A36 for rent

spiderweb

spiderweb

Final Approach
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Ben
There is a very nice A36 for rent at ADS (www.monarchair.com/rental1.html). I never thought about it until now because I was so far away from the requirements which are: Instrument Rating, 500 hours total time, 100 rg, 5 make and model. Now, though, I am closer to meeting those requirements, so I am thinking about getting checked out in it maybe next spring. Are those typical requirements times? They seem about right to me. Most of all, go ahead and make my day and tell me how sweetly an A36 flies. (I only have six hours in an F33, but I loved it.)
 
You'll like the A36 for how stable it is in weather, but you'll miss the frisky way that the F33 climbs in comparison to the A36.

Some time when you are in town, drop a line and I'll take you for a ride in RFC's A36.

The A36 at Monarch is air conditioned. That ain't so bad!
 
Oh man, you've hit a hot button with the A36. I have about 700 hours in an A36 and 350 or so in an F33. Spike's got it right.

The F33 is more fun to fly (lighter on the controls, a bit faster, and climbs better), but the A36 is a great airplane if you have very much to haul. I flight plan at 160 kts block to block and fly 23 squared. I generally see 170 kts TAS at that power setting and burn 16.5 - 16.9 gph. I've flown it at 16,000' but it doesn't like it up there. From 7,000 to 10,000 is where our A36 is happiest. A/C is wonderful and ours works well. Landings are easy and there are very few quirks to the airplane.

Like all Bonanzas, make sure the door is properly latched before takeoff. Make sure the instructor pops the door for you during your checkout so you can experience the noise and understand that handling is not affected.
The HI boost is only for priming the engine. HI boost in flight will almost certianly flood and kill the engine.
Gear speeds in later models are nice and high - 154 kts IAS. Same for first notch of flaps.
Hot starts require holding your mouth just right, but once you've got the procedure it's not difficult to do.

I'm surprised the requirements for renting are as low as they are. Take advantage of it. IMHO, the A36 is the finest single engine piston aircraft made. But then I'm not too objective when it comes to Beech products.
Let us know what you decide to do. What year model?
 
SCCutler said:
You'll like the A36 for how stable it is in weather, but you'll miss the frisky way that the F33 climbs in comparison to the A36.

Some time when you are in town, drop a line and I'll take you for a ride in RFC's A36.

The A36 at Monarch is air conditioned. That ain't so bad!
Click to expand...

[rant]This is the second time I'm writing it due to firefox problems >:0[/rant]

Ahhh, air conditioning is great! IMHO it is a must in the summer!

My grandfather owns an '94 A36 and it is a joy to fly. It is very stable, has good performance and is a dream to fly. I jump at the opportunity to fly in the 'nanza. For a speed reference, a few months ago we had a strong tailwind and were doing 205 kts Groundspped with a IAS of 175kts! It's like a rocket in a nice tailwind. From what I've seen as well the braking in these machines are amazing. I've provided links to some pictures and video's I've taken of the A36 on the ground and t/o and landing vids. I'm surprised they have a 500 total time requirement...could possibly be for liability in an expensive, complex, high-performance a/c? Not to familiar with the average A36 checkout requirements though.


EDIT: I also wanted to add....yes I think it is heavy on the controls, but never flew an F33 so can't compare it on that aspect. As regard to popping the door, this is a good idea. My grandfather had it happen once and it wasn't much fun, but you have to prioritize and think of your #1 duty: fly the plane!

When we fly he physically reaches over me and closes to door and checks at the top between the door and the jam to make sure it's closed. It might seem a little paranoid, but I find it to me a safe thing and fully excersizing your FAR 91.3 privledges as PIC. Good idea as Chip mentioned to ask the instructor to pop the door or at least familiarize you with the proper procedure(s). END EDIT

Pictures:
http://hpnpilot1200.org/gallery/aviation (Many Bonanza sub-albums located there)

Videos:
http://hpnpilot1200.org/gallery/Videos
OR
http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=886
http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=885

You can also do a flightlevel350.com search for "Bonanza A36" or just "A36"


Hope you enjoy! Let me know what you decide.

