Avionics- What systems would YOU do?

[455 Bravo Uniform]

The overlays are easy to fix, in my opinion.

On the back of cracks I used adhesive fiberglass tape (the kind for drywall), liquid superglue, and baking soda, layering the glue and soda. It’s a technique I learned building model rockets. Don’t breathe the vapors/fumes, they are not good.

On the front, I used Bondo glazing and spot putty.

I fixed my pilot side - it was in 2 complete separate pieces, and had 3-4 cracks.

The copilot side was a mess, I didn’t even try; I just got plane plastics.

Worst case, if they break it, you can fix it. I also have a pilot side for sale buried in the classifieds somewhere.

 

[Lynn Dixon]

Lynn...I'm not sure on the actual wiring. Without the TruTrak Aspen integration yet I'm told the TruTrak head will have to be sent back for updating. There was no mention made on re-wiring so my assumption is that there is a data wire between the 2. The TruTrak is currently getting it's info from the Avidyne and there's no (data) switch.
Unit 74, it was just the plastic overlay that was cut and looks to have been done with a razor blade. I did have to clean it up a bit when I got it home. There are usually plastic panel overlays available reasonably at salvage. Here's one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Piper-PA-2...434711&hash=item3fbfa3e943:g:MjEAAOSwYpVcquA2

Yeah, I was REALLY hoping TruTrak would have had the firmware ready for upgraded while I was in the shop, so that my tech could send the unit in for upgrade while he had the panel apart. So, what it looks like we are going to do is leave the TruTrak wired to the IFD for now, but hes going to run a few extra wires from the aspen up to the trutrak and tie them off with a label for now. That way when I bring it back to do the upgrade, all the wires will be there and ready.

I havent been able to find out what happens to the TruTrak if the Aspen goes offline. I don't think the Aspen will fail-over the GPSS information from the Avidyne if the Aspen fails.

 

[1RTK1]

The overlays are easy to fix, in my opinion.

On the back of cracks I used adhesive fiberglass tape (the kind for drywall), liquid superglue, and baking soda, layering the glue and soda. It’s a technique I learned building model rockets. Don’t breathe the vapors/fumes, they are not good.

On the front, I used Bondo glazing and spot putty.

I fixed my pilot side - it was in 2 complete separate pieces, and had 3-4 cracks.

The copilot side was a mess, I didn’t even try; I just got plane plastics.

Worst case, if they break it, you can fix it. I also have a pilot side for sale buried in the classifieds somewhere.

Another good way is to use window screen (which is coated fiberglass) with “black abs” pipe glue, has to be abs not pvc. Works wonders, add multiple layers if need for other areas such as plastic wheel pants etc.

 

[Unit74]

Yeah, I was REALLY hoping TruTrak would have had the firmware ready for upgraded while I was in the shop, so that my tech could send the unit in for upgrade while he had the panel apart. So, what it looks like we are going to do is leave the TruTrak wired to the IFD for now, but hes going to run a few extra wires from the aspen up to the trutrak and tie them off with a label for now. That way when I bring it back to do the upgrade, all the wires will be there and ready.

I havent been able to find out what happens to the TruTrak if the Aspen goes offline. I don't think the Aspen will fail-over the GPSS information from the Avidyne if the Aspen fails.

So if I understand this correctly, Aspen is selling the E5 touting that it works with Trutrak Vizion, but it actually does not, correct?

 

[Lynn Dixon]

So if I understand this correctly, Aspen is selling the E5 touting that it works with Trutrak Vizion, but it actually does not, correct?

No, that isn't correct at all. Aspen is advertising the full integration with TruTrak, which is indeed there. Like we have discussed in the past, TruTrak has to release a firmware update (that includes sending the TruTrak unit back in to them) that enables the update IN THE TRUTRAK. This has been know for a long time now. The problem is that TruTrak is waiting on the firmware to be approved by the FAA, which is backlogged. They only recently got the approvals for the 182 and pa-28's.

TruTrak and Aspen have both confirmed that the units work together quite well, with the new TruTrak firmware upgrade.....but....we are just waiting on the approval paperwork from the good ole FAA before the certificated public can send their TruTrak's in for the update.

 

[Unit74]

No, that isn't correct at all. Aspen is advertising the full integration with TruTrak, which is indeed there. Like we have discussed in the past, TruTrak has to release a firmware update (that includes sending the TruTrak unit back in to them) that enables the update IN THE TRUTRAK. This has been know for a long time now. The problem is that TruTrak is waiting on the firmware to be approved by the FAA, which is backlogged. They only recently got the approvals for the 182 and pa-28's.

