6Y9 2009 Flying season

Brad's a lunberjack and he's ok....

Sorry just couldn't resist :D
 
I have a box of two dozen balsa-wood airplanes from the Iowa DOT sitting in my living room ready for 6Y9 this year. Maybe Tony can get some bottle-rockets from Missouri and we can have some 'airplane vs. jet' competitions after the kids leave. :D
 
CJones said:
I have a box of two dozen balsa-wood airplanes from the Iowa DOT sitting in my living room ready for 6Y9 this year. Maybe Tony can get some bottle-rockets from Missouri and we can have some 'airplane vs. jet' competitions after the kids leave. :D
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Or rocket powered balsa planes. :yes:
 
CJones said:
I have a box of two dozen balsa-wood airplanes from the Iowa DOT sitting in my living room ready for 6Y9 this year. Maybe Tony can get some bottle-rockets from Missouri and we can have some 'airplane vs. jet' competitions after the kids leave. :D
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EdFred said:
Or rocket powered balsa planes. :yes:
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I like the way you guys think.
 
OK Then
Bottle rocket powered balsa gliders it is (after the kids leave)
It doesn't take much for us guy's to keep us entertained:
6Y9+ Balsa gliders+bottle rockets+ Jack=:yikes:
 
This is sounding better and better by the day.
 
im actualy really dissapointed in myself that i never thought of bottle rocket launched balsa gliders before...
 
I'm thinking multiple bottle rocket engines with progressively longer fuses ,timed so they don't all go off at once,a three stage jet glider.

By the way do you know what was the first jet airplane for the United States?
Hint: This plane was recently discussed in Flight Following
 
el con said:
I'm thinking multiple bottle rocket engines with progressively longer fuses ,timed so they don't all go off at once,a three stage jet glider.

By the way do you know what was the first jet airplane for the United States?
Hint: This plane was recently discussed in Flight Following
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The Ercoupe wasn't the first with Jets, but it was the first to use Rocket Assisted Takeoff. At least one flight was done without a propeller, making it the first purely rocket propelled airplane in the US.

srvr
 
Jet,Rocket,other than piston is kinda what I was going for.
But yes it was the Ercoupe.
Ted , since you're a Lycoming guy are you going to be able to build one of these?:smile:
Maybe Kate will bring the Ercoupe this year and we can experiment:yikes:
 
el con said:
Jet,Rocket,other than piston is kinda what I was going for.
But yes it was the Ercoupe.
Ted , since you're a Lycoming guy are you going to be able to build one of these?:smile:
Maybe Kate will bring the Ercoupe this year and we can experiment:yikes:
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Technically, a rocket is a form of jet propulsion. What we commonly think of when a jet airplane is mentioned is actually a turbojet. So I'd have to agree that the Ercoupe launched by a rocket engine was indeed a jet powered airplane.
 
Adding "fire extinguisher" and "extra fingers" to my gear list... :rolleyes:
 
tonycondon said:
im actualy really dissapointed in myself that i never thought of bottle rocket launched balsa gliders before...
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OBVIOUSLY, you didn't grow up in Alabama. We thought EVERYTHING could fly with enough bottle-rockets attached... paper airplanes... GI Joe men... frogs...
 
CJones said:
OBVIOUSLY, you didn't grow up in Alabama. We thought EVERYTHING could fly with enough bottle-rockets attached... paper airplanes... GI Joe men... frogs...
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yea, it sucks growing up in a state with no explosives.

here's the proof of concept. we can do a lot better than these guys:

 
tonycondon said:
here's the proof of concept. we can do a lot better than these guys:
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Oh yes.. Definitely. I got Kermit to fly a lot longer than those guys got an airplane to go. The bar is set very low by those guys.

My goal will be to create a balsa-wood bomber. Flight by bottle rockets which light a long fuse to firecrackers which are dropped from above. :D
 
this guy is on the right track. need longer burning bottle rockets...or just more of them. perhaps staging would be a good idea.

 
CJones said:
Oh yes.. Definitely. I got Kermit to fly a lot longer than those guys got an airplane to go. The bar is set very low by those guys.

