Average Dual Time Before Solo - I Know - Everyone is Different

realistically, it took me 35 years to solo. I should have gotten my ppl 10-15 years ago but i figured I couldn't afford to fly once I got it.
 
After 12 hours over 18 months at a towered field, I flew solo. The key metric was 6 hours over four flights in the two weeks prior to solo. But that was 35 years ago, life was simpler then.

My time from there to my first certificate (9 years and 321 hours) is not appropriate for this discussion.

So, it depends.
 
24 to solo
64 tt to ppl
5 months total
$40 plane $23 CFI in 2005
Don't worry about the numbers. I looked at it as I was only really spending money on the CFI as I would have been renting anyway.....
 
While there is an average, understand that the standard deviation is huge. The shortest I've heard was around 5 or 6 hours, but some folks have taken over 100. Don't worry about it. Just enjoy flying, progress at your own pace, and keep writing check after check after check.....

Look at it this way. Once you're licensed, you'll continue to spend money to fly. The only difference is right now you're paying a pittance to a CFI. Don't think of it in terms of total dollars per hour; the only extra cost you're seeing while training is the instructor cost.
 
bobmrg said:
If you do not have a map, how will you know when you have arrived? Your instructor has forgotten what he had to know in order to become a CFI. A written syllabus gives both of you the path to your goal; insist on one. When I was an examiner back in the dark ages I would occasionally have to fail an applicant on a maneuver that s/he said "my instructor never taught me that." A syllabus insures that everything in the Airman Certification Standards is covered (you should get the ACS from www.faa.gov and print it out). Additionally, IMHO two hours is too long...in my experience, after the first hour everything the instructor says bounces off and is not retained. That obviously does not apply to cross-country flights.

Bob Gardner
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I agree with Bob. You need a map. You need to know your current position, destination and heading (figuratively speaking, of course).

Here is one I used to hand out to my students, with a separate document that elaborates on each task. It is broken down into pre-solo, cross-country, night, and checkride-prep.
 

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CC268 said:
OMG you introduce spins in primary training?! You SAVAGE
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James spins the airplane only to get the Millennial's attention away from texting on their phone during a lesson. :D

Actually, I think those are damn good things to learn (spin recovery included).
I experienced three full spins and recoveries in a 150 on the Cessna fam flight back in 1974. I was hooked after that.
 
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texasclouds said:
My dad claims he soloed in 6 hours (back in the 70-80s)...
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What was allowable in the 1970s is difficult today. The insurance companies have more to say about it now, so schools will err on the conservative side. 9 - 10 hours is probably about the minimum before most instructors will sign off now.
 
Understand that there are many variables involved. I went through 4 CFIs; 3 left for airlines. I'd get to the point of being ready to solo, the CFI would quit, I'd be grounded for several weeks before I could get into a new CFIs schedule, fall back down the learning curve, and have to fly some more to get ready again.

Airplane maintenance can ground you. Weather can ground you. Family and life can ground you. Every time you go a while without flying, your skills degrade and you have to work back up again.

Also, the guy who flies out of a tower controlled airport will spend more time taxiing and waiting than the guy who flies out of an uncontrolled field.
 
I soloed at 7 hours on my 1st lesson in a C-172 on 11/21/1987. The C-150 was down for maintenance so we flew the 172 instead. After about 7 take offs and landings my instructor asked if I wanted to solo. I then did 3 solo takes offs and landing .

I had been reading everything I could about flying since I was old enough to hold a book or magazine. I had been flying Radio Controlled airplanes for about 12 years and grew up on a farm operating all types of different equipment. I also flew out of a sleepy little non-towered airport with almost no other traffic.

I now teach at that same airport. My rule of thumb is I won't solo anyone under 10 hours, unless there are extenuating circumstances, like unlogged experience. There is a lot more traffic to deal with than when I learned. I feel that you just haven't seen a representative # of things that can and do happen in the traffic pattern in under 10 hours of experience. My students pretty consistently solo around 15 hours. But some exceptions. Also solo time may have little representation of how much time or cost it will take to get your certificate. I currently have a student that may not solo until about 40 hours due to some extenuating circumstances, but I expect he will still get his certificate at about mine and the national average of about 65 hours.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
The regulation says you have to receive training and demonstrate satisfactory proficiency and safety, as judged by an authorized instructor, on these maneuvers and procedures to solo:

