Arctic Air Cooler...

Any thoughts on pros/cons of block ice vs cubes?
 
dans2992 said:
Any thoughts on pros/cons of block ice vs cubes?
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When I talked to Arctic Air about it, they said that the blocks provided significantly better life. The best way to get max cool air life was with ice blocks filled in with cubes and then add in water. If you're having issues with enough cooling hours, you might want to try it.
 
I've used both and found the block lasts at least 2x crushed/sacked. That's not surprising, since I see the same results on extended camping trips

dans2992 said:
Any thoughts on pros/cons of block ice vs cubes?
Click to expand...
 
Rock salt actually allows the ice to become liquid at or very close to freezing. In ice cream-making, that gives you more surface area/ better heat transfer while at or near 32deg. Added to ice after the fact, it won't lower the temp of ice - just makes the freezing point of h2o lower. So, your ice will actually melt sooner (at a lower temp) if you freeze it with salt. ... that, and you will have a corrosive liquid in your cooling pump/system.... etc.

Does that help?
 
hey guys, I saw the thread going here and wanted to chime in.

Im the "SwitchBox" guy from the winter product and we made the summer product now for the "IceBox"

Its doing really well. We spent all Spring doing R&D to make something different than what everyone else was doing and Im really happy with the results.

I bought an ArcticAir from Sportys for $520 and ran our test probes on the same flight as an IceBox and we are getting a much longer duration for the A/C then the competitor. We got about 100x orders in 1 month already, but it was a joint effort of 100s of pilots from the VAF, BeechTalk and Cirrus COPA site helping design this together. Features and details, etc.

The Pireps are coming in now from old ArcticAir users who switched over or new pilots to the IceBox. Long thread is going on the BTalk site here

http://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=78716
 
Folks with these coolers:

Does the air get routed through the ice chest before being pulled through the radiator? My parts have arrived. Time to build.
 
Yes. An opening in the lid acts as the return air register. Without it you could not generate air circulation through the coils.
dell30rb said:
Folks with these coolers:

Does the air get routed through the ice chest before being pulled through the radiator? My parts have arrived. Time to build.
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dell30rb said:
Folks with these coolers:

Does the air get routed through the ice chest before being pulled through the radiator? My parts have arrived. Time to build.
Click to expand...

No it does not. Doing so will introduce too much moisture into the air and then into the cabin. There needs to be an air duct to feed the air from the blower through the coil and then into the outlet ducts. Putting the blower on the outlet side of the coil and sucking air through it will likely also suck water droplets off the coil and blow them into the cabin.. Basically you get wet. Have the blower blowing down through the coil and a duct from the outlet side of the coil to the the outlet vents. That is the way I built mine and it works great. Follow this link to my website and you can see how I built mine. You may find some time saving ideas. Good luck.
Randy

http://mysite.verizon.net/vzes8y13/n8749n/
 
Randy, yours is how I would ideally build mine. However,

I plan to save a lot of time by not having to fiberglass anything. That means a 3" blower pulling through the coil. You have the same amount of air flowing through your coil regardless of if it is pushed or pulled. Unless there is a baffle designed to collect the water I don't see what difference it makes. You are still relying on the airflow through the coil to be low enough that the condensed water falls down out of the coil and drains back into the cooler.

Instead of fiberglassing a duct to keep the air out of the cooler, i plan on cutting a 1" thick peice of foam to the shape of the cooler, to throw in on top of the ice/water. This will basically serve the same purpouse - keep the airflow from going over the ice.
 
If the return air vent is in one end of the lid and the coils are mounted on the other end, the return air is pre-cooled to some extent by passing over the ice and cold water in the box. Not sure how much difference it makes, but if you're planning to use block ice (which I highly recommend due to staying power) you're going to find that the plug will need to ride high in the box and may prove to be problematic with respect to positioning the pump and lines in the reservoir.

Based on the impressive temp differential that my dirt-simple unit provides, I'd advise against spending a lot of time worrying about that aspect and more time improving air movement (more fans or more speed) to the point that you're maximizing CFM without degrading temp differential. And it's also easier to reach back and grab a bottle of water or gatorade without a barrier in the way.

