$20K-$25K Sports Sedan

[SoonerAviator]

Since we have a thread going on small SUV/XUVs, I thought I throw one in for a purchase I'm looking to make in the next 3-6 months.

Backstory: my wife is a month pregnant with our first child, and stipulates that I can't buy a 2dr car (I wanted a G37 coupe). This car will be my DD, we currently have 2 4-dr crew cab trucks. I am not selling my truck because it's very nice, paid off, and is my tow vehicle, so it will be parked. The other truck is my wife's, and it's owned by her father, so it stays in use until the wheels fall off or he takes it back. So, I'm looking for something used with less than 30K miles on it or so, and preferably RWD, but AWD is acceptable, FWD is not.

Current cars under consideration:

2013-2015 Taurus SHO
- not terrible looking, has great tech value and performance for the money, but pricey and heavy at 4,300 lbs.

2013 Infiniti G37 or Q50
- smaller than the Taurus, but pretty much identical performance, less tech features but slightly better quality, also pricey for Q50

2013+ Cadillac ATS
- sporty in appearance and handling, but lacks much oomph for power and has small cabin

2009 Pontiac G8 GXP - ideal choice, not likely
- best of the bunch in terms of performance, available manual transmission, great styling. Downside is spartan interior and prices still hanging around $27-28K with higher mileage.

 

[rachelk.tailwinds]

Taurus SHO!!!! Who cares how heavy they are, the power it has more than makes up for it.

 

[bradg33]

Consider a late-model Subaru WRX (or STi if you can swing it). An older Audi S4 is also a good choice (though don't know how old you'd have to go to find one at $25k).

 

[SoonerAviator]

Consider a late-model Subaru WRX (or STi if you can swing it). An older Audi S4 is also a good choice (though don't know how old you'd have to go to find one at $25k).

Those are pretty small cars compared to the others listed, especially the WRX. I'm looking more for a mid-size sedan, or possibly full size. Audis are nice, but I'd be looking at an A5/A6, and those are pricey AND reliability nightmares from what I've seen from friends/reading.

 

[rachelk.tailwinds]

Consider a late-model Subaru WRX (or STi if you can swing it). An older Audi S4 is also a good choice (though don't know how old you'd have to go to find one at $25k).

Subarus are fine cars but they're overrated. You'll end up spending more than what their worth since they have that what-the-cool-kids-are-driving feature tacked onto the price tag.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Taurus SHO!!!! Who cares how heavy they are, the power it has more than makes up for it.

Lol, well technically the G37/Q50 is slightly faster on less HP without forced induction. However, they do have a good bit of potential with a bit of cheap add-ons (tuning/exhaust) which will make them into a 12-sec car. I do have a soft-spot for the SHO since I owned a '91 SHO+ with a 5-speed.

The G8 GXP would curb-stomp the SHO even after tuning, and also has a ton of aftermarket to go faster if desired with the LS3 V8.

 

[bnt83]

I rented a 2013 Taurus Limited and didn't like the transmission. I swear the thing shifted three times in the first 50 feet after a stop. It was annoying cause you could feel it every time.

 

[Luvrv8]

Infinity. We had a M35 and it has been the best car we owned. We had to sell it when he had the twins, needed a car that could hold 3 car seats. I actually think I liked the infinity more then the Lexus LS460L that we bought a year ago. The fit and finish was great, good power and the ride was real nice. As a mechanic I was happy with it, we never did anything more then brakes, filters and oil changes in the 80K we drove it.

 

[rachelk.tailwinds]

Lol, well technically the G37/Q50 is slightly faster on less HP without forced induction. However, they do have a good bit of potential with a bit of cheap add-ons (tuning/exhaust) which will make them into a 12-sec car. I do have a soft-spot for the SHO since I owned a '91 SHO+ with a 5-speed.

The G8 GXP would curb-stomp the SHO even after tuning, and also has a ton of aftermarket to go faster if desired with the LS3 V8.

Doesn't sound like the OP is interested in a drag race though I don't think the G37 would be noticeably faster anyway since the SHO has considerably more torque. The Taurus will no doubt be more reliable than his other options and even if it were to break, it'd likely be cheaper and easier to fix.

