About to take my first solo.

Mafoo said:
Here is the flight. After takeoff, I was asked by the tower to extend my upwind leg. I was also asked to watch for traffic on the downwind, because a plane was landing in front of me (why I went a little long).

http://cloudahoy.com/cgi-bin/fltShare.cgi?share=18u238iaBNVpsurrohRM28

Now I want to fly some more! :)

EDIT: Now you all know you can call me Jeremy ;)
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Congratulations Jeremy - it will be even more exciting from this point on! Enjoy, learn and be safe.

(I wish I had been taking lessons at a towered airport, good for you).
 
iWantWings said:
Congratulations Jeremy - it will be even more exciting from this point on! Enjoy, learn and be safe.

(I wish I had been taking lessons at a towered airport, good for you).
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Thanks. I am very glad I am at a towered airport as well. So far one of the only things I have been nervous about so far in this experience, his hitting that little button that broadcasts my voice.

Fly a plane? No worries. Talk to a guy on a radio? Freak out a little.

Strange I know. Glad I am in a location where I can get over that :)
 
Congrats on the solo Jeremy! All your hard work and dedication are finally starting to pay off. Keep up the good work + can't wait to hear about your check ride!
 
nice work! Congrats!!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
When you balloon that is an indicator that you were too fast on final. Any float you carry is an indicator of excess speed. A proper landing in a small plane the stall warning should be sounding as it is several knots on top of stall. Stall speed is directly related to weight. When your instructor stepped out of the plane you reduced your stall speed around 5 knots so you should have reduced your final approach speed about the same. You can calculate what that speed should be at your typical solo weight. What you want to do is go up and stall the plane power off and note the indicated airspeed where it stalled. Take that number to your AFM/POH in the airplane and find the IAS-CAS table and get the CAS output for that input. Now multiply that by 1.3, take that result back into the table and come out with the speed that you should be flying your final approach. Once you have that number climb in figure eights to about 5500' AGL pointedt into the wind, put in 1700rpm to start, put in full flaps and trim the plane to fly that speed. Now adjust the throttle until you establish a 600' per minute rate of descent. The RPM you get as a result of this is the one you want to set the throttle to as you roll out on final and then put in whatever flaps you have remaining until full.this is what it looks like a nd just as importantly sounds like when you are on a well and safe final approach slope to transition into a safe landing. If you have a 600 fpm rate of descent trimmed 'hands off' at 1.3Vso calculated as I told you above as you start into your flare, I can assure you you best chances of consistent good landings.

Go ahead and keep flying it for a bit in that direction and let your eyes absorb the sight picture now turn 15* right and jus soak in that view for a bit . Just fly that trim setting at increasing angles of arc as you turn back and forth using approximately standard rate turns as indicated. The rate is not that critical, don't waste focus on it, however it is also another sight picture factor you want to get ready for as it's about the bank angle you'll want to use when fine tuning your crab angle as well as the resulting effects of change in perspective view. Just keep doing this until 2000' AGL and into the wind and add full power. Note the change in pitch that you get. Now flip the flap switch to full up and push the nose down to accellerate to your Vy speed and see the results that has on you rate of climb through the transition.

Once you establish a positive rate of climb trimmed and stabilized at Vy trim the nose down and add 10 kts and climb to 5500' again making as squared up of a rectangle emulating your pattern size as you can paying attention to your drift corrections you need on the 'crosswind' and 'base' legs. At 5500' or so roll out perpendicular to the wing and set up for final again with a 90* crosswind. This time put the wig down and use the opposit rudder to set you up into a slip to control the drift. When stabilized note your rate of descent and how much throttle you have to add to get back to 600FPM. This gives you an idea of what kind of changes in throttle position and sound you'll be experiencing.

The brain is an amazing thing, it learns all by itself from sensory input. The further we get from childhood and the more we learn from school however, we forget to use this inherent trait because we ran it to the point of diminishing returns around 5 years old. Thing is, this is something totally new, adding a third dimension to motion means you need to wake the stuff up and dig it out for use. This gives your brain a lot of good data to work with.
 
