Airplane for a Tough Mission

Ray Jr

Ray Jr

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
110
Display Name
Display name:
Rayman
Well I think it's a tough mission anyway.

For the sake of conversation, imagine this mission. Flying all over Eastern Canada (Ontario, Quebec, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland) all year long. With the occasional trip down south to Florida/Caribbean. 2 - 4 occupants. There's a fair bit of crummy weather, icing, bodies of water but no mountains.

What plane would you pick for this mission with a $500k or a $2M budget?

Of course assuming proper go-no go decision making. The goal is to be able maximize the Go days and minimize the no-go days.
 
King Air 200. Or, second choice, a C90 series. Not as fast as a jet on the Florida trip, but way more efficient for most of your shorter home area trips. Probably nearer your $2M mark for a nice one. A PC-12 or TBM would work, too, if you're OK with one engine, but personally I'd want a twin, especially for the over-water flights.
A piston twin, maybe a 421, or such, would come in on the low side of your budget, but you would have less reliability compared to a turboprop.
 
Pilot type rating status? Single pilot?

Plenty of CJ1 jets in that range.
 
Last edited:
Turbo prop seems to be the way to go. Single pilot, runway flexibility, speedy enough except the yearly long trip to warm weather.
 
That mission becomes a whole lot less challenging when you can throw that kind of money at it lol.

If I had that kind of budget, I'd own a da-62, but only because I need 7 seats. A TBM otherwise, or a Piper M5/600.
 
DC3 - :D

Hey, you asked.

Seriously DA-62
 
Is the Caravan FIKI?
 
DFH65 said:
DC3 - :D

Hey, you asked.

Seriously DA-62
Click to expand...

I would think pressure would be the only way to go. I don't want to fly through ice in the mid teens for 4 hours.
 
Forget all the piston stuff. For that number of AMUs it's pressurized hull and turbine powered. Period.

Lots of nice Piper Meridians in that range. Alternatively, the older TBM 700s are also well within that range, but I suspect some avionics upgrades might be in order given their vintage, as are some TBM 850s (the latter would be my preference). :cool:

However, if you are going into gravel strips (of which there are many in that region) that FIKI Caravan starts to look pretty attractive, but you give up the pressurization. And a Caravan all the way to Florida...meh. :p

Just a side note about your "no mountains" - the Designated Mountainous Regions areas 2, 3 and 4 (AIM RAC 2.12) are within the geographic area you defined, and since you are proposing to fly IFR you'll need to take that into consideration. They may not be as grand as the Rockies out west where I live, but they are just as hard on impact I bet.
 
One word.

PC-12

Turbine reliability, pressurized, FIKI, bigger and faster than a KA-90 with half the fuel burn and maintenance.
 
Zeldman said:
One word.

PC-12

Turbine reliability, pressurized, FIKI, bigger and faster than a KA-90 with half the fuel burn and maintenance.
Click to expand...

A bit much airplane for 2-4 people? And I would imagine one would have to shop awfully hard to find one at $2 mill or less?

BUT, one could damn near anywhere in one of those, including across the Atlantic to Europe and into North Africa! :D
 
kep5niner said:
Hey Kevin, if you're looking to off-load your 310, I've got dibs on your avionics suite. I'm sure I could harvest it and throw it in my 310 :p
Click to expand...
Shoot, I could never afford a turbine...much less 2 of them! The 310 is my forever bird. If that ever changes, I marked you down for the avionics suite. :)
 
GRG55 said:
A bit much airplane for 2-4 people?
Click to expand...

I once watched a plain white 757 land at Flagstaff. 5 folks got out, including the pilot, copilot and flight attendant. Oh, the plane did have L-3 markings on the side.... I did not ask questions. :lol:
 
Ray Jr said:
Is the Caravan FIKI?
Click to expand...
FIKI is an option. Pressurization is not. Caravans were made to carry lots of people or lots of boxes down low and slow. Its a good choice if you really want to take 3 friends up and watch other planes pass you on less fuel burn.
 
Any twin turboprop that matches your budget. You want turbine power, propeller short field capabilities, and the venerable PT6 does fail sometimes, if there's lots of remote area you want that second engine to get you, at least if not home, somewhere sane.
 
Ray Jr said:
Is the Caravan FIKI?
Click to expand...
The Caravan, like most Cessna high wings, belongs in the trash. You'll climb at less than 1,000 fpm at 110 knots and if you are lucky you *might* hit 180 KTAS in cruise.. oh and you'll be burning almost 50 gallons an hour .. the thing will burn 300 gallons in 4 hrs. Also, it's not pressurized, so you'll be sitting in the ice and muck.

