Airlines based out of MCO

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Logan Hardee

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Feb 18, 2020
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Jaxpilot02
Hey all,
I’ve been researching the whole commuting situation and decided it’s not worth the stress or time.
I live in Jacksonville and am roughly 2 hours from Orlando international.
I have two questions, first one is will airlines like southwest, spirt etc hire right after you have 1500 hours? Or would I need to go to the regionals? Their hiring minimums state they will but I know that doesn’t mean it’s true.
My second question is, if I do get hired with anyone based out of MCO, what’s the likelihood I’ll get that as a base being junior FO? Thanks for the help everyone!
 
Last edited:
Logan Hardee said:
Hey all,
I’ve been researching the whole commuting situation and decided it’s not worth the stress or time.
I live in Jacksonville and am roughly 2 hours from Orlando international.
I have two questions, first one is will airlines like southwest, spirt etc hire right after you have 1500 hours? Or would I need to go to the regionals? Their hiring minimums state they will but I know that doesn’t mean it’s true.
My second question is, if I do get hired with anyone based out of MCO, what’s the likelihood I’ll get that as a base being junior FO? Thanks for the help everyone!
Click to expand...
The odds of getting hired into a mainline carrier with 1500 hours of CFI given, is slim. Possible, but slim.
Getting the base you want, well.... if it’s not worth it for you to commute for the first couple years, than you don’t want it very badly.
Putting the two together, if you come across that you only want the job if you don’t have to commute, your chances are 0.00%.
 
U
Kritchlow said:
The odds of getting hired into a mainline carrier with 1500 hours of CFI given, is slim. Possible, but slim.
Getting the base you want, well.... if it’s not worth it for you to commute for the first couple years, than you don’t want it very badly.
Putting the two together, if you come across that you only want the job if you don’t have to commute, your chances are 0.00%.
Click to expand...
understood. I have looked into silver airways and then transition to a mainline but the 34 bucks an hour seems crazy even for a regional. Am I wrong?
 
Logan Hardee said:
U

understood. I have looked into silver airways and then transition to a mainline but the 34 bucks an hour seems crazy even for a regional. Am I wrong?
Click to expand...

There are plenty of ways to build time and make money working towards an airline career. You're not going to make Major airline pay, but you can make a living.

With the current situation, you are going to have a few years to get there. I suspect the current hiring trend we had at the first of the year is now over, and won't be coming back for about 2 to 3 years. Airlines are using this situation to restructure and realign, which means dumping low profit routes, parking old airframes and restructuring growth. We've already seen 2 regionals go under and another possible one, 121 charter operators filing chapter 11 and some of the 135 operators drastically cutting back. So a fresh 1500 pilot is not going to get very far when you have pilots with much more time and turbine PIC/135/121 experience are also looking for jobs.
 
You might want to supplement your teaching hours,with working with a busy charter operation. As a minimum get some turbine time.
 
Logan Hardee said:
Hey all,
I’ve been researching the whole commuting situation and decided it’s not worth the stress or time.
I live in Jacksonville and am roughly 2 hours from Orlando international.
I have two questions, first one is will airlines like southwest, spirt etc hire right after you have 1500 hours? Or would I need to go to the regionals? Their hiring minimums state they will but I know that doesn’t mean it’s true.
My second question is, if I do get hired with anyone based out of MCO, what’s the likelihood I’ll get that as a base being junior FO? Thanks for the help everyone!
Click to expand...

how many hours do you have right now?
 
Logan Hardee said:
U

understood. I have looked into silver airways and then transition to a mainline but the 34 bucks an hour seems crazy even for a regional. Am I wrong?
Click to expand...
It’s called “paying your dues”. I wish that was all there was to it when I was in your position.
 
frfly172 said:
You might want to supplement your teaching hours,with working with a busy charter operation. As a minimum get some turbine time.
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I’ve been looking into that but a lot of them want 1500 hours
 
Doc Holliday said:
There are plenty of ways to build time and make money working towards an airline career. You're not going to make Major airline pay, but you can make a living.

With the current situation, you are going to have a few years to get there. I suspect the current hiring trend we had at the first of the year is now over, and won't be coming back for about 2 to 3 years. Airlines are using this situation to restructure and realign, which means dumping low profit routes, parking old airframes and restructuring growth. We've already seen 2 regionals go under and another possible one, 121 charter operators filing chapter 11 and some of the 135 operators drastically cutting back. So a fresh 1500 pilot is not going to get very far when you have pilots with much more time and turbine PIC/135/121 experience are also looking for jobs.
Click to expand...
If I start Commercial single in June then do the multi add on, CFI etc that would probably put me about 1500 hours in 2 years give or take. What do you think?
 
