Aug 18-19, 2012 - POA fly-in Shelter Cove

Pilots have told me two things:

1. The cloud (radar) on Foreflight is pretty good.

2. Do not trust the AWOS readings of airports further North, their weather is often very different.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Pilots have told me two things:

1. The cloud (radar) on Foreflight is pretty good.

2. Do not trust the AWOS readings of airports further North, their weather is often very different.
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Foreflight radar was pretty accurate, when I was in Oceano a couple of weeks ago. It was maybe 10 minutes lagged and gave a good picture. As you saw at LLR, the fog can be pretty regional. It hangs out in some areas and not in others.
 
Seems like the higher my altitude going there, the better "big picture" I'll get as to where I could come down and possibly get in under the clouds. It will be hard to judge ceilings though. I just looked at the four webcams now, facing four directions, not the best day today and it is already noon.

http://northcoastaviation.com/shelter_cove/shelter_cove_south.htm

I will do flight planning, but - this is going to be a new experience for me. Kind of like San Luis Obispo.... the AWOSes said one thing, and I flew up there and saw something totally different, then made my choices.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Seems like the higher my altitude going there, the better "big picture" I'll get as to where I could come down and possibly get in under the clouds. It will be hard to judge ceilings though. I just looked at the four webcams now, facing four directions, not the best day today and it is already noon.

http://northcoastaviation.com/shelter_cove/shelter_cove_south.htm

It is actually starting to break up now. Go back and look. Be sure to check the other facing cams.
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John221us said:
kimberlyanne546 said:
Seems like the higher my altitude going there, the better "big picture" I'll get as to where I could come down and possibly get in under the clouds. It will be hard to judge ceilings though. I just looked at the four webcams now, facing four directions, not the best day today and it is already noon.

http://northcoastaviation.com/shelter_cove/shelter_cove_south.htm

It is actually starting to break up now. Go back and look. Be sure to check the other facing cams.
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I did, I just wasn't sure. In Petaluma, I'm used to fog / Marine Layer but on those days I just cancel my flights. We shall see what happens. The BF keeps asking but I have to keep telling him we'll wait and see. I will drive the car if the afternoon comes and we still haven't departed Petaluma due to low ceilings (unlikely but possible).
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You can also select the "satellite" overlay on your Foreflight which gives you a pretty good idea of the fog distribution and trend.
 
Just thought of this - I wonder if they have a fee. For overnight, I mean. I'll need to get change then. And I'll probably bring envelopes, I've seen drop boxes before but never any envelopes. I should think it would be anywhere from 0 - 10 per night. Also, I might borrow chocks and stakes "just in case" from my flight school. I think someone said they have room for 10 planes, not sure if that was tie downs or what. I guess I should add rope to my list of things to bring as well.
 
We've got wx but sometimes it seems like the satellite view doesn't pick up low level stuff, we shall see.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Just thought of this - I wonder if they have a fee.
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As John notes, no fees at Shelter Cove.

But according to AOPA there are tiedown fees at Garberville, in case you need to land there. For that matter, there is allegedly fuel at Garberville, though the sectionals don't show any service ticks on o16.

By the way, if you delay your takeoff late enough due to weather, the chances of us syncing up in Garberville increases.

So far all the weather prognosis says flyable weather at least to Garberville (I may need to do some last minute rerouting due to forecast scattered t-storms in Oregon. I'd like to fly down the coast, but may have to fly south to roughly Redding then west to the coast.)
 
Group email sent, hoping it didn't go into everyone's "spam" since I sent website links inside. Sent to Jim, Jonathan, John, and Dan.
 
Tentative plans:


Saturday - 4pm - Location Shelter Cove Airport - Kimberly hosts a meeting near the runway (beer and light snacks will be provided, other beverages and food available inside the store if you so choose). Since I will be a customer of the deli, buying the beer / ice for my cooler there, they will let us use their tables / picnic area. I plan to be there 30-60 minutes just to put a face with a name for everyone (the only person I've met is John). This is an optional thing since we will all be meeting for dinner, and I created this meeting thinking we'd have "day trippers" stopping in for just the day so I wanted a way to see them / their planes.


Saturday - after meet and greet - back to the hotel to get ready for dinner. Hotel may lend Kimberly the van to drive everyone to dinner, not sure how far it would be to walk. I think we are all staying in the same hotel?


Saturday - dinner (unconfirmed, waiting for restaurant to call me back tonight) The Cove Restaurant, 7pm. Seafood (no menu online)? Full Bar, possible beach bonfire / walk afterwards if weather isn't too nasty.