By the way, the Caravan is known to have terrible ice qualities. FedEx was unhappy enough with the boot performance that they converted their entire fleet to TKS.. that tells you something about boots, or at least about the Caravan https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-...system-avionics-update-planned-fedex-caravans Granted, if you go TKS.. now you have another variable to worry about: a limited amount of TKS and the need to carry it with you or go to places where you can fill it up

Turbine is your answer, but stay away from the Caravan. It has a specific mission it's good at but that's about it.
 
How do those single engine PT handle icing? From a price perspective, how does the absolute best big piston twin Cessna's compare to the bottom of the range meridians? They aren't far off in price
 
From the article above

"
“The reason we’re doing [the TKS conversion],” Superior Airways chief pilot Alex Wozniak told AIN, “is that the Caravan has a poor reputation for flying in ice with the current boot system.” A benefit of the TKS system is that it allows the Caravan to fly at maximum takeoff weight in icing conditions, while the boot-equipped models have lower maximum weights in icing.
"
 
Tantalum said:
The Caravan, like most Cessna high wings, belongs in the trash. You'll climb at less than 1,000 fpm at 110 knots and if you are lucky you *might* hit 180 KTAS in cruise.. oh and you'll be burning almost 50 gallons an hour .. the thing will burn 300 gallons in 4 hrs. Also, it's not pressurized, so you'll be sitting in the ice and muck.

By the way, the Caravan is known to have terrible ice qualities. FedEx was unhappy enough with the boot performance that they converted their entire fleet to TKS.. that tells you something about boots, or at least about the Caravan https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-...system-avionics-update-planned-fedex-caravans Granted, if you go TKS.. now you have another variable to worry about: a limited amount of TKS and the need to carry it with you or go to places where you can fill it up

Turbine is your answer, but stay away from the Caravan. It has a specific mission it's good at but that's about it.
Click to expand...
That's interesting. I couldn't imagine spending that much cash and not being pressurized.
 
GRG55 said:
A bit much airplane for 2-4 people? And I would imagine one would have to shop awfully hard to find one at $2 mill or less?

BUT, one could damn near anywhere in one of those, including across the Atlantic to Europe and into North Africa! :D
Click to expand...
Agreed. PC12 is fantastic is many aspects. It is overkill for me. In size and price
 
You can finance it for only $10,200 a month!
 
Weren't you the one that was concerned about maintenance on an older plane with an 80k price range? Now there's a 2m dollar budget? Did a family member pass away? Win the lottery?
 
Racerx said:
Weren't you the one that was concerned about maintenance on an older plane with an 80k price range? Now there's a 2m dollar budget? Did a family member pass away? Win the lottery?
Click to expand...

Ray Jr said:
For the sake of conversation, imagine this mission:).
Click to expand...

Just curious for the fun of it. I haven't robbed any banks
 
Last edited:
Ray Jr said:
Just curious for the fun of it. I haven't robbed any banks
Click to expand...
You did say you were tall. Now you mention banks. Ladies and gentlemen, I think we've got the "too tall bandit"
 
Radar Contact said:
Shoot, I could never afford a turbine...much less 2 of them! The 310 is my forever bird. If that ever changes, I marked you down for the avionics suite. :)
Click to expand...

Forget that parting out sacrilege.

You decide you're selling that 310 and I'll be in the thick of the bidding war frenzy going on here on PoA! Who knows, you might even get a few of those die-hard piston-twin "haters" caught up in the emotion of the moment making unsolicited and inadvisable offers (you know the type..."one engine is better than two", "double the risk of an engine failure", "100% more fuel for 30% more speed", "can't climb on one so what's the point", "second engine takes you to the scene", blah, blah...) :D;)
 
Racerx said:
You did say you were tall. Now you mention banks. Ladies and gentlemen, I think we've got the "too tall bandit"
Click to expand...
Impressive! I like the continuity around here :)
 
Ray Jr said:
3000 and up.
Click to expand...

At 3000' I think you are looking at an MU-2 for a twin turboprop. I believe they have excellent short field performance. There is also nothing wrong with the Garrett engines except the noise.
 
so what did you end up buying?
 
^^^ I think he's still plotting the bank heist.
All the while proclaiming innocence, of course.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top