 

[Cooter]

Don't rule out mini-van! Its probably the best thing I ever bought my wife.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Doesn't sound like the OP is interested in a drag race though I don't think the G37 would be noticeably faster anyway since the SHO has considerably more torque. The Taurus will no doubt be more reliable than his other options and even if it were to break, it'd likely be cheaper and easier to fix.

The G37 runs about .1-.2 sec faster in 0-60/1/4mi vs a stock SHO. The 3.7L engine in the G37/M37/Q50 is about as reliable as they come as it's used in a half-dozen Nissan and Infiniti models. I'm actually more apprehensive about a twin-turbo EcoBoost engine in the SHO!

I've done a full 120K timing belt tear-down on a 3.0L TT Nissan engine before, so not much on the VQ37 engine in question here would scare me!

 

[SoonerAviator]

Don't rule out mini-van! Its probably the best thing I ever bought my wife.

The wife and I are in agreement on never owning a minivan. They are GREAT for having a family (tons of space, sliding/self opening/closing doors, etc) I'm just not willing to sacrifice my dignity for it at this point! If her dad takes back her truck at any point, she'll want a mid-large SUV like a Grand Cherokee or Yukon/Expedition.

 

[bradg33]

Those are pretty small cars compared to the others listed, especially the WRX. I'm looking more for a mid-size sedan, or possibly full size. Audis are nice, but I'd be looking at an A5/A6, and those are pricey AND reliability nightmares from what I've seen from friends/reading.

If you can get the WRX in a hatch, you get a fair amount of extra space. But yes, overall, they're not as large as a full-size sedan. On the Audis, the A5/S5 is a coupe. As far as reliability, I've owned an Audi and I've got friends with them. They're no more unreliable than any other high-end, high-performance sports sedan. Like most cars in that area, they do require regular maintenance, and failure to keep up with that can lead to expensive issues. But they're amazing driver's cars.

Others off the top of my head:
Dodge Charger
Merc C/E63 (mileage and $$ might be a problem)
BMW M3 (mileage and $$ might be a problem)
Caddy CTS/CTS-V

 

[Cooter]

The wife and I are in agreement on never owning a minivan. They are GREAT for having a family (tons of space, sliding/self opening/closing doors, etc) I'm just not willing to sacrifice my dignity for it at this point! If her dad takes back her truck at any point, she'll want a mid-large SUV like a Grand Cherokee or Yukon/Expedition.

I fought hard for an Expedition, even borrowed one for a few weeks to get her interested but she held firm on minivan and eventually won out. She is too small to lift the car seat into the back comfortably so I had to admit later that the MV was a better fit for her. As for dignity, kids will find other ways to destroy that!

 

[SoonerAviator]

I fought hard for an Expedition, even borrowed one for a few weeks to get her interested but she held firm on minivan and eventually won out. She is too small to lift the car seat into the back comfortably so I had to admit later that the MV was a better fit for her. As for dignity, kids will find other ways to destroy that!

Lol, no doubt. Since this is our first, I'm in no hurry for a 3rd row of seating! If we have a second child soon after, I'm sure it will be on the radar. If we were cursed with 3+ kids I'll give up and get the Yukon XL/Suburban/etc and start wearing socks with my sandals!

 

[Ted]

The problem with any sedan ends up being having enough room for rear facing car seats and you having enough leg room. We have 3 kids so 3 car seats across the back. My wife's daily driver is a '97 BMW 740iL and it does a great job. Even with 3 rear facing car seats, I have enough room when I'm driving to be comfortable driving. You can find a newer version (that body style was up to 2001, I believe) with low miles for well under your budget, or buy a newer body style also for well under the budget.

When we travel we rent sedans in the range of what you suggest, and I am always uncomfortable driving them.

 

[rachelk.tailwinds]

The G37 runs about .1-.2 sec faster in 0-60/1/4mi vs a stock SHO. The 3.7L engine in the G37/M37/Q50 is about as reliable as they come as it's used in a half-dozen Nissan and Infiniti models. I'm actually more apprehensive about a twin-turbo EcoBoost engine in the SHO!