Kritchlow said:
It’s called “paying your dues”. I wish that was all there was to it when I was in your position.
Click to expand...

these young guys don’t get it. 20 years ago even at 1500 hours you were still rejected by regionals. 500 hours multi required. The whole you pay for your training BS. And the absolute garbage pay. American eagle in 1999 starting pay was 17k a year.
 
Logan Hardee said:
but the 34 bucks an hour seems crazy even for a regional.
Click to expand...

I know, crazy right? Especially when they're only paying you for flight time and you spend 2 hours on the ground waiting to make a 20 minute hop. It's nuts they'd pay you that much.
 
TommyG said:
these young guys don’t get it. 20 years ago even at 1500 hours you were still rejected by regionals. 500 hours multi required. The whole you pay for your training BS. And the absolute garbage pay. American eagle in 1999 starting pay was 17k a year.
Click to expand...
Thankfully the economy is in a different place. Well, it was until this virus happened
 
bflynn said:
I know, crazy right? Especially when they're only paying you for flight time and you spend 2 hours on the ground waiting to make a 20 minute hop. It's nuts they'd pay you that much.
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Orlando to key west isn’t 20 minutes.
 
Umm

I will try to be sensitive here but I think it will sound harsh regardless of my effort otherwise.

right now reasonable expectations would be that if you are willing to move any job you get after completing training is the right job for you.

If you expect or need more than that you should reconsider your choice to enter the aviation industry.
 
Just a few thoughts:
-OP's questions are reasonable.. especially for someone who is new to aviation and the idea of doing it as a career

-some of the wages that these pilots get paid are criminal.. there's an assumption in the non flying public that pilots get paid super well.. little do they know that the pilot flying Nana in the CRJ may have made as little as $20,000 last year from flying and has a part time job. AAL spent 13 billion dollars on stock buybacks from 2009 through 2019.. doesn't seem totally fair.. there's money out there

-just because the road was hard and sucked for someone doesn't mean it has to be hard and suck for everyone else
 
Tantalum said:
Just a few thoughts:
-OP's questions are reasonable.. especially for someone who is new to aviation and the idea of doing it as a career

-some of the wages that these pilots get paid are criminal.. there's an assumption in the non flying public that pilots get paid super well.. little do they know that the pilot flying Nana in the CRJ may have made as little as $20,000 last year from flying and has a part time job. AAL spent 13 billion dollars on stock buybacks from 2009 through 2019.. doesn't seem totally fair.. there's money out there

-just because the road was hard and sucked for someone doesn't mean it has to be hard and suck for everyone else
Click to expand...
The issue is that the individual has very little control over such things. Employers pay what they pay. The only choice is whether or not to do the job for the pay offered.

If one wants to make it to a major airline at some point then a crap 121 job or military service is the best way to potentially get that job. Some can get lucky and find other less painful ways in but they are a tiny percentage of new hires at major airlines.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
military service
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Oh for sure, I just felt bad at the "you gotta be kidding me response" to the OP from some of the others (not you)

Growing up I wanted nothing more than to be a pilot.. but I talked to enough real-world pilots in my teen years who were either jaded or didn't exactly "encourage it" as the dream job I thought it to be, of course I was asking these questions in 2003 and 2004 so probably not the best time either

I still sometimes look up longingly at the big jets and wonder what it would be like... in an other life

Frankly I don't mind that military service is the best way to get an airline job.. CFI'ing for 500 hrs in a 172 and some BS job towing banners up and down the beach really give you limited experience, in my mind. if I'm sitting in the back of a Delta jet and the S hits the fan I will feel more comfortable with a dude up front who had been in the military.. even if flying skills are the same on paper I think that extra training, focus, and discipline is important up in the flight deck

Not that I'm prejudice.. but if I were an airline hiring pilots I would probably not hire me if I had a comparable candidate aviation wise but he/she was coming from the military
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Umm

I will try to be sensitive here but I think it will sound harsh regardless of my effort otherwise.

right now reasonable expectations would be that if you are willing to move any job you get after completing training is the right job for you.

If you expect or need more than that you should reconsider your choice to enter the aviation industry.
Click to expand...
I’m not opposed to moving by any means. Just curious as to my odds of getting MCO.
 