1) Proper flight preparation procedures, including preflight planning and preparation, powerplant operation, and aircraft systems;

(2) Taxiing or surface operations, including runups;

(3) Takeoffs and landings, including normal and crosswind;

(4) Straight and level flight, and turns in both directions;

(5) Climbs and climbing turns;

(6) Airport traffic patterns, including entry and departure procedures;

(7) Collision avoidance, windshear avoidance, and wake turbulence avoidance;

(8) Descents, with and without turns, using high and low drag configurations;

(9) Flight at various airspeeds from cruise to slow flight;

(10) Stall entries from various flight attitudes and power combinations with recovery initiated at the first indication of a stall, and recovery from a full stall;

(11) Emergency procedures and equipment malfunctions;

(12) Ground reference maneuvers;

(13) Approaches to a landing area with simulated engine malfunctions;

(14) Slips to a landing; and

(15) Go-arounds.

Some instructors believe this minimum is adequate and your pre-solo hours should be rather low. Other instructors believe this minimum is inadequate and your pre-solo hours will be higher.

So unless you are using the same instructor and the same syllabus, comparing hours to solo mean nothing.
 
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My CFI Responded to my email and said 'We have an online Course that allows me to track your progress, but as it is clear to me knowledge wise, that you have already completed Ground school, there is no need for you to burn $350. Here is the Cessna branded training guide we use. Print it out and we will track your progress from there.'

A CFI that doesn't make me pay extra money is a good CFI :)
 
I've solo'd 71(75 hopefully by this weekend) people at 12.5 hours. Some I would have solo'd at 5-6 hours but being 141 I can't deviate from syllabus.
Flying often and giving a damn being the big keys to soloing "early". Also age, younger guys listen and are more likely to just jump right in. The old guys i've flown with sometimes are terrified of radio work, or seem more likely to want me to do something. IE windy day you take the landing.
 
Personally I believe much depends on your instructor. Not how good he is, but rather how picky he is. I demanded a higher level of competence than some of my peers.
 
Absolutey irrelevant. Everyone is different, and it's not wise to look for a yardstick. I'm in the same category as Wannfly.
 
falconkidding said:
seem more likely to want me to do something. IE windy day you take the landing.
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What is your technique to overcome that and get them to do the landing?
 
TVProducer said:
My CFI Responded to my email and said 'We have an online Course that allows me to track your progress, but as it is clear to me knowledge wise, that you have already completed Ground school, there is no need for you to burn $350. Here is the Cessna branded training guide we use. Print it out and we will track your progress from there.'

A CFI that doesn't make me pay extra money is a good CFI :)
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A good CFI is one that ensures you are safe to fly. Sometimes that costs more money. Mine did a debrief after every flight at $50 an hour and I was fine with that.
 
Okay this thread is getting a bit out of hand. I am going to provide clarification because my original post may have misled. Money is not a factor when it comes to Aviation training. I mean yeah sure we all would save a buck if we could but would I rather spend an extra 2k on training or skip that and end up on an AOPA Accident Case Study Video? I’ll take the training over anything. By me asking an average it was just for me to get a range. In no way do I think safety is a sideline item in this. I will continue to train until I get my PPL. Could that be in 12 hours maybe, what about 50, could be, I don’t know yet. The reality is that I’m knee deep and until I’m ready my CFI will continue to train me. I looked at the syllabus and it’s comprehensive. I appreciate everyone’s input and financial input as to what they paid. At the end of the day as many of you said, I’m essentially paying for the instructor because the plane will cost money regardless license or no license if you’re renting.
 
Kenny Lee said:
It is going to cost you $150 an hour to fly after you have your PPL. So change your spreadsheet to reflect $50 an hour for the training. Thats what I told my wife it costs
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And uh how’d that work out? Haha
 
The thing to remember is that it is not a race. You solo when in the judgment of your instructor you can safely fly the plane and land it without pranging it. More than once. You'll probably have an inkling when you are ready. Learn and fly safe.
 
TVProducer said:
My CFI Responded to my email and said 'We have an online Course that allows me to track your progress, but as it is clear to me knowledge wise, that you have already completed Ground school, there is no need for you to burn $350. Here is the Cessna branded training guide we use. Print it out and we will track your progress from there.'

A CFI that doesn't make me pay extra money is a good CFI :)
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I'm good with that.