Jason

P.S. Here is a neat flightlevel350.com video I stumbled upon...they always have neat things there...this one particularly shows some wing-tip vorticies if anyone wanted a neat visual of them:

http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=2569
 
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Ben;

Enjoy;

I do not have any real time in the A36, but have flown many hours in the BE35s and my old C33. The 33 series are great. I got to fly a C33 with the 550 conversion while I was looking to buy one,with tip tanks and it was a hot rod. The 36 is a nice balance of speed and load carrying. Dave S. can tell you a lot about it. My old C33 is a fast and efficient plane but not a load carrier the way the A36 is. Weight and Balance is a big issue. All the Bonanzas are fun to fly.

I hope you get a chance to enjoy the experience

John
 
I have flown a couple of times in a Bonanza.
Only Left seat once, the rest of the time right seat. I loved it, it seemed somewhat heavy to me at first, but I got use to it. It was a blast to fly!!
I have a definite part of me that wants a Bonanza someday!!
 
SCCutler said:
You'll like the A36 for how stable it is in weather, but you'll miss the frisky way that the F33 climbs in comparison to the A36.

Some time when you are in town, drop a line and I'll take you for a ride in RFC's A36.

The A36 at Monarch is air conditioned. That ain't so bad!
Click to expand...
Wow, thanks Spike!
 
Thanks for all of the information! I have to remember about the hi boost. Would the restart after a flooding be to pull out full lean until the engine catches?

I think it is a 1980.

gibbons said:
Oh man, you've hit a hot button with the A36. I have about 700 hours in an A36 and 350 or so in an F33. Spike's got it right.

The F33 is more fun to fly (lighter on the controls, a bit faster, and climbs better), but the A36 is a great airplane if you have very much to haul. I flight plan at 160 kts block to block and fly 23 squared. I generally see 170 kts TAS at that power setting and burn 16.5 - 16.9 gph. I've flown it at 16,000' but it doesn't like it up there. From 7,000 to 10,000 is where our A36 is happiest. A/C is wonderful and ours works well. Landings are easy and there are very few quirks to the airplane.

Like all Bonanzas, make sure the door is properly latched before takeoff. Make sure the instructor pops the door for you during your checkout so you can experience the noise and understand that handling is not affected.
The HI boost is only for priming the engine. HI boost in flight will almost certianly flood and kill the engine.
Gear speeds in later models are nice and high - 154 kts IAS. Same for first notch of flaps.
Hot starts require holding your mouth just right, but once you've got the procedure it's not difficult to do.

I'm surprised the requirements for renting are as low as they are. Take advantage of it. IMHO, the A36 is the finest single engine piston aircraft made. But then I'm not too objective when it comes to Beech products.
Let us know what you decide to do. What year model?
Click to expand...
 
Thanks so much for all of this!

HPNPilot1200 said:
[rant]This is the second time I'm writing it due to firefox problems >:0[/rant]

Ahhh, air conditioning is great! IMHO it is a must in the summer!

My grandfather owns an '94 A36 and it is a joy to fly. It is very stable, has good performance and is a dream to fly. I jump at the opportunity to fly in the 'nanza. For a speed reference, a few months ago we had a strong tailwind and were doing 205 kts Groundspped with a IAS of 175kts! It's like a rocket in a nice tailwind. From what I've seen as well the braking in these machines are amazing. I've provided links to some pictures and video's I've taken of the A36 on the ground and t/o and landing vids. I'm surprised they have a 500 total time requirement...could possibly be for liability in an expensive, complex, high-performance a/c? Not to familiar with the average A36 checkout requirements though.


EDIT: I also wanted to add....yes I think it is heavy on the controls, but never flew an F33 so can't compare it on that aspect. As regard to popping the door, this is a good idea. My grandfather had it happen once and it wasn't much fun, but you have to prioritize and think of your #1 duty: fly the plane!

When we fly he physically reaches over me and closes to door and checks at the top between the door and the jam to make sure it's closed. It might seem a little paranoid, but I find it to me a safe thing and fully excersizing your FAR 91.3 privledges as PIC. Good idea as Chip mentioned to ask the instructor to pop the door or at least familiarize you with the proper procedure(s). END EDIT

Pictures:
http://hpnpilot1200.org/gallery/aviation (Many Bonanza sub-albums located there)

Videos:
http://hpnpilot1200.org/gallery/Videos
OR
http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=886
http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=885

You can also do a flightlevel350.com search for "Bonanza A36" or just "A36"


Hope you enjoy! Let me know what you decide.

Jason

P.S. Here is a neat flightlevel350.com video I stumbled upon...they always have neat things there...this one particularly shows some wing-tip vorticies if anyone wanted a neat visual of them:

http://flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=2569
Click to expand...
 