Tantalum said:
Just a few thoughts:
-OP's questions are reasonable.. especially for someone who is new to aviation and the idea of doing it as a career

-some of the wages that these pilots get paid are criminal.. there's an assumption in the non flying public that pilots get paid super well.. little do they know that the pilot flying Nana in the CRJ may have made as little as $20,000 last year from flying and has a part time job. AAL spent 13 billion dollars on stock buybacks from 2009 through 2019.. doesn't seem totally fair.. there's money out there

-just because the road was hard and sucked for someone doesn't mean it has to be hard and suck for everyone else
Click to expand...
I appreciate that very much
 
Tarheelpilot said:
The issue is that the individual has very little control over such things. Employers pay what they pay. The only choice is whether or not to do the job for the pay offered.

If one wants to make it to a major airline at some point then a crap 121 job or military service is the best way to potentially get that job. Some can get lucky and find other less painful ways in but they are a tiny percentage of new hires at major airlines.
Click to expand...
Tarheelpilot said:
The issue is that the individual has very little control over such things. Employers pay what they pay. The only choice is whether or not to do the job for the pay offered.

If one wants to make it to a major airline at some point then a crap 121 job or military service is the best way to potentially get that job. Some can get lucky and find other less painful ways in but they are a tiny percentage of new hires at major airlines.
Click to expand...
That’s completely fair, just trying to figure out my odds.
 
Tantalum said:
Oh for sure, I just felt bad at the "you gotta be kidding me response" to the OP from some of the others (not you)

Growing up I wanted nothing more than to be a pilot.. but I talked to enough real-world pilots in my teen years who were either jaded or didn't exactly "encourage it" as the dream job I thought it to be, of course I was asking these questions in 2003 and 2004 so probably not the best time either

I still sometimes look up longingly at the big jets and wonder what it would be like... in an other life

Frankly I don't mind that military service is the best way to get an airline job.. CFI'ing for 500 hrs in a 172 and some BS job towing banners up and down the beach really give you limited experience, in my mind. if I'm sitting in the back of a Delta jet and the S hits the fan I will feel more comfortable with a dude up front who had been in the military.. even if flying skills are the same on paper I think that extra training, focus, and discipline is important up in the flight deck

Not that I'm prejudice.. but if I were an airline hiring pilots I would probably not hire me if I had a comparable candidate aviation wise but he/she was coming from the military
Click to expand...
A friend of mine mentioned he may be able to hire me with 250 hours to fly Cessna 414s. That would be my preferred route as it’s turbine time and building hours and real world experience.
 
Pretty hard to imagine there being any hiring shortage for at least 2yrs and probably more. With something like 700 (or probably even more) big commercial jets parked right now that's a lot of experienced pilots with ATP turbine time that aren't flying and who will have a better resume than a 1500hr CFI.

To the OP...you are seeing first hand why time and time again people advise at least one other career option or college degree besides aviation

Six months ago (heck probably 1 month ago) the airlines were giving paid bonus for you to go thru their ATP programs. No one thought this day would come. My wife was flying regionals during 911. She's been saying it's way to good to be true for the past couple of years. All of her flying friends still have second or side jobs.

Unfortunately your picking a potentially tough time to become a pilot. Unlike 911 times there is still a large number of age based mandatory retirements so that will help your case. But I'd be thinking 3yrs and let's hope it's less.

Totally sucks. Your attitude and devotion is awesome. Dont give up, just expect the road to be longer and bumpier.
 
Logan Hardee said:
A friend of mine mentioned he may be able to hire me with 250 hours to fly Cessna 414s. That would be my preferred route as it’s turbine time and building hours and real world experience.
Click to expand...
That's multi time but not turbine time. Insurance for that might be tough as well. But it would be awesome on your resume!!
 
Logan Hardee said:
A friend of mine mentioned he may be able to hire me with 250 hours to fly Cessna 414s. That would be my preferred route as it’s turbine time and building hours and real world experience.
Click to expand...
A 414 is not turbine. It is turbocharged. Still, it is pretty quality time.
 
Logan Hardee said:
A friend of mine mentioned he may be able to hire me with 250 hours to fly Cessna 414s. That would be my preferred route as it’s turbine time and building hours and real world experience.
Click to expand...
My nephew, 17, is going full-blown after the airline career path.. he is IR and multi working on commercial.. anyway, through being social he was able to secure himself flying gig once he has 'X' hours flying Aztecs. It's something

Certainly do-able, but it will take patience, perseverance, and some tenacity
 
Tantalum said:
Oh for sure, I just felt bad at the "you gotta be kidding me response" to the OP from some of the others (not you)

Growing up I wanted nothing more than to be a pilot.. but I talked to enough real-world pilots in my teen years who were either jaded or didn't exactly "encourage it" as the dream job I thought it to be, of course I was asking these questions in 2003 and 2004 so probably not the best time either

