insurance so that'll save me $175.
 
I have a doctors visit scheduled for May 1st. I plan to have the forms with me. My doctor said that he would sign them but until I have his signature on the dotted line, I will be skeptical.

I get his signature, then I will go straight to find the online course. I understand you have to have your doctors info before you can take the online course and you have to wait until May 1st to go to the doctor.

Now, when will the final forms be ready? Online course available? All I can find is things like, "Coming Soon!"

Anyone here know?
 
HotRock said:
I have a doctors visit scheduled for May 1st. I plan to have the forms with me. My doctor said that he would sign them but until I have his signature on the dotted line, I will be skeptical.

I get his signature, then I will go straight to find the online course. I understand you have to have your doctors info before you can take the online course and you have to wait until May 1st to go to the doctor.

Now, when will the final forms be ready? Online course available? All I can find is things like, "Coming Soon!"

Anyone here know?
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I do. The form won't be posted online until the OMB approves the form and provides a control number (paperwork reduction act and all, you know?). Once the form is online, you can go see your doctor. You'll need to provide the doctor's info and click on five affirmations in the online training course order to get the course completion certificate. That will be published shortly as well. Have faith, everything is indeed, "Coming soon".
 
Brad Z said:
I do. The form won't be posted online until the OMB approves the form and provides a control number (paperwork reduction act and all, you know?). Once the form is online, you can go see your doctor. You'll need to provide the doctor's info and click on five affirmations in the online training course order to get the course completion certificate. That will be published shortly as well. Have faith, everything is indeed, "Coming soon".
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There has been some talk that the OMB may not approve the form by May 1st. If that's the case, no one will be able to get the exam or fly under BasicMed until OMB gets around to approving the form. My SI expires on May 31st and I am planning on doing BasicMed instead of renewing my SI so I'm watching this closely.
 
Brad Z said:
I do. The form won't be posted online until the OMB approves the form and provides a control number (paperwork reduction act and all, you know?). Once the form is online, you can go see your doctor. You'll need to provide the doctor's info and click on five affirmations in the online training course order to get the course completion certificate. That will be published shortly as well. Have faith, everything is indeed, "Coming soon".
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Yep, that's where I got the coming soon info!
 
Hey doc, can you sign this form that says I am safe to fly?

How about I just give you a script for 1,000 oxycodone 80mg pills instead? I would feel safer.
 
MassPilot said:
There has been some talk that the OMB may not approve the form by May 1st. If that's the case, no one will be able to get the exam or fly under BasicMed until OMB gets around to approving the form. My SI expires on May 31st and I am planning on doing BasicMed instead of renewing my SI so I'm watching this closely.
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Do you know someone in OMB who said that?
 
Stewartb said:
Only if the OMB approves and releases the regs. My RFS told me a few days ago that there's some concern about whether that will happen by May 1st.
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This quote is from another thread. I thought there was more than one person claiming this but maybe not. Either way, I hope it's not true or I might end up grounded.
 
MassPilot said:
This quote is from another thread. I thought there was more than one person claiming this but maybe not. Either way, I hope it's not true or I might end up grounded.
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OMB is in the critical path, but I am not aware of a legitimate concern that they may delay the rule effective date. I did mention in a previous thread that the new administration was slow on the uptake of new regulations in the pipeline (which is true of pretty much every new administration, particularly if there's a change of party). The good news is that things have started to move, so we'll see what happens.
 
MassPilot said:
This quote is from another thread. I thought there was more than one person claiming this but maybe not. Either way, I hope it's not true or I might end up grounded.
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The RFS has heard what I mentioned here previously. They mentioned that more as a possibility, rather than as a likelihood.
 
Brad Z said:
The RFS has heard what I mentioned here previously. They mentioned that more as a possibility, rather than as a likelihood.
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I get very paranoid when I'm at risk of losing my flying privileges, even temporarily lol. Hopefully everything goes smoothly. I bookmarked the FAA BasicMed link and I've been checking several times per day lol.
 
paflyer said:
Next thing you know they're sending you off for unfunded (if you are on Obama"Care") full blood workups, chest xrays, EKG, etc to cover their asses.
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Not to de-rail, but I've had an Obamacare plan in the past when I was between jobs and never had a problem getting tests funded with a co-pay just like any other insurance.
 
MassPilot said:
My AME also charged $175. Insurance pool or not I don't think any AME will bill the exam to insurance since it's definitely not medically necessary. My primary doctor said he would conduct the BasicMed exam as part of my annual physical which is completely covered by insurance so that'll save me $175.
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Maybe I shouldn't post this, but... my new (and maybe ex-) AME billed two consultations to insurance, and they paid, no questions asked. Of course, I had to fork over a $30 "specialist" co-pay, so it wasn't completely free...

Now that was last year. This year, my employer's insurance took a decisive downward turn in coverage level, so there is a good chance they wouldn't pay now.

And he (AME) did say he was only billing insurance because it wasn't an FAA physical.
 
MassPilot said:
I get very paranoid when I'm at risk of losing my flying privileges, even temporarily lol. Hopefully everything goes smoothly. I bookmarked the FAA BasicMed link and I've been checking several times per day lol.
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You would be going completely crazy if you were in my shoes then. I've been grounded for over a year and a half and am waiting with bated breath for BasicMed to go into effect. If it's delayed it will be... just a little longer.