Bob
 
As a CFI my students don’t solo unti they are proficient in everything covered in 61.87. The average is around 20 to 25 hours. If my students can’t do full stall recovery they can’t solo.

As everyone has stated, it all depends on the individuals. You can grasp it all easily and solo in 10 hours, or you can solo in 40 hours.
 
I flew once a week until I solo'd which happened at about 17 hours for me. Then I flew twice a week until my check ride which was at about 45 hours. Took me about 3 month start to finish doing it that way.

If I'd flown twice a week from the start I'd guess I probably would have solo'd a few hours sooner. Bottom line is the more often you fly, the faster it goes.

Something else to keep in mind. I really didn't focus on trying to solo by any particular time. My attitude was it'll happen when my CFI thinks I'm ready. And for sure, my CFI thought I was ready before I really felt ready. Mind you, I didn't feel dangerous when he turned me loose the first time, but I think I definitely felt like I wasn't 'done' yet.

In fact we were doing touch and goes and they were mostly safe but not particularly pretty. Then after a landing that I thought was just absolutely ugly and made me feel like I wasn't getting it, he said pull off on the taxiway here for minute. I thought great, I'm not getting it and he sees that so we're going to stop and he's going to impart some wisdom on me that will help me get this down. Nope. Instead he said I'm jumping out, take it around by yourself. WTF? Did you see that last landing? He said yep. That was all you and you kept it under control and nothing got bent. You're fine. Now go do it by yourself. I thought about it for a minute and realized he was right and I couldn't really argue otherwise, so off I went.

Fly as much as you can and get it done and enjoy every minute of it.
 
The biggest concern I'd have for the OP is that if he's on the schedule one day a week at this time of year, he may not get to fly a lot, and that will add to his total hours. Where I'm sitting, yesterday would have been too windy. Today and tomorrow are perfect, but Saturday through Monday are likely to be total washouts. if he gets too many cancellations, he could be looking at 20 or 25 hours where if he got to fly more he could be soloing at 12 or 15.
 
One other thing to consider: the student can always say no. As I was working a stressful job in between lessons, I told my instructor to simply not tell me I was ready. One day, after landing at a rural airport nearby, I told him to get out, and I did a few laps. Waiting until it's a no-brainer is a good thing (if you can afford it.)
 
I don't know if this has been said here because I don't have time to read the whole thread...but in the event you dont know, your solo isn't the end of your training. You will still have solo hours, cross country work, often flight reviews with a different instructor all in preparation for your check ride.

Also, expect to fork over five c-notes, or so, to your examiner.

At our flight school in VA, PPLs take 40 hours, or so, depending on the student.

Good luck!


Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
I was around 23 or so, I don't think there is a good and hard fast rule, but indulge me a quick story that I think could be of benefit to some:

I was getting close to 20 and hadn't soloed and for good reason: I was not ready-period. I always felt behind the plane, I was terriblly uncomfortable with landing-I was doing a poor job I felt. I wondered in my head, "I've heard the average is around 10-12, and I don't even feel close I wonder if I'm just not 'cut out' to be a pilot" Which bothered me deeply as it had been a life long dream. I read an article in Pilot Training about "Instructor/Student" match up, and one day when my instructor was out of town I really just wanted to fly, so I called the neighboring airport to see if they had a plane and instructor available, they did. I drove over and Jack and I jumped into their 150 there was a slight crosswind which made me terribley nervous, and when I say slight-I mean slight. We taxied out and I had warned Jack that my proficiency was low. I took off with no assistance and he said, "Your crosswind handling was fantastic" I explained to him I had a tough time with slipping it to be straight at landing, so we flew in a slip for miles over a road. Went back and pegged the landing. I asked Jack if I could switch to him, he said he was real tied up to take on a full student but Fred could take me, and if I didn't like Fred just give him a few weeks and he would be open enough. I went with Fred and had just as good of a time as I did with Jack. I notified my first instructor I would be changing and thanked him for all his time to that point. I flew with Fred about 2 hours and he hopped out to "go to the bathroom" and said, "I'm grabbing my handheld, i'll drive out on taxi way, now go do 3 take offs and landings, I usually don't solo people with an 8-10mph crosswind but you got it". I went and did it!