My goal will be to create a balsa-wood bomber. Flight by bottle rockets which light a long fuse to firecrackers which are dropped from above. :D
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thats a good idea. there is a guy here who is big into RC airplanes. they've got a monster scale B29 or something, with bomb bay doors and a rack that holds a bunch of paint balls. could have a lot of fun with something like that...
 
stability and controls could be the biggest problem...

 
this guy's got something figured out.


i think the rocket motors need to be mounted above the CG. those balsa wood gliders have a serious pitch up moment when they pick up speed. if you could get it to go straight i bet it would fly quite a ways.
 
el con said:
Ted , since you're a Lycoming guy are you going to be able to build one of these?:smile:
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Sorry, Brad, where I come from we have a different answer to all problems: more boost! :D
 
Those bottle rockets are wussy. I think the bomber would work much better if we stuffed the firecrackers into the upper casing of a couple of Estes D12-0 rocket engines. Launch with those, and they'll light the "bombs" when they burn out. :yes: :D
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Those bottle rockets are wussy. I think the bomber would work much better if we stuffed the firecrackers into the upper casing of a couple of Estes D12-0 rocket engines. Launch with those, and they'll light the "bombs" when they burn out. :yes: :D
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Probably so, but can you get like 5,000 Estes D12-0 rocket engines for $.50 like you can bottle rockets?? :D
 
Hmm we need Adam to get us some Ammonium Percholrate, some PBAN binder, and aluminum powder. :D

AS far as I can think of there are some CG shift issues to be considered. I'd say trim it out to fly ok with the bottle rocket burned out. and you may be better off.

Also a better launch guide system would be good
 
CJones said:
Probably so, but can you get like 5,000 Estes D12-0 rocket engines for $.50 like you can bottle rockets?? :D
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$13.25 for a 3-pack. I bet I still have some sitting around here somewhere from back when I had a Comanche 3 rocket. :D
 
tonycondon said:
yea, it sucks growing up in a state with no explosives.

here's the proof of concept. we can do a lot better than these guys:
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those guys don't understand weight and ballance... You can't put a single rocket out infront of the nose and expect it to fly...

Ted, I think it needs to be a twin.

Missa
 
I don't know if they still make them ,but I remember my Dad having a model rocket engine called a jet-x. It was a small aluminum canister with a solid fuel pellet you would put in and light with a fuse. You would use the canister over and over. No bang at the end of the flight. To big for the little Guillows/Jetfire/Starfire etc. Maybe I'll google this up.
 
Anything that works with one engine works better with two. Just look at the Twin Comanche. :)
 
Missa said:
those guys don't understand weight and ballance... You can't put a single rocket out infront of the nose and expect it to fly...

Ted, I think it needs to be a twin.

Missa
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Well--W&B aside-with the fixed control surfaces on a balsa like that there is no way you're going to be able to trim it for such a dramatic change in thrust/airspeed.
 
jesse said:
Well--W&B aside-with the fixed control surfaces on a balsa like that there is no way you're going to be able to trim it for such a dramatic change in thrust/airspeed.
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yep, engine placement is key. this may require a bit more investigation...anyone know where we can get thrust and weight specs on bottle rockets? otherwise my only choice is to buy a case of them and do some testing (darn)
 
tonycondon said:
yep, engine placement is key. this may require a bit more investigation...anyone know where we can get thrust and weight specs on bottle rockets? otherwise my only choice is to buy a case of them and do some testing (darn)
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I agree getting the CG in the right place in relation to Cp is important, but isn't also important to come up with a variable trim? I am thinking some sort of spring loaded elevator. As the force of the wind over the elevator increases the elevator would be forced into a position that would keep the nose down and level. A thin piece of material with a known k value is needed.
 
i think that placing the engine fore/aft so that it will shallowly glide and placing it up/down so that it will climb under power is ideal. this will probably require the engine to be mounted above the fuselage, so that the pitch down moment of the engine counteracts, but doesnt cancel out, the pitch up moment from the tail.
 
tonycondon said:
i think that placing the engine fore/aft so that it will shallowly glide and placing it up/down so that it will climb under power is ideal. this will probably require the engine to be mounted above the fuselage, so that the pitch down moment of the engine counteracts, but doesnt cancel out, the pitch up moment from the tail.
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Perhaps the V1 rocket design with the motor attached above the fuselage and to the top of the vertical stabilizer?
 
RMCN172RG said:
Perhaps the V1 rocket design with the motor attached above the fuselage and to the top of the vertical stabilizer?
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something like that. although from what i remember about balsa gliders, engine placement would probably be best on or just slightly behind the CG. They glide just about right the way they are.
 
Hmm Tony, can you get some strain gauges from work? I think we need to build a micro loadcell to generate thrust curves for the bottle rocket motors we plan on using.
 
6Y9 will need one of those model rocket launch NOTAMs!
 
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