I've done a full 120K timing belt tear-down on a 3.0L TT Nissan engine before, so not much on the VQ37 engine in question here would scare me!

Do you really think you'd be able to fell the difference behind the wheel? Even if you were to put the two up against each other, driver skill level would factor in enough to let either one win.

Regarding the reliability, I suppose I can't truly speak for the SHO since I've never personally owned one but from what I've read about them, those EcoBoosts are extremely capable. They've been putting that engine in the Expeditions, Navigators, F-150s, Explorer Sports, MKSs, and I think a few others. Plus: paddle shifters.

 

[JoseCuervo]

None of those cars would appeal to me if I had to put car seats in and out, and help load the occupants of the car seats.

The small SUV's really are nice for loading little ones, and all the crap little ones require, plus the visibility when driving.

(As a side note, it may be a regional thing, but I don't know anyone under age 65 that buys Cadillacs of any model, Pontiacs, or any of the Ford sedans. If you are driving those, you have lost your dignity.)

 

[comanche pilot]

I like Dodge Chargers. I have an 06 Daytona with 170K miles on it. It hasn't given me one problem. Good performance and comfortable to drive. I want a Hellcat now!

 

[genna]

Since we have a thread going on small SUV/XUVs, I thought I throw one in for a purchase I'm looking to make in the next 3-6 months.

Backstory: my wife is a month pregnant with our first child, and stipulates that I can't buy a 2dr car (I wanted a G37 coupe). This car will be my DD, we currently have 2 4-dr crew cab trucks. I am not selling my truck because it's very nice, paid off, and is my tow vehicle, so it will be parked. The other truck is my wife's, and it's owned by her father, so it stays in use until the wheels fall off or he takes it back. So, I'm looking for something used with less than 30K miles on it or so, and preferably RWD, but AWD is acceptable, FWD is not.

Current cars under consideration:

2013-2015 Taurus SHO
- not terrible looking, has great tech value and performance for the money, but pricey and heavy at 4,300 lbs.

2013 Infiniti G37 or Q50
- smaller than the Taurus, but pretty much identical performance, less tech features but slightly better quality, also pricey for Q50

2013+ Cadillac ATS
- sporty in appearance and handling, but lacks much oomph for power and has small cabin

2009 Pontiac G8 GXP - ideal choice, not likely
- best of the bunch in terms of performance, available manual transmission, great styling. Downside is spartan interior and prices still hanging around $27-28K with higher mileage.

If you are looking at GXP, a 2009+ Cadi CTS-V is a contender as well...

Infinity is probably the best option. Although I don't think it's that much larger than STI. It's an Audi A4 size. They have very good driving dynamics, nice inside, reliable, and fairly inexpensive. V6 is also very sweet. Probably the best car Nissan has made since original Z(current Z and GTR notwithstanding)

 

[bradg33]

I like Dodge Chargers. I have an 06 Daytona with 170K miles on it. It hasn't given me one problem. Good performance and comfortable to drive. I want a Hellcat now!

I was out on a long run last Sunday morning and I crossed a road at a stop sign just as a Hellcat was pulling up. It was pretty early on near a sleepy residential area. He must have seen me eyeing the car, because once I was across the road he put the pedal down. Man, the noise that thing makes...

 

[Busflyer]

Lol, no doubt. Since this is our first, I'm in no hurry for a 3rd row of seating! If we have a second child soon after, I'm sure it will be on the radar. If we were cursed with 3+ kids I'll give up and get the Yukon XL/Suburban/etc and start wearing socks with my sandals!

You won't be "cursed" with 3 kids, you be "blessed". Can't imagine life without my 3.

 

[Twin_Flyer]

I haved a G37 6MT coupe. It's a great ride no trouble with it so far. The only down side is it isn't worth crap in the snow (not enough weight in the rear)... So when it snows the G gets parked...