But the plane is being annualed this month... and I definitely want to do the post-annual checkout ASAP, so I do have a strong reason for hoping there is no delay.
 
paflyer said:
Anything other than DL "medical" is a FAIL.
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That's a little strong, I think. I wish it was a DL medical too, but apparently that was not in the cards. I would give BasicMed a C+ - a definite improvement, could be better.
 
labbadabba said:
Not to de-rail, but I've had an Obamacare plan in the past when I was between jobs and never had a problem getting tests funded with a co-pay just like any other insurance.
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Right, after you've exhausted the $6000+ deductible.
 
paflyer said:
Right, after you've exhausted the $6000+ deductible.
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? I have no idea what you're talking about, it certainly wan't my experience. Ironically tho, I now have an insurance plan through my employer at a large bank and my deductible is $4000...
 
labbadabba said:
? I have no idea what you're talking about, it certainly wan't my experience. Ironically tho, I now have an insurance plan through my employer at a large bank and my deductible is $4000...
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If you had one of those extremely pricey "gold" Oscare plans, then yeah you can get to the "copay" phase sooner (i.e., lower deductible). But you paid for it in the higher premium.

Congratulations to the Democrats, they took a situation where some people couldn't afford/didn't need/want health insurance and made it so a lot fewer people, who did want/need it, could afford it.

"Call it the stupidity of the American people, or whatever..."
 
paflyer said:
If you had one of those extremely pricey "gold" Oscare plans, then yeah you can get to the "copay" phase sooner (i.e., lower deductible). But you paid for it in the higher premium.
Congratulations to the Democrats, they took a situation where some people couldn't afford/didn't need/want health insurance and made it so a lot fewer people, who did want/need it, could afford it.
"Call it the stupidity of the American people, or whatever..."
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IIRC, I had a silver plan through United HC. Last I checked, for the vast majority of enrollees in the ACA they're paying a very competitive rate especially in states where they've set up their own exchanges. There are those whose income is too high not to qualify for subsidy and those folks are getting hit with very high premiums. But even those of us with a corporate plan are paying very high premiums and our employers are paying even more on average.

The issue of high premiums isn't so much an ACA issue, it's endemic to health care costs in general. In a macro sense, the increase in premiums as a percentage of GDP has slowed precipitously since the passage of the ACA.
 
labbadabba said:
IIRC, I had a silver plan through United HC. Last I checked, for the vast majority of enrollees in the ACA they're paying a very competitive rate especially in states where they've set up their own exchanges. There are those whose income is too high not to qualify for subsidy and those folks are getting hit with very high premiums. But even those of us with a corporate plan are paying very high premiums and our employers are paying even more on average.

The issue of high premiums isn't so much an ACA issue, it's endemic to health care costs in general. In a macro sense, the increase in premiums as a percentage of GDP has slowed precipitously since the passage of the ACA.
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My premium went up 50% for 2017. No change in status, no claims. Precisely one choice (LMAO) of insurance vendor.

ACA imposed a lot of additional requirements for a plan to be "compliant" and added "expensive" people to the actuarial pool which raised premiums far above the "normal" annual increases, and even high deductible "bronze" plans have a 2-person family deductible high enough to buy a decent used car every year.

If you are not covered by an employer sponsored plan, your only choice for not being taxed is to buy an ACA "approved' plan unless you have special political "status" granted to various co-conspirators.
 
paflyer said:
My premium went up 50% for 2017. No change in status, no claims. Precisely one choice (LMAO) of insurance vendor.
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That there is the problem. The largest rate hikes have come from states where insurance companies are pulling out of the marketplace. This is particularly a problem in the states that opted to net set up a local exchange.

The 'expensive' people are the ones who need the coverage the most. I suppose we could just put them on a Medicare-type plan and spread their costs across 300mm taxpayers which would be more cost effective than increasing private health premiums. That way, the rest of us cheap/healthy people could still have insurance but not have to absorb the high risk pools... Taxes go up slightly but premiums go down significantly.
 
About a year after BasicMed goes into affect we will all have answered how it will work and how well it will work.
 
Maybe, but I doubt there will be too many docs who have a problem signing off. You don't get into medicine in today's age if you're concerned about lawsuits. My doctor would sign pretty much anything I needed him to.

That said, the whole thing is just as much trouble as getting a new Class 3 so I'll pass the "Basic Med" for the present. The whole bill is another example of why the Congress is inept. Should have been a simple driver's license medical a la sport pilots. Probably will be in the next few years, I imagine.
 
Who is the doctor in Massachusetts? I haven't found one yet for some of my students.
 
Palmpilot said:
Regarding the thread title, has anyone considered the possibility that "may" and "may not" have exactly the same information content? :yingyang:
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Skeptics have a little mental trick...

Whenever you hear he word "may" in a claim, mentally add "or may not".

Real claim in the news: "Tomatoes contain lycopene, a carotenoid—or plant pigment—which may prevent prostate cancer."

Or may not!
 
Every doctor I have talked to has told me they would have no problem signing the form. So I went to my doctor for my annual Monday. He says nope, I don't do FAA exams. I am sure he thought it was a class 3 medical and I wasn't in the mood to argue so I called s local AME and asked if they did them. No problem, come on in. Showed up this am, for the exam, he signed the form, I came home and did the course, now I'm all set for 4 years unless something rears its ugly head. Glad to know that at least some AMEs will do them.

He did comment that the basicmed seemed like more work for him than the class3. But I'm sure that's because he had done thousands of the other and this is new.

Anyway, my class 3 is still valid for a while but I'm going to enjoy using this until I get a plane that goes above 18,000 feet
 
MassPilot said:
Good point. If you're denied a medical for any reason you're in a pretty bad position but if your doctor refuses to sign the BasicMed form you can just find another doctor. It's like a flight review. You can't fail it, just not pass it.
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Who needs a medical exam anyway? If we are trusted to self-certify anyway why waste the money going to a doctor. Just ask around, find a doc (a cheap one) who is clueless, get your BasicMed rubber-stamped, pull chocks and fly. Easy.
 
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