And you're right about the moisture issue. The placement and orientation of the outlet tubing eliminates any water in the outlet air. I needed fresh ice in Wichita last week when departing the Twin Cessna show in 106F temps. Yingling FBO provided a sack of crushed ice that was totally melted after a two-hour flight, even though the unit was only used for ~30 minutes total. At least half of a block would have remained, which I would have stuck in the freezer at the hangar for use on the next short flight.


dell30rb said:
Randy, yours is how I would ideally build mine. However,

I plan to save a lot of time by not having to fiberglass anything. That means a 3" blower pulling through the coil. You have the same amount of air flowing through your coil regardless of if it is pushed or pulled. Unless there is a baffle designed to collect the water I don't see what difference it makes. You are still relying on the airflow through the coil to be low enough that the condensed water falls down out of the coil and drains back into the cooler.

Instead of fiberglassing a duct to keep the air out of the cooler, i plan on cutting a 1" thick peice of foam to the shape of the cooler, to throw in on top of the ice/water. This will basically serve the same purpouse - keep the airflow from going over the ice.
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wabower said:
If the return air vent is in one end of the lid and the coils are mounted on the other end, the return air is pre-cooled to some extent by passing over the ice and cold water in the box.
Click to expand...

What I want to emerge from my outlet, is air that is both significantly cooler and significantly less humid than the muggy NC summer air. I don't know how much of a difference it makes, but I think that limiting the airflow over the ice/water and instead directing it right through the coil will aid in removing moisture from the air. Another benefit is that the foam will insulate the ice when the unit is off. Having the big return air vents on the top of the cooler kinda ruin its effectiveness for keeping ice.

Now that the gerbils are spinning I am also thinking that cooling air which is already at 80% relative humidity will bring it close to 100% anyway and it couldn't absorb any moisture from the water. If that's the case it wouldn't matter.
 
I don't think it matters either. Outlet air temps F vary from high 50's to mid 60's and the moisture in the air is reduced by the cooling as it passes through the coils.

After two seasons of use I've only used all the ice (and the chest was never full with only one normal-sized sack or block) on two occasions, both on very hot days using cubes only. I agree that insulating the mechanism will help preserve ice, but also know that using block ice provides the same benefit. If I park for the day, I use sunshades in windows, place a foam plug in the outlet, close the vent and throw a big towel over the cooler.

dell30rb said:
What I want to emerge from my outlet, is air that is both significantly cooler and significantly less humid than the muggy NC summer air. I don't know how much of a difference it makes, but I think that limiting the airflow over the ice/water and instead directing it right through the coil will aid in removing moisture from the air. Another benefit is that the foam will insulate the ice when the unit is off. Having the big return air vents on the top of the cooler kinda ruin its effectiveness for keeping ice.

Now that the gerbils are spinning I am also thinking that cooling air which is already at 80% relative humidity will bring it close to 100% anyway and it couldn't absorb any moisture from the water. If that's the case it wouldn't matter.
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Those outlet temps seem high. I am seeing in the 40s...
 
dell30rb said:
What I want to emerge from my outlet, is air that is both significantly cooler and significantly less humid than the muggy NC summer air. I don't know how much of a difference it makes, but I think that limiting the airflow over the ice/water and instead directing it right through the coil will aid in removing moisture from the air. Another benefit is that the foam will insulate the ice when the unit is off. Having the big return air vents on the top of the cooler kinda ruin its effectiveness for keeping ice.

Now that the gerbils are spinning I am also thinking that cooling air which is already at 80% relative humidity will bring it close to 100% anyway and it couldn't absorb any moisture from the water. If that's the case it wouldn't matter.
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Nope, not at all.

Remember that the air is being drawn through a heat-exchanger with very cold water in it; the cooling of the air serves to condense moisture out of the air, moisture which drips into the cooler. Like any other refrigeration unit, whether it's using compressed, condensed and evaporated R134 or cold water from ice as the cooling medium, cooling is occurring and moisture is evaporating out.

You are making the air less humid, not more humid. While the air moving through the cooler may pick up some incidental moisture, it gains nothing close to as much moisture in the process as it is losing from condensation.
 
If all goes according to plan, this thing will be running tonight.

Cooler $20
New Heater Core from 90's ford contour $27 (shoulda bought used)
Bilge pump $20
Hoses $5 (had em)
Rule 3" Blower $25 shipped
Duct tape $0 (everyone has this)
Gutter flexible pipe $5
3 to 4" pipe adapter and 4 to 6" adapter $12 (lowes)
Misc stuff (glue, switches, wire) $20

Optional 12ah sealed led acid battery $45

Total $134. Not including battery. I had that laying around from another project. Estimate a good 1.5 hours out of the battery, don't want to pull it down too low. I should be drawing about 5 amps.
 