Henning said:
When you balloon that is an indicator that you were too fast on final. Any float you carry is an indicator of excess speed. A proper landing in a small plane the stall warning should be sounding as it is several knots on top of stall. Stall speed is directly related to weight. When your instructor stepped out of the plane you reduced your stall speed around 5 knots so you should have reduced your final approach speed about the same. You can calculate what that speed should be at your typical solo weight. What you want to do is go up and stall the plane power off and note the indicated airspeed where it stalled. Take that number to your AFM/POH in the airplane and find the IAS-CAS table and get the CAS output for that input. Now multiply that by 1.3, take that result back into the table and come out with the speed that you should be flying your final approach. Once you have that number climb in figure eights to about 5500' AGL pointedt into the wind, put in 1700rpm to start, put in full flaps and trim the plane to fly that speed. Now adjust the throttle until you establish a 600' per minute rate of descent. The RPM you get as a result of this is the one you want to set the throttle to as you roll out on final and then put in whatever flaps you have remaining until full.this is what it looks like a nd just as importantly sounds like when you are on a well and safe final approach slope to transition into a safe landing. If you have a 600 fpm rate of descent trimmed 'hands off' at 1.3Vso calculated as I told you above as you start into your flare, I can assure you you best chances of consistent good landings.

Go ahead and keep flying it for a bit in that direction and let your eyes absorb the sight picture now turn 15* right and jus soak in that view for a bit . Just fly that trim setting at increasing angles of arc as you turn back and forth using approximately standard rate turns as indicated. The rate is not that critical, don't waste focus on it, however it is also another sight picture factor you want to get ready for as it's about the bank angle you'll want to use when fine tuning your crab angle as well as the resulting effects of change in perspective view. Just keep doing this until 2000' AGL and into the wind and add full power. Note the change in pitch that you get. Now flip the flap switch to full up and push the nose down to accellerate to your Vy speed and see the results that has on you rate of climb through the transition.

Once you establish a positive rate of climb trimmed and stabilized at Vy trim the nose down and add 10 kts and climb to 5500' again making as squared up of a rectangle emulating your pattern size as you can paying attention to your drift corrections you need on the 'crosswind' and 'base' legs. At 5500' or so roll out perpendicular to the wing and set up for final again with a 90* crosswind. This time put the wig down and use the opposit rudder to set you up into a slip to control the drift. When stabilized note your rate of descent and how much throttle you have to add to get back to 600FPM. This gives you an idea of what kind of changes in throttle position and sound you'll be experiencing.

The brain is an amazing thing, it learns all by itself from sensory input. The further we get from childhood and the more we learn from school however, we forget to use this inherent trait because we ran it to the point of diminishing returns around 5 years old. Thing is, this is something totally new, adding a third dimension to motion means you need to wake the stuff up and dig it out for use. This gives your brain a lot of good data to work with.
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This is great information. Thanks.

Unfortunately at the moment I am only qualified to solo in the pattern, so no stalls yet. Sometime next week however, I should be able to take the C172 into the training area solo, and I will try this stuff out.

As for why I have been ballooning to date, it's been because I don't reduce the power smoothly. I push it into idol way to quick when I am ready to do my flair, so I overcompensate for the quick dip. When I don't do that, it works out fine.

So I know what not to do, I just need to not do it :).
 
Mafoo said:
This is great information. Thanks.

Unfortunately at the moment I am only qualified to solo in the pattern, so no stalls yet. Sometime next week however, I should be able to take the C172 into the training area solo, and I will try this stuff out.

As for why I have been ballooning to date, it's been because I don't reduce the power smoothly. I push it into idol way to quick when I am ready to do my flair, so I overcompensate for the quick dip. When I don't do that, it works out fine.

So I know what not to do, I just need to not do it :).
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At 1.3 Vso you should close the throttle smoothly but immediately to idle anreach down and give the trim one last flick as you're increasing back pressure and decelerating. That .3 extra speed is all the energy you need to trade in a flare from a 600fpm rate of decent. Anything above that is going to allow for ballooning. The key is learning the exact height you want to pull the throttle and start pulling back and the rate at which to pull until you reach touch down attitude.

Here's your drill for learning touch down attitude, you can do this with your instructor when checking out in the 172. Taxi to the runway and set full nose up trim, don't add any flaps. Hold the yoke all the way back and apply full power as the airspeed comes alive ease the throttle back to 1700 RPM and wait for the nose to come up to where the cowl is level with the end of the runway. This is a good approximation of the sight picture you should have on landing varied some due to your personal height of eye. Ride this 'wheelie' down the runway to the end, and back if possible; optimally I'd say you want a good 3 5000'+ runway lengths of this. Spend most of your time looking ahead in the direction you want and practice focussing in your peripheral vision. This creates an indelible image of the sight picture you are transitioning to so your brain can accurately determine rate of change required to get there.

If you do this and then go up and do the process above with calculating 1.3 Vso actual at weight with you and your instructor and go through the drill I described above as your checkout procedure with him, your first landing in a 172 is gonna likely leave you with a grin. What I described is what I use as standard method to check out in a new to me single seat plane.