TruTrak and Aspen have both confirmed that the units work together quite well, with the new TruTrak firmware upgrade.....but....we are just waiting on the approval paperwork from the good ole FAA before the certificated public can send their TruTrak's in for the update.

I guess I'm not one of those smart guys that gets it......I'll ask the question in a different way.

With an E5 and Aspen installed together today, does it work or not? I'm sure the GPS can drive the TT and bypass the E5, but I'd be really hesitant to install both hoping I could get them to work together "Someday". It's kind of the Trust But Verify type thing here or cart before the horse cliche's. I want my money to spent of fully working gear, not the hopes it will if and when the FAA gets to it. We saw what happened with the 182/PA32.... What was that, almost a year?

 

[Lynn Dixon]

I guess I'm not one of those smart guys that gets it......I'll ask the question in a different way.

With an E5 and Aspen installed together today, does it work or not? I'm sure the GPS can drive the TT and bypass the E5, but I'd be really hesitant to install both hoping I could get them to work together "Someday". It's kind of the Trust But Verify type thing here or cart before the horse cliche's. I want my money to spent of fully working gear, not the hopes it will if and when the FAA gets to it. We saw what happened with the 182/PA32.... What was that, almost a year?

AS of right now, the firmware for the TruTrak to unlock the Aspen integration is not available. Its at the FAA waiting on approvals. So if you get one installed now with an E5, its not going to work out of the box....until that firmware gets approved. This has been known since they announced the integration, and both TruTrak and Aspen have been very open, honest, and communicative about the firmware update process.

 

[Unit74]

AS of right now, the firmware for the TruTrak to unlock the Aspen integration is not available. Its at the FAA waiting on approvals. So if you get one installed now with an E5, its not going to work out of the box....until that firmware gets approved. This has been known since they announced the integration, and both TruTrak and Aspen have been very open, honest, and communicative about the firmware update process.

How are you driving yours?

 

[Lynn Dixon]

How are you driving yours?

Well right now we are still debating it. This is the current situation at the shop:

We are still very much in progress on it. I am having a crap ton of work done. Right now, since TruTrak doesn't have the firmware ready, I am leaving my TT wired up to the IFD540 for now....probably. My avionics shop is going to go ahead and run the wires from the Aspen over to the TruTrak, and then just label them, and tie them up somewhere for now. That way, when TruTrak gets the firmware ready, they can pull the head, send it off for the upgrade and then wire in the already-ran wires to the TruTraks harness.

The tech is going to call TruTrak and find out if he can go ahead and get it all wired up and just let it do normal GPSS commands for now via the Aspen, and then once the upgrade is ready, the baro, altitude and heading integrations will just work after the upgrade.

 

[Unit74]

Let me know when you find out... I was thinking about taking the plunge but dropping in the dysfunctional TT and ripping out a working AP is not my idea of an upgrade.

 

[Jesse Saint]

Actually, the TruTrak people are waiting for the Aspen people to finish their data utout so the TruTrak can read it, so the Aspen is not ready yet. Also, “full integration” is WAY down the road. Hopefully this summer TruTrak will release a software update that will get some data from the Aspen, but the features that Aspen is claiming they will give is likely a year or two into the future, certainly at their current pace of not even getting working E5/RSM combinations.

 

[Lynn Dixon]

This is what is frustrating. Too many different stories. When I talked to TruTrak a couple weeks ago, they had everything they needed and said the firmware was at the faa waiting in approval.

When I talked to Mr. Smith at Aspen, he said the same thing.... TruTrak has everything they needed from them (aspen ) and that TruTrak was working on the firmware

 

[Unit74]

Actually, the TruTrak people are waiting for the Aspen people to finish their data utout so the TruTrak can read it, so the Aspen is not ready yet. Also, “full integration” is WAY down the road. Hopefully this summer TruTrak will release a software update that will get some data from the Aspen, but the features that Aspen is claiming they will give is likely a year or two into the future, certainly at their current pace of not even getting working E5/RSM combinations.

Your not helping me waste money bro.... Seriously. Can't you let a guy **** away his cash on gear that doesn't work in peace?




Actually, tanks for your input.

 

[Jesse Saint]

Let me know when you find out... I was thinking about taking the plunge but dropping in the dysfunctional TT and ripping out a working AP is not my idea of an upgrade.