Thanks, John. I guess with all of this enthusiasm I really should get checked out in one once I get to 500 hours!
John J said:
Ben;

Enjoy;

I do not have any real time in the A36, but have flown many hours in the BE35s and my old C33. The 33 series are great. I got to fly a C33 with the 550 conversion while I was looking to buy one,with tip tanks and it was a hot rod. The 36 is a nice balance of speed and load carrying. Dave S. can tell you a lot about it. My old C33 is a fast and efficient plane but not a load carrier the way the A36 is. Weight and Balance is a big issue. All the Bonanzas are fun to fly.

I hope you get a chance to enjoy the experience

John
Click to expand...
 
When people say the A36 is heavy, what do they mean? I found the Saratoga heavy--heavier than the C182 which I now feel is normal. The Zlin is very light and snappy (you just THINK your inputs).
 
wangmyers said:
When people say the A36 is heavy, what do they mean? I found the Saratoga heavy--heavier than the C182 which I now feel is normal. The Zlin is very light and snappy (you just THINK your inputs).
Click to expand...

Ben, I would say it is heavy compared with the F33 or C33; compared to a 210, on the other hand, it feels like a sports car! Bigger plane, less frisky, but not like a 182 where you have to haul it back to flare. Pitch control in the A36 is very nice, IMHO. If you use trim judiciously, the Bonanzas are nearly land-o-matics. Make even ham-fisted pilots like me look marginally competent.

In our club, we have the F33, the C33 (Deb) with 550 (300hp) STC; and the A36. If one has been flying the Deb, one gets used to taking off, looking at blue sky and 1,500 fpm light. In the A36, it's more sedate nad less steep.

But it's all good!
 
I love my Bonanza, it's fun to fly and fast. I actually think the rental requirements are rather low, it's pretty hard to insure one as an owner.

Also, $185 an hour seems crazy to me. It costs me $65 an hour wet to fly mine which includes an engine reserve!

-Erik
 
wangmyers said:
There is a very nice A36 for rent at ADS (www.monarchair.com/rental1.html). I never thought about it until now because I was so far away from the requirements which are: Instrument Rating, 500 hours total time, 100 rg, 5 make and model. Now, though, I am closer to meeting those requirements, so I am thinking about getting checked out in it maybe next spring. Are those typical requirements times? They seem about right to me. Most of all, go ahead and make my day and tell me how sweetly an A36 flies. (I only have six hours in an F33, but I loved it.)
Click to expand...

You'll like the way it flies, smooth and steady down the chute, nice ride. Surprisingly I've found quite a few A-36s, Saratogas, 310s, Barons, Navajos and such to rent down here, A-36s are termed for 'rough field service'here. Getting my commercial license down here is proving an exercise in beaurocracy, and since they don't distinguish a Class 1 from a Class 2 medical, you get a class 1 every year whether operating as ATP or Commercial best as I understand it, hope I have that down, I have to take an "Air Law" written next week then do a checkride and Ag quals in an unmodified A model Dromadier. This medical alone is a three day process, and immigrations won't be done with me till the new year.
 
gibbons said:
IMHO, the A36 is the finest single engine piston aircraft made.
Click to expand...

So, if you HAD to choose between the A36 and the 300L which one would you keep? Sounds like the A36.
 
wangmyers said:
Thanks for all of the information! I have to remember about the hi boost. Would the restart after a flooding be to pull out full lean until the engine catches?

I think it is a 1980.
Click to expand...

Flooded start, any engine. MAGS OFF, throttle full, mixture ICO; Crank engine 6-10 blades, let sit 3 minutes for hot engine, 10 minutes for cold. Mags on, throttle 1/2-3/4, mixture 1/4: crank, bring in mix and reduce throttle as it clears its throat.
 
ErikU said:
It costs me $65 an hour wet to fly mine which includes an engine reserve!

-Erik
Click to expand...
That's impressive. At 16.5 gph and fuel at $4.25 here at home, it costs me $70/hour in fuel alone.
 
Bill Jennings said:
So, if you HAD to choose between the A36 and the 300L which one would you keep? Sounds like the A36.
Click to expand...

That would depend on whether you intended to fly right side up or not.
 
Bill Jennings said:
So, if you HAD to choose between the A36 and the 300L which one would you keep? Sounds like the A36.
Click to expand...
If I were single, no kids, and didn't have much to carry on trips I'd keep the Extra. I have a friend who sold his Bonanza to buy an Extra 300 and says he's "never looked back." But if I was pushed into making a decision between the two, it would be more practical to keep the A36.