I am no longer sure about the Sunday meeting since I'll need to leave when the weather tells me to leave and a lot depends on my plane being at Shelter Cove and not Garberville.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Tentative plans:


Saturday - 4pm - Location Shelter Cove Airport - Kimberly hosts a meeting near the runway (beer and light snacks will be provided, other beverages and food available inside the store if you so choose). Since I will be a customer of the deli, buying the beer / ice for my cooler there, they will let us use their tables / picnic area. I plan to be there 30-60 minutes just to put a face with a name for everyone (the only person I've met is John). This is an optional thing since we will all be meeting for dinner, and I created this meeting thinking we'd have "day trippers" stopping in for just the day so I wanted a way to see them / their planes.


Saturday - after meet and greet - back to the hotel to get ready for dinner. Hotel may lend Kimberly the van to drive everyone to dinner, not sure how far it would be to walk. I think we are all staying in the same hotel?


Saturday - dinner (unconfirmed, waiting for restaurant to call me back tonight) The Cove Restaurant, 7pm. Seafood (no menu online)? Full Bar, possible beach bonfire / walk afterwards if weather isn't too nasty.



I am no longer sure about the Sunday meeting since I'll need to leave when the weather tells me to leave and a lot depends on my plane being at Shelter Cove and not Garberville.
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Thanks for putting that together.

We're going to walk (we can always use the exercise,) so I don't think we'll need rides anywhere in Shelter Cove (excepting of course maybe to and from Garberville.)

I think Sunday is a departure day for most of us, so that's all that should be on our personal plans. We wont know till Saturday night for sure if some of us will need rides to Garberville where we can share expenses.
 
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Jim Logajan said:
Thanks for putting that together.

We're going to walk (we can always use the exercise,) so I don't think we'll need rides anywhere in Shelter Cove (excepting of course maybe to and from Garberville.)

I think Sunday is a departure day for most of us, so that's all that should be on our personal plans. We wont know till Saturday night for sure if some of us will need rides to Garberville where we can share expenses.
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Agreed, though I think the pilots landing on Thursday and Friday will have more options than us (attempt to land at Shelter Cove, fail, land somewhere else, try again to land at Shelter Cove, etc). You and I are only going for one night so we don't have as much time. I'm not sure if "nervous" is the right word but I'm very interested to see what I see, how I react, and how it all goes.

Last night, my boyfriend came over to my apartment and said something like "so do you know about landing there"? Cute that he was doing research. I guess he learned there is a scary dip or something in the middle, and "nasty crosswinds" cuz he watched "a mooney landing on You Tube there."

It shows he is into it though!
 
Oh and agree about Sunday - departing is all that is on the agenda. Though I'll be honest I'd like to spend some of the day in the area and not just leave right away. I'll be asking other pilots for their weather opinions, though. I'm a newbie.
 
What apps (I have android) will you all use for this XC? I'm trying to get the new AOPA one but it isn't showing up. Any others you all use right before / during flight? I have an iPad, with data, and foreflight, so I guess they could be "paid" ipad apps too....
 
Well Kim.... Good Luck!! Sounds like you have done quite the planning and contingency stuff! Now it is up to the weather. Are you giving your fly-in a name?

Gary
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
What apps (I have android) will you all use for this XC? I'm trying to get the new AOPA one but it isn't showing up. Any others you all use right before / during flight? I have an iPad, with data, and foreflight, so I guess they could be "paid" ipad apps too....
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I have an iPad and iPhone both with ForeFlight. ForeFlight has a good satellite image that overlays the VFR map and should give a good idea of the fog. I also have XM weather on my Garmin 496. That can lag up to an hour, but it is as good as flightwatch will give you for METARs, anyways. FlyQ (AOPA) is good for airport info, but ForeFlight has that too. AeroWeather is a good app for the iPhone and would work on the iPad. It is a quick and easy way to read METARs and TAFs. I also use Logbook Pro to log my flights and Spin-a-Wind is good for doing crosswind component, DA and TAS calculations. Also, Jesse's WnB Pro.
 
Gary said:
Well Kim.... Good Luck!! Sounds like you have done quite the planning and contingency stuff! Now it is up to the weather. Are you giving your fly-in a name?

Gary
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To be fair, Jim has put quite a bit of work in too.

Jim does have a wife so she might not like the name "Jim and Kim's Fly In" though that certainly has a ring to it.

In a way, the event got the name months ago (Kimberly's Fly In) because I talked to the inn keeper. She told me what great "pilot" discounts she had - 10% off - and how she "understood" if a pilot were to cancel at the last minute. She had the best prices and sounded understanding of us pilots so we all booked there. I had to give everyone a name to use so I said "tell them you are with Kimberly's Fly In".
 
Great news everyone. I will let Jonathan (focal_plane) post his own PIREP / story tonight but he has landed.

He says there are 6 or more tie downs left, with ropes (some in better shape than others). He landed a bit before 4pm today in Shelter Cove.