I still sometimes look up longingly at the big jets and wonder what it would be like... in an other life

Frankly I don't mind that military service is the best way to get an airline job.. CFI'ing for 500 hrs in a 172 and some BS job towing banners up and down the beach really give you limited experience, in my mind. if I'm sitting in the back of a Delta jet and the S hits the fan I will feel more comfortable with a dude up front who had been in the military.. even if flying skills are the same on paper I think that extra training, focus, and discipline is important up in the flight deck

Not that I'm prejudice.. but if I were an airline hiring pilots I would probably not hire me if I had a comparable candidate aviation wise but he/she was coming from the military
Click to expand...
It depends. The military is no different than any other pipeline. Some guys are rock stars and others maintain the bell curve.

At one point in my career I felt the same way about military pilots. Then I grew up. After 20 years earning a living in aircraft I can tell you without a doubt there a some really bad pilots in the military. Don’t ask me how they make it through because I don’t know. Same is true of the airlines or any other large group you can reference.

it all comes down to the individual. Someone that views themselves as a professional, has a high internal standard and holds themselves to it will do a good job regardless of how they get their foundational experience. There may be a higher percentage of military pilots with that trait but it by no means reflects on the qualification or capability of a civilian pilot.

in regards to the overall value of a career in aviation that is also a very subjective question without an easy answer. I was hired at my first airline in 2000 and was furloughed a few months prior to 9/11. That was a tough market. Frankly this event looks like it will be a new low in my career when compared to 9/11 and the recession of ‘08. I’m currently in new hire training at airline #4 and my current hope is I’ll finish training before furlough and there will be an airline left to recall me one day. All of that said I have no regrets. It has been a hell of a ride and if I’m lucky it isn’t over just yet.

There is no promise of tomorrow. Live today.
 
Tantalum said:
My nephew, 17, is going full-blown after the airline career path.. he is IR and multi working on commercial.. anyway, through being social he was able to secure himself flying gig once he has 'X' hours flying Aztecs. It's something

Certainly do-able, but it will take patience, perseverance, and some tenacity
Click to expand...
Absolutely. Good for him!
 
Logan Hardee said:
Working on my private now. Just trying to get an idea of what i can expect in the near future. Start my Commercial in June.
Click to expand...

Stop focusing on what base and airplane and can I get hired by a major at 1500. Get your ratings done before worrying about any of that crap. If things keep going like their going, you will be lucky to even get a CFI job. The aviation job market can change in a moment, as we are all seeing now. Three airlines are shutting down. That means thousands of pilots now looking for jobs. That changes the hiring dynamic instantly.
 
Yeah, doesn’t hurt to ask. I think most hiring is on a hiatus, hopefully things will pickup before to many months.

As always, the truly motivated will move for the better job, if required.
 
Sinistar said:
Pretty hard to imagine there being any hiring shortage for at least 2yrs and probably more. With something like 700 (or probably even more) big commercial jets parked right now that's a lot of experienced pilots with ATP turbine time that aren't flying and who will have a better resume than a 1500hr CFI.

To the OP...you are seeing first hand why time and time again people advise at least one other career option or college degree besides aviation

Six months ago (heck probably 1 month ago) the airlines were giving paid bonus for you to go thru their ATP programs. No one thought this day would come. My wife was flying regionals during 911. She's been saying it's way to good to be true for the past couple of years. All of her flying friends still have second or side jobs.

Unfortunately your picking a potentially tough time to become a pilot. Unlike 911 times there is still a large number of age based mandatory retirements so that will help your case. But I'd be thinking 3yrs and let's hope it's less.

Totally sucks. Your attitude and devotion is awesome. Dont give up, just expect the road to be longer and bumpier.
Click to expand...
I’m shooting to have 1500 hours in two years, hopefully things will improve then.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
in regards to the overall value of a career in aviation that is also a very subjective question without an easy answer. I was hired at my first airline in 2000 and was furloughed a few months prior to 9/11. That was a tough market. Frankly this event looks like it will be a new low in my career when compared to 9/11 and the recession of ‘08. I’m currently in new hire training at airline #4 and my current hope is I’ll finish training before furlough and there will be an airline left to recall me one day. All of that said I have no regrets. It has been a hell of a ride and if I’m lucky it isn’t over just yet.
Click to expand...
damn! Good luck to you in your journey. What drew me most to aviation was the intangible beauty of it.. watching the world from above and seeing sites that few in the world get to see is a gift

Tarheelpilot said:
There is no promise of tomorrow. Live today.
Click to expand...
Amen to that!
 
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