Maybe I should have said, "The A36 is the finest single engine piston family friendly aircraft ever made." :D
 
gibbons said:
That's impressive. At 16.5 gph and fuel at $4.25 here at home, it costs me $70/hour in fuel alone.
Click to expand...

My E35 (225 HP) cost me about $80/hr based on 150 hrs per year back when fuel was something like $1.50/gal. That included about $40/hr for direct costs (fuel, engine/prop reserve, oil, wear related maint, tires, brakes etc) and 8000 for fixed (hangar, registration, annual, insurance, cost of money invested). Any Bonanza operating today for $65/hr can't be doing much more than taxiing around the airport.
 
lancefisher said:
My E35 (225 HP) cost me about $80/hr based on 150 hrs per year back when fuel was something like $1.50/gal. That included about $40/hr for direct costs (fuel, engine/prop reserve, oil, wear related maint, tires, brakes etc) and 8000 for fixed (hangar, registration, annual, insurance, cost of money invested). Any Bonanza operating today for $65/hr can't be doing much more than taxiing around the airport.
Click to expand...

$185 sounds cheap to me. The club I belonged to early last year was charging 168/hr for an IO-550 Deb. Let alone a newer A36.

We plan for $50-60/hr here for our engine reserve. Another $60/hr in fuel. Still cheaper per hour than renting the 182 from the old club though! :)


If you're close to your total hours Ben, you might consider doing some of them as an early checkout. I'm sure they'll want some dual time to get you situated, so have an instructor take you up early. Time in type always helps out. :) Welcome to the world of Beechcraft!
 
ErikU said:
Also, $185 an hour seems crazy to me.
-Erik
Click to expand...

Locally (30 miles - JYO), a fixed gear Saratoga rents for $165, and a Dakota rents for $145. $185 for an A36 is a bargain.

Running my 182RG through the Aircraft Cost Excel model yields $142 an hour, given $3.75 fuel and it's not on leaseback. I can't imagine what the insurance would be on an A36 for rental use.

Greg
182RG
 
Those minimums are pretty high though. The Deb at our club only needed 250TT, 25 retract with a 10hr dual checkout. My open requirements on the Bo is 750TT 250 retract and 100 type.
 
Just checked out the link. Beautiful A36 though! Nice Avionics. Just wish someone had an A36 nearby to rent when I needed a little more room!
 
OK, I guess I'll switch my dream single to "Bo" now. Preferable with turbo, hot prop and weeping wing.
 
wangmyers said:
OK, I guess I'll switch my dream single to "Bo" now. Preferable with turbo, hot prop and weeping wing.
Click to expand...


Ah, yes, the B36TC. That's my dream single. With the IO-550 conversion from Tornado Alley: http://www.taturbo.com/tcppr.html which adds cowl flaps, better cooling, increased in TBO and gross weight, and other features. AOPA did a write-up on it in the last year, said it was quite possibly the "perfect single".
 
Troy Whistman said:
Ah, yes, the B36TC. That's my dream single. With the IO-550 conversion from Tornado Alley: http://www.taturbo.com/tcppr.html which adds cowl flaps, better cooling, increased in TBO and gross weight, and other features. AOPA did a write-up on it in the last year, said it was quite possibly the "perfect single".
Click to expand...

Definitely nice. We're planning for the TAT TN conversion in the next 400hrs or so.
 
Ben;

You will love the Bo. I feel so lucky for the first one I flew was a C35 when I was 17 and then got to fly a H,J,K ,M and then wonders of wonders a P and some say the fastest, the S model 35. My favorite 33 model Deb is still the C 33 for I guess Beech got it right with the Panel and fuel cells. Plus it is light. I did get to fly the A,B series but the panel and fuel cells are spilt among 4 units All the Beech's are so fun to fly. I did get to fly a A36 and it is so nice and not "Truck" like the C210 or the Piper Saratoga. The Beech is so nice when it does it's thing (go fast) and the visability is just great. You sit up high. The landings are the best part for they are easy to land.

I hope you get to fly one, have fun

Enjoy

John
 
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Like the Saratoga/Lance/CherokeeSix the A36 often allows a fairly wide range of flying weights and the handling is different at the extremes. An A36 (like any Bo) is also much more sensitive to CG location than most Pipers and Cessnas. There is a very noticeable difference in the stability and pitch control force between the forward and rear CG limits.
 