He called me from a Verizon cell phone, and sounded great. He reported his T-Mobile cell got zero bars, though, and wasn't sure about the ATT cell phone of his passenger.
 
John221us said:
I have an iPad and iPhone both with ForeFlight. ForeFlight has a good satellite image that overlays the VFR map and should give a good idea of the fog. I also have XM weather on my Garmin 496. That can lag up to an hour, but it is as good as flightwatch will give you for METARs, anyways. FlyQ (AOPA) is good for airport info, but ForeFlight has that too. AeroWeather is a good app for the iPhone and would work on the iPad. It is a quick and easy way to read METARs and TAFs. I also use Logbook Pro to log my flights and Spin-a-Wind is good for doing crosswind component, DA and TAS calculations. Also, Jesse's WnB Pro.
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Thanks. I told Jonathan you'd be landing next (tomorrow) and that you posted your pic on that other Little River thread so he knows what you look like. He will probably look to see if / when your Cherokee is there at the airport though I'm not sure of their plans for the next few days.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Thanks. I told Jonathan you'd be landing next (tomorrow) and that you posted your pic on that other Little River thread so he knows what you look like. He will probably look to see if / when your Cherokee is there at the airport though I'm not sure of their plans for the next few days.
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Thanks, I have the contact info you sent, so I can send him a text when I land. I don't have any particular agenda, myself. We will probably walk around and take in the sights.:)
 
Another update. Restaurant called me back. They confirmed my dinner reservations. I was on the phone with Jonathan so they left a voicemail, I'm going to call them back to try and get more info but for now:

Reservations confirmed, 8 people, 7pm, Saturday night. "The Cove Restaurant" bottom floor of the Oceanfront Inn at Shelter Cove - 10 Seal Court, Shelter Cove, CA 95589 - 707-986-1197 - restaurant phone (the phone for the Inn is 707-986-7002). They are open until 9pm.

8 people: Jonathan + 1, John +1, Jim + 1, Kimberly + 1

Still possible to have 2-4 more people plus there are some I haven't heard from at all on this thread who seemed to be coming (?)
 
John221us said:
Thanks, I have the contact info you sent, so I can send him a text when I land. I don't have any particular agenda, myself. We will probably walk around and take in the sights.:)
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That's my plan, too, though I think the BF is excited to fish off the cliffs in the photo I posted of the runway on page one of this thread. We'll see what happens. I do think we are bringing poles, I'll see how many we can bring (though who knows how many of you have your fishing license like we do).
 
Thoughts:


I have never done any of these things:

1. Flown above a solid layer of clouds (not without being in sight of the ground somewhere nearby)

2. Done a descent from above a layer to below a layer

3. Land at an airport "under" a layer. Sure, I've done that in Petaluma or Half Moon Bay but I flew in at my altitude. I never had to change for the clouds.


This will be interesting. It has been foggy every day, even in the afternoon, only slightly starting to break up around 11 or 12. The fog hugs the coastline and a bit inland too.

If I find a "hole" big enough to go down through (one I can get back up through again if needed), and then discover the ceilings in the area are too low I will have to pop up again and land at Garberville and just call the shuttle (or if I'm early just wait it out and take off again).

I depart Saturday morning and have a pilot who is landing there the day before who will be texting me a runway wx report thank goodness (thank you John).

I'm not scared, just interested to see how it all unfolds. The good news is this is valuable experience since I live near the coast and most of the places I want to go will have similar issues. I need to start getting comfortable with this stuff sooner rather than later.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Thoughts:


I have never done any of these things:

1. Flown above a solid layer of clouds (not without being in sight of the ground somewhere nearby)

2. Done a descent from above a layer to below a layer

3. Land at an airport "under" a layer. Sure, I've done that in Petaluma or Half Moon Bay but I flew in at my altitude. I never had to change for the clouds.


This will be interesting. It has been foggy every day, even in the afternoon, only slightly starting to break up around 11 or 12. The fog hugs the coastline and a bit inland too.

If I find a "hole" big enough to go down through (one I can get back up through again if needed), and then discover the ceilings in the area are too low I will have to pop up again and land at Garberville and just call the shuttle (or if I'm early just wait it out and take off again).

I depart Saturday morning and have a pilot who is landing there the day before who will be texting me a runway wx report thank goodness (thank you John).

I'm not scared, just interested to see how it all unfolds. The good news is this is valuable experience since I live near the coast and most of the places I want to go will have similar issues. I need to start getting comfortable with this stuff sooner rather than later.
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Please examine this idea carefully. Fog is not a static phenomenon, it is very common to drop into a hole and have it move on, change shape or close out completely. You stand a very good chance of being caught under a low ceiling with no way out other than to climb on instruments. I flew out of CGAS Sacramento and am very familiar with that coast. Letting down through a hole and expecting to be able to climb back out is not a good idea for a VFR pilot. IMHO
 
Let me rephrase "hole" to be a 5-10 mile wide area. In other words, sometimes clouds will just hang out somewhere. I did not use the word hole correctly.
 
