Airline Guys Question

Some

What Glenn said. It's equipment that has to be operable in order to dispatch a flight. Some items can be deferred, and have how long they can be deferred before they have to be fixed/operable will be stated in the MEL. An example might be the autopilot.
 
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luvflyin said:
I dunno. I still don't know what MEL is. Maintain Everything Lacadasiacally?
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You usually won’t see an MEL in light GA aircraft. They’re more for jets and large turboprops. For light GA planes you’ll sometimes have a Kinds of Operation Equipment List stating which equipment you need for day/night VFR and day/night IFR.
 
As Jordan said about what an Mel is

Edit: provided incorrect technical definition of what an MEL list is! Just wanted to remove it to not confuse anyone else!
 
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bflynn said:
Toilet. Wait, FOs on -57/-67s have their own bathrooms?
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The freighter version of the 767 (I should specify the freighter that Boeing builds from the factory New today) has the bathroom in the flight deck.....so I guess one could argue they have their own bathroom?
 
Yeah, but he has to SHARE it...
 
Because you bought the cheapest ticket you could find and your FO makes about the same as a manger of a hot topic in the mall
 
JustinD said:
As Jordan said about what an mel is

Important to note an mel list is a list of minimum equipment that must be operative to fly, which is contrary to popular belief where a lot think it’s a list of equipment that can be broken, it is not.
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For the 757 Air Conditioning Pack, the MEL lists: "Normal Complement" 2, it also lists "Minimum Required For Takeoff" 1. How is that not listing that one system can be broken?
 
GlennAB1 said:
For the 757 Air Conditioning Pack, the MEL lists: "Normal Complement" 2, it also lists "Minimum Required For Takeoff" 1. How is that not listing that one system can be broken?
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I’m sorry you are correct I totally confuse my previous statement with something else, just went and relooked at the technical definition and that is right!
 
James331 said:
And you're reaffirming the 121 carrot on the stick group identity
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No James. It's because you've never have done the particular job. So you don't know what's happening now, nor very much about the job itself. Yet you comment on it like you're knowledgeable about the airlines. There's plenty of choices for a professional flying career. You chose yours and you're content with it. Which is great for you, but you do have a record on POA of denigrating the airline profession, when you know nothing about the actual job. Someone comes on POA and asks for advice about the airlines, and off you go, blasting away instead of encouraging and assisting the person.
 
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jordane93 said:
You usually won’t see an MEL in light GA aircraft. They’re more for jets and large turboprops. For light GA planes you’ll sometimes have a Kinds of Operation Equipment List stating which equipment you need for day/night VFR and day/night IFR.
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Though there is a generic Single Engine MMEL published by the FAA.
 
mscard88 said:
No James. It's because you've never have done the particular job. So you don't know what's happening now, nor very much about the job itself. Yet you comment on it like you're knowledgeable about the airlines. There's plenty of choices for a professional flying career. You chose yours and you're content with it. Which is great for you, but you do have a record on POA of denigrating the airline profession, when you know nothing about the actual job. Someone comes on POA and asks for advice about the airlines, and off you go, blasting away instead of encouraging and assisting the person.
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Don't need to work 121 to be able to read numbers in a table.
 
jordane93 said:
You usually won’t see an MEL in light GA aircraft. They’re more for jets and large turboprops. For light GA planes you’ll sometimes have a Kinds of Operation Equipment List stating which equipment you need for day/night VFR and day/night IFR.
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Most Pt 135 twins will have an MEL. Everyone I have flown has had one. The Operation Equipment List would be for part 91 operations.

The Chieftains I flew in Alaska had 2 heaters. If one heater was inop then the plane could not be used to carry passengers as per MEL. Even if both heaters were inop it still could be flown for cargo only flights.

The company definitely cared about passengers more than they did about pilots...o_O
 
Zeldman said:
Most Pt 135 twins will have an MEL. Everyone I have flown has had one. The Operation Equipment List would be for part 91 operations.

The Chieftains I flew in Alaska had 2 heaters. If one heater was inop then the plane could not be used to carry passengers as per MEL. Even if both heaters were inop it still could be flown for cargo only flights.