AirBaker said:
Definitely nice. We're planning for the TAT TN conversion in the next 400hrs or so.
Click to expand...

Maybe you should sell yours and buy Dave's A36. It's already got the turbonormalizer. Given the cost of TAT's upgrade, you might end up with less invested by doing so and you'd have an A36 to boot.
 
Hot, Flooded same differance, Throttle full open, mixture rich, boost on until fuel flow peaks, then turn off.

leave throttle open, mixture ICO, crank till start, juggle mixture and throttle till running, works everytime.
 
wesleyj said:
Hot, Flooded same differance, Throttle full open, mixture rich, boost on until fuel flow peaks, then turn off.

leave throttle open, mixture ICO, crank till start, juggle mixture and throttle till running, works everytime.
Click to expand...

If you know it's flooded, there's not much point in adding more fuel, and doing so usually means that fuel is running out of the manifold drains creating a fire risk. In addition if you manage to get much of that fuel into the cylinders themselves it can wash the oil off the cylinder walls leading to premature wear.

So starting from a known flooded condition I would start with the mixture in cut-off and the throttle at least half open. As long as it didn't result in any additional fuel flow, I'd also use low boost. Once the engine starts to fire both hands are needed to close the throttle and richen the mixture.
 
lancefisher said:
If you know it's flooded, there's not much point in adding more fuel, and doing so usually means that fuel is running out of the manifold drains creating a fire risk. In addition if you manage to get much of that fuel into the cylinders themselves it can wash the oil off the cylinder walls leading to premature wear.

So starting from a known flooded condition I would start with the mixture in cut-off and the throttle at least half open. As long as it didn't result in any additional fuel flow, I'd also use low boost. Once the engine starts to fire both hands are needed to close the throttle and richen the mixture.
Click to expand...
This is the recommended procedure for the injected Cessnas I fly, but I was really wondering about a flooded engine IN FLIGHT (caused by accidentally hitting the boost pump to "hi"). That would get your attention!
 
lancefisher said:
So starting from a known flooded condition I would start with the mixture in cut-off and the throttle at least half open. As long as it didn't result in any additional fuel flow, I'd also use low boost. Once the engine starts to fire both hands are needed to close the throttle and richen the mixture.
Click to expand...

When our Archer III floods (and it does hot start if the pilot doesn't know the trick), the three handed method is the only way to get her going.
 
AirBaker said:
$185 sounds cheap to me. The club I belonged to early last year was charging 168/hr for an IO-550 Deb. Let alone a newer A36.

We plan for $50-60/hr here for our engine reserve. Another $60/hr in fuel. Still cheaper per hour than renting the 182 from the old club though! :)


If you're close to your total hours Ben, you might consider doing some of them as an early checkout. I'm sure they'll want some dual time to get you situated, so have an instructor take you up early. Time in type always helps out. :) Welcome to the world of Beechcraft!
Click to expand...

I can rent them (A-36s) down here for AUS$145 and the fuel cost here is tripple what it is in the states.
 
ggroves said:
I can't imagine what the insurance would be on an A36 for rental use.

Greg
182RG
Click to expand...

It depends on how much deductable you want to buy. It can be done as long as you either assume the risk of the deductable or secure a way of collecting it from the third party. If it's on the line at an FBO, it may be covered under the fleet/business policy.
 
lancefisher said:
Maybe you should sell yours and buy Dave's A36. It's already got the turbonormalizer. Given the cost of TAT's upgrade, you might end up with less invested by doing so and you'd have an A36 to boot.
Click to expand...
I'm guessing the A36 is out of our price range. :)
 
wangmyers said:
This is the recommended procedure for the injected Cessnas I fly, but I was really wondering about a flooded engine IN FLIGHT (caused by accidentally hitting the boost pump to "hi"). That would get your attention!
Click to expand...
Oh! As long as it's not turbocharged, it's really simple. Just turn off the boost pump and the engine will come back to life. When you flood it with boost, the engine will windmill with the prop governor trying to maintain RPM. As soon as the fuel flow comes back into a combustible range, the engine will start making power again. To prevent a temporary surge in RPM it would be wise to go to half throttle before shutting off the pump. And AFaIK you could continue to run with the boost pump on (and the engine driven pump working) by leaning the mixture, but I suspect that the actual air/fuel ratio will be a bit unstable that way.
 
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