Threefingeredjack said:
Please examine this idea carefully. Fog is not a static phenomenon, it is very common to drop into a hole and have it move on, change shape or close out completely. You stand a very good chance of being caught under a low ceiling with no way out other than to climb on instruments. I flew out of CGAS Sacramento and am very familiar with that coast. Letting down through a hole and expecting to be able to climb back out is not a good idea for a VFR pilot. IMHO
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In a perfect world, I will wake up to clear skies and not have to think about it.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Let me rephrase "hole" to be a 5-10 mile wide area. In other words, sometimes clouds will just hang out somewhere. I did not use the word hole correctly.
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Think carefully about this. A 5 mile hole takes only a few minutes to close up if the bank is under pressure from an onshore breeze. If it is breaking up, the heat rising off the sea will generally hold the holes open and widen them. So be sure what is going on. I'm not trying to be a smart-a**, just concerned about a fellow POA member. Having eyes on the ground at your destination is a great idea, glad you have that resource. Be careful and have fun.
 
Seemed like all went well today, long day but now listening to the water and enjoying the cool air. No other ac on the field that I could see but ours.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
In a perfect world, I will wake up to clear skies and not have to think about it.
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It has been clearing. I don't think you will be dealing with any of that stuff.

focal_plane said:
Seemed like all went well today, long day but now listening to the water and enjoying the cool air. No other ac on the field that I could see but ours.
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I will be joining you probably around 3:30 or 4:00 tomorrow. :D
 
Threefingeredjack said:
Please examine this idea carefully. Fog is not a static phenomenon, it is very common to drop into a hole and have it move on, change shape or close out completely. You stand a very good chance of being caught under a low ceiling with no way out other than to climb on instruments. I flew out of CGAS Sacramento and am very familiar with that coast. Letting down through a hole and expecting to be able to climb back out is not a good idea for a VFR pilot. IMHO
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Good advice and to add a bit - "fog" and the "marine layer" are two different things, at least as how they can act. Fog can appear the moment the temps jive. A good example is sailing on the Bay (well kinda sailing as the wind is usually poor in these conditions), looking out at miles of OK vis and then ZIP, total white out. Best to have some headings in mind when that happens and not be near the shipping channels!

The marine layer acts differently. It tends to roll in and out as the temps jive in a flow. You may have seen it in SF Bay or when watching a ball game on TV. It rolls in over the hills and over the Gate. Have lunched at Shelter Cove and had it sneak in behind us from the North while we sat in a restaurant, enjoying a leisurely meal facing South West where it was crystal clear. The big problem is it comes in with the breeze, which is the direction you have to launch to get out. So you are trying to fly straight into it.
Gee who would do that.....? :redface:
 

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We wondered to the Cove restaraunt tonight. Had nice dinner, feller playing acoustic guitar, ate a lot. At least we walked, restaraunt near opposite approach end of runway. Noticed a couple of other ac on the south end of the field I missed before as well as numerous deer out feeding as it was getting dark.
 
focal_plane said:
We wondered to the Cove restaraunt tonight. Had nice dinner, feller playing acoustic guitar, ate a lot. At least we walked, restaraunt near opposite approach end of runway. Noticed a couple of other ac on the south end of the field I missed before as well as numerous deer out feeding as it was getting dark.
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Hopefully no deer head-butt any airplanes like poor Lynn's at Gaston's!
 
focal_plane said:
We wondered to the Cove restaraunt tonight. Had nice dinner, feller playing acoustic guitar, ate a lot. At least we walked, restaraunt near opposite approach end of runway. Noticed a couple of other ac on the south end of the field I missed before as well as numerous deer out feeding as it was getting dark.
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Was the place near the runway the deli or the tea room? Or were you saying the Cove is there?

Also, when I called, they said it was about a mile from our rooms at the Inn (each way). Would you agree? I was thinking of walking but wanted to offer to drive everyone in the van if they'll give it to us.
 
Wow, this sounds fun. I fly off Livermore (LVK). I won't be able to make it this weekend but hopefully I can join the next one if there will be any. :) BTW I just finished my tailwheel endorsement yesterday and my CFI mentioned Shelter Cove to be one of the place to visit around here. I hope everyone there to have a lot of fun.

BTW I had an opportunity to fly right over the cloud once. It was the last lesson before the check ride. It was a bit surreal to see white fluffy cloud everywhere instead of the visual references I'm used to, but other than that it's not a big deal.
 
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