What is dysfunctional about the TruTrak? Honestly, I may be handy to have a heading bug on the G5 or Aspen to drive the TruTrak, but the TT works perfectly fine without that. I have about 15 TT’s in the lineup to install, and have installed dozens of them already. They work great. Depending on. What you have now, the TT is a huge upgrade without any G5 or Aspen integration.

 

[Unit74]

That they are touting it as an integrated system but you are saying it will be years? Perhaps the problem is I don't know what the damn thing will actual do with an Aspen. I guess the question is if your put in an Aspen and a TT, what WONT it do that is should do? At this point I have no idea what the combo will do, wont do or what it should do.

 

[Lynn Dixon]

All they have been touting as far as advertised integrations is:

1. Baro sync -- only have to set the baro pressure on the Aspen and it will sync to the TruTrak...no more setting it in both places
2. Heading bug follow -- This allows the TruTrak to follow a magnetic heading, that is dialed in on the Aspen. The TruTrak, out of the box will follow a course (based on GPS track) but not mag heading.

Other than that, the TruTrak will still follow any and all GPSS commands sent to it. Which covers the major bulk of what pilots are flying anyways. You will still need a Navigator wired to either the TruTrak or the Aspen. The Aspen can send GPSS commands to the TruTrak when it has nav information from a source.

Now.. there have been *rumors* going around that TruTrak and Aspen have been working on adding some more bonus things. The ability for the trutrak to use whatever altitude is set on the altitude bug on the E5 is one. I really hope this one gets added, because it will essentially keep all interactions with the TruTrak on the Aspen.

I will echo Jesse's statements. The TruTrak is no where near "dysfunctional". Its an excellent bit of kit, and I absolutely love flying behind mine. I've been a happy TruTrak customer in my Cardinal since July of last year. Best money I have spent on my entire plane.

 

[Unit74]

Had a convo with Aspen and Trutrak.....

No, the Aspen does not talk to the Trutrak.... Yet. Trutrak is estimating OSH for the release of compatibility with Aspen software 2.10. Legacy Aspen Pro 1000 owners on software 2.9.1 will not be supported by Trutrak. Right now, an E5 Trutrak install basically ends up with two unsynced devices. When Trutrak releases the software, the Vizion head must be pulled and sent in to Trutrak for updating. No field software updates allowed. Also, to speed up turn around time, Trutrak is not going to send you YOUR head back. You will get an exchange. This also triggers a logbook entry.

So at this point, the choice is to install them and then spend an additional $250 for the R&R after OSH or not install it in the hopes they will be done after OSH....... Hour in labor each day plus shipping to and from. Does it make any sense to install a TT and E5 right now? I'd have to say no.

 

[Jesse Saint]

I'd say that installing the TruTrak now makes sense. I'd say installing the E5 now doesn't make sense until they get the RSM issue resolved. I haven't heard a thing from them now at 3+ weeks since the RSM failure determination. When they get it resolved, then the E5 makes sense. Both items are great products independent of each other. The benefit of the interface is, IMHO, not all it is cut out to be. It may be nice, but isn't a deal maker or breaker in my book.

At least my shop, and maybe others, will probably end up having a small stock of programmers with the new software for a live swap. In other words, you fly in, we swap programmers, you fly out with the new software. Then your unit goes back to TruTrak for the software update and calibration (which is why you can do a software update in the field), and will be returned to swap for the next guy. The cost will probably be, as Unit74 said, about $250, but there will be no down time.

 

[Lynn Dixon]

I Dunno I actually think it's very much worthwhile... Which is why I am doing exactly that right now. The E5 let's me pull my vacuum system now, gives me a really great display with tons of info ans it pairs with my IFD540..

Mty TruTrak will still work like normal. I don't nt need an E5 to drive it. It flies fine and perfect right off the IFD540. If I have to wait till osh to get baro sync and heading bug sync... No big deal. I can still fly approaches and enjoy the TruTrak in its entirety now.

And I am not locked into Garmin walled garden. And I have a super easy upgrade path to get way more features than the G5 could ever offered.

 

[Unit74]

Yes, very true. But as a buyer, Aspen is touting this on their sales brochures. If I were to put it in and then discover it is BS, I’d have heartache over it. It’s about on par with Garmin saying it will interface with a Trutrak....someday .......in the future. Or Raptor Aircraft having a airplane to sell....someday.

I also think it’s a mistake not to work on Pro 1000 software. In the max upgrade, I don’t think the juice is worth the squeeze for a lot of owners. But the AP does have a market with these same buyers when their legacy goes tits up.... the repair isn’t worth the reward.