Avgas cost in 1965?

cgrab

cgrab

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cgrab
Trying to find things on the internet are so frustrating....Can someone remember what the average cost of avgas was in 1965?

It was easy to find auto gas was 30 cents per gallon.
 
While you're developing prices, also look into wages: how long did it take to earn the post-tax moneyntomoay for that tank of fuel?
 
Be sure to work inflation backwards along with it. Some things back in the day weren’t as cheap as they seem.
 
Yea, I'm able to get all that, but no where can I find the avgas price.
 
I paid 30 cents/gal in 1966, at Wally's @ Evergreen Field, Vancouver, WA.

Wally was the best of the best. Thanks to the original unknown photographer.

X9a2ur.jpg
 
That was before the EPA existed. The EPA declared lead a toxic substance and took it out of auto fuel, and now AV gas needs special handling to avoid contaminating auto fuel. Also, a refinery can make a year's supply of AV Gas in a day, so they keep the price up to make it worth their while. Note: Lead is toxic, and removing it from auto gas was a good idea. But, the real reason it came out of auto gas is because it clogs up catalytic converters that eliminate other emissions. They have really cleaned up smog in CA.
 
Fun fact, after they eliminated lead from gasoline, the average IQ of the US population jumped a few points.
 
Another fun fact, after they eliminated lead from gasoline, crime rates in cities declined.
 
I remember my dad telling his gas avgas was 28 cents/gallon (purchased in bulk for his ag business and personal flying) when he was flying his Stinson SM-6000 Trimotor and giving rides in at AAA Fly-In at Ottuwa (pre-Blakesburg) and EAA Fly-In at Rockford (pre-Oshkosh). He bought it in 1964 and started taking it to those events around 1965.

His new Ford pickup truck bought in 1965 was $2600.
 
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Don't forget that in the 1960s there were three grades of avgas commonly used by GA airplanes - 80/87 (red), 91/96 (blue) and 100/130 (green), each progressively more expensive. At many smaller airports 91 octane was not available, so owners of those airplanes had to spring for the pricier "good green gas" 100.

The economics of the different grades were often a factor in aircraft sales. That's why, for example, in the late '50s Piper sold Tri-Pacers with a choice of 150 hp (80 octane) or 160 hp (91 octane) engines concurrently, and later did the same with Cherokees until 1968. The 160 hp versions cost only a little more to buy new, and had slightly better performance with only a little higher fuel consumption -- but the more expensive 91 or 100 fuel made a big difference in direct operating costs.

The 160 hp version of the O-320 almost disappeared from new airplanes (the Twin Comanche was one exception) from about 1968 until 80 octane fuel became scarce, and eventually discontinued, in the mid 1970s with the advent of the single grade 100LL. Plug fouling became an issue with lower-compression engines on a steady diet of 100LL, so the manufacturers brought back the higher-compression O-320s (e.g. "Skyhawk/100" and "Warrior II" both in 1977), which played better with 100LL. Since there was no longer a choice of fuel grades, operating expenses were not significantly increased over the previous models.
 
I think both Sunoco 260 (102 octane) and avgas were selling for 32 cents a gallon in Peekskill, NY in 1967.
You could still get 140/170 octane avgas for about 60 cents a gallon. There was still a bunch of WWII surplus iron flying around at that time.
 
In 1965 I can remember taking my bicycle to the neighborhood gas station with a quarter in my pocket to fill up the gallon gas can for the lawn mower. Seems cheap until you adjust for inflation. That 25 cents in 1965 is equivalent to a little over $2 in purchasing power today.

The inflation adjusted price for aviation gasoline has historically hovered around an inflation-adjusted price of $4-5 per gallon (in today's dollars), with fairly large swings caused by world petroleum supplies. Aviation gasoline is now a low volume specialty fuel that requires more expensive transportation
(i.e. barges, not pipelines) due to its TEL content. (TEL was removed from auto fuels in the 70s) Both of these factors result in a much higher price than would be expected from the raw material content alone. When I started flying in the 80s, 80/87 was in the neighborhood of $2 per gallon.
 
OK, then, tell me. When we "gasahol" gasoline, we simply take the tanker that is going to transport the gasoline, dump in the prescribed amount of alcohol, and "slosh mix" it on the way to your favorite gas station. Why can't we add the tetraethyl lead at the point of service instead of the bulk gasoline in the pipeline?

Jim
 
I guess you could if you wanted to handle something as toxic as TEL. But, the real question how would that change anything?
 
Pilawt said:
Don't forget that in the 1960s there were three grades of avgas commonly used by GA airplanes - 80/87 (red), 91/96 (blue) and 100/130 (green), each progressively more expensive. At many smaller airports 91 octane was not available, so owners of those airplanes had to spring for the pricier "good green gas" 100. .
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I was line boy at the Cessna dealer at Teterboro, 1958/9 & part of 60. we had 80/87 red, 100/130 green, and 115/145 purple. all the big radials used 115/145. I never saw anything but purple, until I got back into GA in 1990.
But I don't remember what the price was.
 
weirdjim said:
OK, then, tell me. When we "gasahol" gasoline, we simply take the tanker that is going to transport the gasoline, dump in the prescribed amount of alcohol, and "slosh mix" it on the way to your favorite gas station. Why can't we add the tetraethyl lead at the point of service instead of the bulk gasoline in the pipeline?

Jim
Click to expand...

You would have to ask a refiner about the relevant regulations. But avgas is a very low volume product with significantly different composition from automobile fuels. And TEL is extremely toxic and requires specialized handling.

In the NE US avgas is shipped by barge to very few storage terminals. For us, its Philly or Montreal. That's it. Something like two batches a year are made. If your airport can't receive a full tanker load at a time it is more expensive to purchase.
 
chemgeek said:
You would have to ask a refiner about the relevant regulations. But avgas is a very low volume product with significantly different composition from automobile fuels. And TEL is extremely toxic and requires specialized handling.