The moral of the story is be conscious of instructor/student match up. This does not mean that if you haven't pulled it off in 12.1hr its time for a switch- but I just knew something wasn't right as I approached 20 with little progress the last 10 or so... I remain to this day convinced it was an instructor/student mis-match, especially considering how smooth it went those next few hours. Does that mean my first instructor was a bad CFI? By no means! I know of multiple people whom he's helped get their ticket- it means my learning style and his teaching style didn't gel well together. So take as long as you need to be safe and proficient. But also be aware if you are "stalled" in progress to maybe try someone else for an hour or three to see if its different, it sure made all the difference in the world for me... I had learned a ton in those first 20, but hadn't been able to apply it, Jack and Fred helped me apply what the first guy had taught me and it all just "clicked". So not to be redundant, but I'm not advocating hopping all around because of a lesson that didn't go awesome or things are taking a bit longer than hoped, but be couscous of your progress, if you are making progress hold the course. If you feel stalled out in progress for a bit try a different CFI and see if a different style of teaching helps... And again if you need to change up that it doesn't mean the instructor was poor, it may just mean learning and teaching styles were not a match. My first instructor and I had no hard feelings over this and I met up with him several years after getting my ticket at an airport an hour from home by chance and he was so happy to see me out flying.
 
I actually enjoyed the solo x country time while training more than my first solo. The first solo is a little tense, so once you've achieved that, the short x country solo endorsement to nearby airports makes you feel like a real pilot!
 
Hippike said:
Well, then you will never experience what I experienced (2016-2017 pricing): C172 for $167, CFI for $90 per hour... and it took me 35-40 hours to solo
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:eek: $90 for a CFI has GOT to be a typo. Holy smokes! Even if they were opposite sex and offered a little "hand propping" that's WAY too expensive.

AggieMike88 said:
What is your technique to overcome that and get them to do the landing?
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My CFI demonstrated a true west Texas high wind landing once in the 152 and told me the rest were mine. On a night flight I was crabbed nearly 45* down final and winds were "supposed" to be calm, he asked what the problem was (had already done like 3 stop and goes that were identical and they were beauties if I do say so myself) ... told him it was windy, he said "let me see" taking over on final ... his was the hardest landing I've ever experienced in a GA aircraft and he said we were done for the evening after his landing:rolleyes: I was surprised there was no damage.
 
danhagan said:
:eek: $90 for a CFI has GOT to be a typo. Holy smokes!
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Unfortunately NOT!
Once my CFI took off for the east coast I had to find a new one. School had 2-3 CFIs available. 2 of them were younger (charging $100/h) and the senior guy wanted to charge $120/h. I went to Van Nuys and found a CFI for $70 and finished training with him. This is California :(
 
It took me 10 hours to solo, which is right around average according to my CFI. Now at 48 TT, I'm waiting for the check ride, had to reschedule it to next week.
 
Solo for me was 26hrs, but I had one 1hr from 10 years before so I will go with 25hrs.

My CFI worked me on lots of stuff before we started landings. I think it took me like 6 or so sessions of just landing. He said I was great at everything, but struggled with the flare and on many days we had crosswinds (not terrible but enough to need a cross control slip). Then one calm night he solo'd me.

Here is what you will experience: If you solo at 15hrs you'll feel great. When you get to like 18hrs you'll feel like something is wrong. At 22hrs you will think you need a new CFI or its the plane. At 25hrs you'll wonder if you should just hang it up. All along you will also be thinking about money and how this will all end. Recommendation from someone who has been there: Forget about the money (if you have enough), relax and you will get it. Also, some of my sessions pushed close to 2hrs...it was way too much. I wish I would have limited them all to 75min or so and I think I actually would have soloed a bit sooner. Just my advice, others will see it different ways.

Good luck. Don't give up. Put away the spreadsheet and chair fly :)

One perk of taking 25hrs. My CFI, after just one extra session unleashed me for lots and lots of solo flights (was in my own plane). Those were especially memorable experiences too.
 
Unless you have a sweetheart deal, you're not getting out of this thing for anything less than $8-$10K total, regardless of how quickly you think you're progressing or when you plan to schedule your solo. You don't perform the maneuvers you listed once then move on, you will perform them over and over again gaining proficiency. As you have read, everyone gained that proficiency at different rates, depending on aptitude and life that got in the way along the road.

Budgeting training cost was an issue for most all of us. You're not alone there. Train as often as you can budget for! I hope you get through your training quickly!
 
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