The company definitely cared about passengers more than they did about pilots...o_O
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Actually, a MEL is required for Part 135 as well as 121. That is if you want to be able to dispatch with inop items.

But yeah, order of importance:
1. Pax
2. Cargo
3. Crew
 
SkyDog58 said:
Actually, a MEL is required for Part 135 as well as 121. That is if you want to be able to dispatch with inop items.

But yeah, order of importance:
1. Pax
2. Cargo
3. Crew
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And the MEL gets thicker with 121. Not just because of (usually) more complex airplanes, but they basically allow you to fly with most anything broken. I guess the Feds put more faith in 121 and give them free reign. I'm taken back at times with what can be inop.
 
Correct. MEL is for 121 and 135. I was just stating, but not very clearly that most 135 planes are also light GA planes and they operate with a MEL.

And I thought it was:
1. pax
2. cargo
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497. Pilots
 
Kritchlow said:
Not sure you are reading them correctly. A five year FO at a legacy carrier does very well.
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After working like a slave for how many years at regionals etc to get there.

The whole 121 pilot system is screwed and it's kinda becoming obvious nowadays.


But I digress.
 
James331 said:
After working like a slave for how many years at regionals etc to get there.

The whole 121 pilot system is screwed and it's kinda becoming obvious nowadays.


But I digress.
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Not really. I never flew for the regionals. I came from corporate.
 
Kritchlow said:
Not really. I never flew for the regionals. I came from corporate.
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From 135 into a 121 major?

Rock on!

However I don't think that's exactly common
 
James331 said:
From 135 into a 121 major?

Rock on!

However I don't think that's exactly common
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Very common. Many corporate / fractional guys have 10,000 hrs pic jet time with international experience. That's way better than most regional guys.
 
mscard88 said:
Don't confuse him with facts now.
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I’d have to agree with James on this one. Kritchlow must have had a very impressive resume. If you look at the hiring demographics of the legacies, it’s mostly regional and military. 135 to legacy 121 does happen but not at the same rate as regional and military. It’s kind of like saying, you can get a job at a legacy without a degree. Well yea you can, but you’ll be limiting your options.
 
James331 said:
After working like a slave for how many years at regionals etc to get there.

The whole 121 pilot system is screwed and it's kinda becoming obvious nowadays.


But I digress.
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First year FO pay at regionals is now in the high 50's to low 60's without working overtime. I don't think that's a bad starting pay.
 
mtuomi said:
First year FO pay at regionals is now in the high 50's to low 60's without working overtime. I don't think that's a bad starting pay.
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No it's not, it's mostly still on the high 30s, with bonus that bump it up, however those bonus can be removed whenever management wants, I'm interested in the pay per the CBA.
 
jordane93 said:
It’s kind of like saying, you can get a job at a legacy without a degree. Well yea you can, but you’ll be limiting your options.
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I agree with this. My chief pilot from 135 got hired at the same place I did - it took him over two years to get called to interview. I got the call in 6 months. He was *much* more qualified than I was, but I had 121 time, and I think that made some difference. So it can be done, but it's not as easy of a path, at least at the legacies where out of the box thinking isn't exactly their strong suit. ;) Carriers like JetBlue, Frontier, etc...are probably better about it. Most of guys I fly with wouldn't know a Gulfstream or Global if it smacked them in the face - it's just another tiny little airplane.
 
Not that any of this matters - we all know James won't ever stoop to flying 121. :p
 
Kritchlow said:
And the MEL gets thicker with 121. Not just because of (usually) more complex airplanes, but they basically allow you to fly with most anything broken. I guess the Feds put more faith in 121 and give them free reign. I'm taken back at times with what can be inop.
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Maybe not more complex, but redundancy. Airliners have 3, of some systems/components, for that reason.
 
James331 said:
No it's not, it's mostly still on the high 30s, with bonus that bump it up, however those bonus can be removed whenever management wants, I'm interested in the pay per the CBA.
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I care what happens in my bank account. There are plenty of industries where base + bonus is the standard, that has been the case with regionals lately too. Change is in the air though, just look at Endeavor with their new payscale. No bonus and yes, it is in the mid 50's first year.
 
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