Tell ya what, talk his language. Tell him you want to develop a Speed Card for your training weight. You want a card for 1.2Vso (short field approach; also steep approach because at low speed further reductions in speed with no increase in power, any decrease in speed has an exponential increase in rate of sink), 1.3Vso for final, and 1.5 Vso for your target speed entering the pattern, also establish your power setting for 1.5Vso in straight and level flight.

This is the power setting you want to choose as you reach pattern attitude and trim for that speed. Stabilize on that before you start reconfiguring with flaps about midfield on downwind. The wind will determine where in the pattern to add flaps from there and making pitch and power changes. You'll figure this out in your pattern work later, what we're doing is figuring out your target speeds an power settings at where you need to be stable for key points in your landing. Everything else is variable with conditions between those key points. You'll find that if you start with flaps about midfield downwind with the runway down at a 45* angle and then stabilize the power for maintaing altitude until abeam the numbers. Now add a flick of nose up trim to slow the plane down a little and reduce power as required to stabilize on the new trim speed as you put in the next notch or about 20* flaps allowing for a rate of descent to start building to about 400fpm by the time the threshold is 45* over your shoulder and then turn base. At this point you can set your throttle to your previously determined settings for final at 600fpm as you roll into your turn to final. As you roll out on final, put in the rest of the flaps; fine trim in final configuration trimming for 1.3Vso and there you are. Now you are stable at a key reference point. From here we hold that and observe what happens to determine what changes to power we need to make to compensate for the wind.

The trick to this is watching a point at the airport boundary on the extended centerline through the windshield paying attention to its reference off the nose. If it is slipping under the plane you need to reduce power and let the trim take care of the airspeed. Let the machine do the work for you, use the trim for every airspeed, the key trim to be at is 1.3Vso for your weight. If you reach that keyhole at 100' at a 1000 meters - quarter mile on that speed, you will be in a very good place unless there is a significant head wind and your engine dies. If you use the 45* displacement and turn points, you should be good anyway.

More importantly though is if that keyhole is rising in the windshield you need to add power as you aren't gonna make it. BTW, if you ever determine you aren't going to make it, don't try. Pick the best spot you can make that's in your windshield and land the plane as far into it as you can. Keep control until you can't. Look at how the plane is constructed and figure how to use it to best advantage. If you can get it to anywhere on airport property it's a bonus. Resist the urge to stretch a glide as that desire is nearly always fatal in consequence. If you have a VASI or PAPI light and you are heavy on red before being over the fence, you need power.

The further out you get stabilized on your power setting to get that keyhole stable the better because you can then transition to the flare keyhole. This is the one that gets you a good landing every time. This is the one that is above the edge of the threshold at 3-5'. When you cross the fence you reach down and give the trim wheel 2 or 3 more solid full flicks nose up then hand back to the throttle. This should get the plane to slow down to the stall horn with only minimum control input from your part. All you need to do with the yoke it to stop deviations from steady state. That is the true meaning of a stabilized approach. The steady state you want is to be at your final keyhole 3-5' over the threshold with the stall horn steadily squeaking on 'low'. At that point you can gently pull the throttle all the way out, hold your current pitch as the stall horn gets louder and you'll roll right on.

There is a mathematical way to derive the reduction in solo Vso by removing your instructors weight, he should have that one for you at the end of the check out lesson after you figure dual Vso.
 
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lol, this is a lot of information to remember, I will print this out and take it with me, and see how much of it I can accomplish.

Thanks for taking the time to write it!
 
No worries, give it serious thought and effort and see what you come out with. See how many landings it takes before you get three good ones.
 
Mafoo said:
Unfortunately at the moment I am only qualified to solo in the pattern, so no stalls yet. Sometime next week however, I should be able to take the C172 into the training area solo, and I will try this stuff out.
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I remember my first time in a practice area solo. I climbed to 7000' AGL to practice stalls. I figured it would give me some time to recover from a potential spin.
 
Meanee said:
I remember my first time in a practice area solo. I climbed to 7000' AGL to practice stalls. I figured it would give me some time to recover from a potential spin.
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Hah. I still haven't been at 7000' AGL as a pilot.
 
ChrisK said:
Hah. I still haven't been at 7000' AGL as a pilot.
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I have. It's a nice way to test high altitude characteristics without all the turbulent air and poor emergency landing sites that mountains give you. Slow flight at 10,000 MSL is quite different from sea level. Climb behavior in a 172 is anemic; to get decent climb rates, you have to slow down substantially. Vy in a 172 or a Warrior is below 70 KIAS at that altitude.

And you'll get best true airspeed out of a 172 at around 8000 feet MSL.

Things look different from up there, as well.

I'm not so sure that makes sense for a student practicing stalls, though. They don't feel the same at altitude. The point is to feel what near-stall behaviors feel like in the pattern.
 
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