 

[genna]

Lexus IS(F? even maybe)

 

[genna]

I haved a G37 6MT coupe. It's a great ride no trouble with it so far. The only down side is it isn't worth crap in the snow (not enough weight in the rear)... So when it snows the G gets parked...

I drove G356MT coupe for 3 years in snow. Tires... get correct tires.. it is a great car in snow with correct tires.

 

[James331]

Get a vette. C5 or maybe if you can find a deal a C6.

They will dust anything else mentioned here, they hold their value rather well and really are a ground up performance car, with enough aftermarket support to tailor them any way you like if needed.



Subarus are phenomenal cars, the turbo WRX or even better the STI are really great machines, but they won't truly shine unless you're driving in snow or off paved roads.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Get a vette. C5 or maybe if you can find a deal a C6.

They will dust anything else mentioned here, they hold their value rather well and really are a ground up performance car, with enough aftermarket support to tailor them any way you like if needed.

Never become Corvette-Guy.....

Corvette Guy

 

[JoeSelch]

Get a vette. C5 or maybe if you can find a deal a C6.

They will dust anything else mentioned here, they hold their value rather well and really are a ground up performance car, with enough aftermarket support to tailor them any way you like if needed.



Subarus are phenomenal cars, the turbo WRX or even better the STI are really great machines, but they won't truly shine unless you're driving in snow or off paved roads.

There's a Corvette sedan?

 

[rachelk.tailwinds]

Get a vette. C5 or maybe if you can find a deal a C6.

They will dust anything else mentioned here, they hold their value rather well and really are a ground up performance car, with enough aftermarket support to tailor them any way you like if needed.

Did you miss the part about the baby on the way? And a C5, really? Gross.

 

[Bill]

The problem with any sedan ends up being having enough room for rear facing car seats and you having enough leg room.

We ended up with a Crown Vic when the kid was small, we found a civilian model with the performance and handling package, so basically a cop car underneath. It had enough room for a rear facing baby seat while giving me good legroom and had a large trunk that swallowed strollers, pack and play and all the other assorted baby stuff. And that thing got squatters out of the left lane like Moses parting the red sea...

It was sufficient for the time.

 

[SoonerAviator]

There's a Corvette sedan?

The called it the Cadillac CTS-V.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Get a vette. C5 or maybe if you can find a deal a C6.

They will dust anything else mentioned here, they hold their value rather well and really are a ground up performance car, with enough aftermarket support to tailor them any way you like if needed.



Subarus are phenomenal cars, the turbo WRX or even better the STI are really great machines, but they won't truly shine unless you're driving in snow or off paved roads.

I love the 'Vettes, but the kid will probably get fussy back in the hatch area.

 

[SoonerAviator]

None of those cars would appeal to me if I had to put car seats in and out, and help load the occupants of the car seats.

The small SUV's really are nice for loading little ones, and all the crap little ones require, plus the visibility when driving.

(As a side note, it may be a regional thing, but I don't know anyone under age 65 that buys Cadillacs of any model, Pontiacs, or any of the Ford sedans. If you are driving those, you have lost your dignity.)

Well, this is a DD for me, so I won't have to be loading/unloading a kid every day. The wife will likely have most of that duty. SUVs outside of a select few, are not sporty enough for me (I'm not paying enough coin for a Jeep GC SRT or Porsche Cayenne).

Side note: I feel like you've never driven a CTS-V, G8 (or GXP), or Taurus SHO. They are very highly-touted, even against the most boorish of Euro-snops with Bimmers, Mercs, or Audis. They really are great cars in their own right, especially for the price. There isn't a Bimmer made that would outrun/out-handle the G8 GXP within $20K of purchase price.

 

[Austingt350]

SHO from that list. If it doesn't have enough power for you, plenty of tuners can help with that. There apparently are a few tune only cars that have gone 12.7-12.8.

That's enough to outrun the majority of the cars you'll come across, and if you get a car with "multi-contoured seats" you can get a massage while doing it.

Infiniti would be my second option.

 

[bradg33]

Well, this is a DD for me, so I won't have to be loading/unloading a kid every day. The wife will likely have most of that duty. SUVs outside of a select few, are not sporty enough for me (I'm not paying enough coin for a Jeep GC SRT or Porsche Cayenne).