In the NE US avgas is shipped by barge to very few storage terminals. For us, its Philly or Montreal. That's it. Something like two batches a year are made. If your airport can't receive a full tanker load at a time it is more expensive to purchase.
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We get as little as 3000 gallons upon request. Our local distributor even carries it out to the Islands by tank truck on the Wa. state ferries.
 
Ben2k9 said:
Fun fact, after they eliminated lead from gasoline, the average IQ of the US population jumped a few points.
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Your "Fun fact" means nothing without a link to the study. What date is used to determine when lead was removed from gasoline, 1976 or 1996? How did they determine the correlation? The truth is that the average IQ of the US population has been going up since long before anyone was worried about lead in gasoline.

Here's a fun fact. Glaciers have been receding at an alarming rate since lead was removed from gasoline. And here is the problem with that statement. Glaciers have been receding since the end of the Little Ice Age around 1850.
 
I recently watched an episode of Autoline Weekly and the guest was Dan Nicholson from GM's propulsion division and if you watch towards the end, they reveal that GM and the other automakers are lobbing the government to move the country to a single fuel that will help them achieve the higher CAFE ratings that are mandated. They are talking about just one grade only available at the pump and it would be 95 octane.

Of course it would be unleaded, so I got to thinking, this might be a good thing for GA. I think 95 would run every piston GA plane out there and if the whole country is buying it, the cost should be pretty reasonable, likely closer to what regular costs now. The only question would be about the use of ethanol or not. Here's a link to the show-

 
Crashnburn said:
That was before the EPA existed. The EPA declared lead a toxic substance and took it out of auto fuel, and now AV gas needs special handling to avoid contaminating auto fuel. Also, a refinery can make a year's supply of AV Gas in a day, so they keep the price up to make it worth their while. Note: Lead is toxic, and removing it from auto gas was a good idea. But, the real reason it came out of auto gas is because it clogs up catalytic converters that eliminate other emissions. They have really cleaned up smog in CA.
Click to expand...

So you’re saying lead was REMOVED from auto gas, or no longer ADDED? ;)
 
IIRC Dad was paying about 30 to 50 cents a gallon for 80 octane, and complaining about the high price. In 1979 100LL was 60 cents, and regular car gas was ~45 cents. Then, in the course of a few months, 100ll went to nearly a dollar, and car gas went to 75 cents.

I still have no clue why the alcohol was added. I heard from one source that it was done to increase the octane rating of the gas, and another told me that it was to use less oil per gallon, thus conserving fuel. Reason #2 is certainly counter productive, as the alcohol content means that more fuel must be burned to do the same job, as alcohol free fuel.
 
Ben2k9 said:
Fun fact, after they eliminated lead from gasoline, the average IQ of the US population jumped a few points.
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And yet still about half the population is below median intelligence. We gotta fix that.
 
topgun260 said:
Here's a fun fact. Glaciers have been receding at an alarming rate since lead was removed from gasoline. And here is the problem with that statement. Glaciers have been receding since the end of the Little Ice Age around 1850.
Click to expand...

And yet some folks would have you believe that it is caused by "global warming", as if that was a recent development and it's all our fault.
 
Tom-D said:
never heard of that stuff.
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It was developed for aircraft in WWII. One of the reasons US aircraft could run with such high manifold pressures.
They still make it, but only for Reno Unlimited Class racers.
 
bluerooster said:
IIRC Dad was paying about 30 to 50 cents a gallon for 80 octane, and complaining about the high price. In 1979 100LL was 60 cents, and regular car gas was ~45 cents. Then, in the course of a few months, 100ll went to nearly a dollar, and car gas went to 75 cents.

I still have no clue why the alcohol was added. I heard from one source that it was done to increase the octane rating of the gas, and another told me that it was to use less oil per gallon, thus conserving fuel. Reason #2 is certainly counter productive, as the alcohol content means that more fuel must be burned to do the same job, as alcohol free fuel.
Click to expand...

It's also added for smog reduction reasons and to support the Iowa corn farmer lobby.
 
Dav8or said:
I recently watched an episode of Autoline Weekly and the guest was Dan Nicholson from GM's propulsion division and if you watch towards the end, they reveal that GM and the other automakers are lobbing the government to move the country to a single fuel that will help them achieve the higher CAFE ratings that are mandated. They are talking about just one grade only available at the pump and it would be 95 octane.

Of course it would be unleaded, so I got to thinking, this might be a good thing for GA. I think 95 would run every piston GA plane out there and if the whole country is buying it, the cost should be pretty reasonable, likely closer to what regular costs now. The only question would be about the use of ethanol or not. Here's a link to the show-

Click to expand...

It may not be so simple to bridge the gap to avgas, as aviation fuel has to meet different fuel standards, including but not limited to vapor pressure and oxygenate content.
 
chemgeek said:
It may not be so simple to bridge the gap to avgas, as aviation fuel has to meet different fuel standards, including but not limited to vapor pressure and oxygenate content.
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It may, or may not be a drop in replacement, but it has to be a hell of a lot easier to convert to aviation than what we're doing now. Just eliminating the TEL will go a long ways to reducing the cost.
 
Kenny Phillips said:
And yet still about half the population is below median intelligence. We gotta fix that.
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I can’t tell from the way it’s written, but certainly hope this is a joke
 
Ghery said:
The last sentence probably is a joke, but the first is a simple statement of what median means.
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Yeah. By definition half the population will always be below the median. No matter if our median IQs jump to genius levels. Statistics!
 
There certainly are some below median posts in this thread... :rofl:
 
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