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So here's a question - once you have taken off and climbed to altitude (and turned off the unit) are you better off draining the excess water, or keeping it? This of course assumes you have a way to drain it in flight.

It seems that the ice lasts longer when not in water, so to keep more cooling in reserve for when you land at the destination, I'm thinking draining might be better...?
 
dans2992 said:
So here's a question - once you have taken off and climbed to altitude (and turned off the unit) are you better off draining the excess water, or keeping it? This of course assumes you have a way to drain it in flight.

It seems that the ice lasts longer when not in water, so to keep more cooling in reserve for when you land at the destination, I'm thinking draining might be better...?
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I'd say keep it. Cold water is cold water. If you let it out, less cold stuff in the cooler.

This is probably a question for a chemist. I remember learning about how much energy it takes to change ice into water in chemistry. The water sloshing around might be providing that energy.
 
I think the heat absorption by ice melting is much greater that the heat absorption by the cool water. So, logically you'd want to retain as much ice as possible.
 
dans2992 said:
I think the heat absorption by ice melting is much greater that the heat absorption by the cool water. So, logically you'd want to retain as much ice as possible.
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The cold water is what provides the cooling to the cabin. The ice cools the water. So long as the water remains at 32F in the liquid state, you've got as cold as you can get.
 
I'm starting year three, ~50 trips so far. AFAICT, it doesn't really matter as long as I use block ice. A big piece always remains in the chest when I get home, so I put it in the fridge for use on another flight, then pump the water out.
 
wabower said:
I'm starting year three, ~50 trips so far. AFAICT, it doesn't really matter as long as I use block ice. A big piece always remains in the chest when I get home, so I put it in the fridge for use on another flight, then pump the water out.
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What size block ice do you use? The 10 x 6 x 6 blocks found at convenience stores? How much can you fit in your cooler?
 
I use the "shoebox" size Target tub, keep two in the freezer at home and a couple in the smaller fridge in the hangar. Also keep some plastic milkjugs filled with cold water to provide the prime.

dans2992 said:
What size block ice do you use? The 10 x 6 x 6 blocks found at convenience stores? How much can you fit in your cooler?
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Dont mind the ugly couch. Works like a champ
 
Looks good , simple as well. I suspect you will wish you had done this sooner. Its gonna feel good.
 
We have special pricing on the B-Kool units for OSH. $369.00 for the 12v units. 399.00 fir the 24v units. All products come with a 30 day money back guarantee. Shipping is a flat $10.00 anywhere in the Cont USA.

For the special pricing please contact me directly at Bob@b-Kool.net, or txgroup@aol.com.. My personal phone is 928-300-4045

I will guarantee you there is not a better product on the market.

bob
 
I wanted to emphasize what Wayne said. I have the one from Amazon. It works good when it is right behind you and pointed at you. The closer the better. I put a towel on my back seat and put the cooler on that.

However, now flying around with dogs all the time it is in the way back. That doesn't work very well. So if you have kids, dogs, or rear seat passengers, they don't help the pilot much.

Also, I noticed electrical noise in my headset when using the fan. For those building these you might consider using a noise suppressor in the power cord.
 
our special shipping rate of $10.00 anywhere in the cont USA will be ending at the end of the month.

We are still honoring our OSH special unit pricing of $369.00 for 12v units, and $399.00 for 24 v units


Please contact me at txgroup@aol.com to get the special price..


Thanks


Bob
B-kool
 
Our special OSH pricing which we held over is ending next Friday sept 20,2013

If anyone wants a deal on our B-kool products please contact me directly at txgroup@aol.com, or 928-300-4045
 
There is a good thread over on VAF from a guy who builds a Wi-Fi unit. He's done much experimentation.

There's another 'method' he mentioned I have not tried called the sandwich method. You put ice and water in as usual, but then put a cut piece of styrofoam over it, and place another layer of ice above the styrofoam creating a 'sandwich' of ice on top of the styro, on top of ice and water.

When you do not run the pump, the air circulates over the top ice, and saves the ice underneath. Hope I'm making sense....
 
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