Side note: I feel like you've never driven a CTS-V, G8 (or GXP), or Taurus SHO. They are very highly-touted, even against the most boorish of Euro-snops with Bimmers, Mercs, or Audis. They really are great cars in their own right, especially for the price. There isn't a Bimmer made that would outrun/out-handle the G8 GXP within $20K of purchase price.

I love the CTS-V series, especially the wagon. Biggest downside is they really like gas.

 

[James331]

Did you miss the part about the baby on the way? And a C5, really? Gross.

Well if you like a vette or not is a great way to tell car folks from non car folks.

If you really need the extra room a STI would be fun and give you 4 doors.

 

[SoonerAviator]

I like Dodge Chargers. I have an 06 Daytona with 170K miles on it. It hasn't given me one problem. Good performance and comfortable to drive. I want a Hellcat now!

You know, I don't mind the Chargers, they have the SRT version that has 425HP that will run pretty well, it just gets terrible fuel mileage. The interiors on the Chargers/Challengers are fairly plain, too, at least compared to the Ford/Infiniti/Cadillac. Very similar to the Pontiac, actually.

The Challengers, even in V6 form, have been fun to drive as rentals.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Well, this is a DD for me, so I won't have to be loading/unloading a kid every day. The wife will likely have most of that duty. SUVs outside of a select few, are not sporty enough for me (I'm not paying enough coin for a Jeep GC SRT or Porsche Cayenne).

Side note: I feel like you've never driven a CTS-V, G8 (or GXP), or Taurus SHO. They are very highly-touted, even against the most boorish of Euro-snops with Bimmers, Mercs, or Audis. They really are great cars in their own right, especially for the price. There isn't a Bimmer made that would outrun/out-handle the G8 GXP within $20K of purchase price.

You are right, like I said, I don't know anybody who buys Caddys, Pontiacs, and Taurus (other than company-owned salesman cars).

I truly think it may be regional. As the people I know who are car enthusiasts will tend to drive BMW's, MBZ's, Audi's, and Teslas.

Even the thought of a "sporty" Taurus, Pontiac, or Caddy is kinda funny. (Save the original Pontiac GTO's....)

 

[SoonerAviator]

SHO from that list. If it doesn't have enough power for you, plenty of tuners can help with that. There apparently are a few tune only cars that have gone 12.7-12.8.

That's enough to outrun the majority of the cars you'll come across, and if you get a car with "multi-contoured seats" you can get a massage while doing it.

Infiniti would be my second option.

Yeah, that's sort of where I'm at. I don't know if I want the larger/slightly more sluggish-in-handling SHO, or the crisp-handling but fewer bells-n-whistles G37/Q50. It's a tough call! As far as looks, the SHO and G37 are about equal, the Q50 gets the nod over both of the others.

 

[SoonerAviator]

If you can get the WRX in a hatch, you get a fair amount of extra space. But yes, overall, they're not as large as a full-size sedan. On the Audis, the A5/S5 is a coupe. As far as reliability, I've owned an Audi and I've got friends with them. They're no more unreliable than any other high-end, high-performance sports sedan. Like most cars in that area, they do require regular maintenance, and failure to keep up with that can lead to expensive issues. But they're amazing driver's cars.

Others off the top of my head:
Dodge Charger
Merc C/E63 (mileage and $$ might be a problem)
BMW M3 (mileage and $$ might be a problem)
Caddy CTS/CTS-V

I bolded the part I'm not sure I'm willing to accept. That's my apprehension about BMW/Merc/Audi is that they are premium vehicles which like to have premium upkeep. There are M3/M5s, and 6-series that have eaten guys' lunch because of high-strung engines and complex electrical systems. I want to be able to work on it myself, and those who own a lot of those cars usually don't.

The main problem with the CTS-V is that you can't pick up a 2009 or later model for less than $29K used with 60K+ on them. It's a lot to pay for an 8-yr old car with 1/3 of its useful life gone! As with anything though, you have to pay to play.