17,500 hr Cessna 172

brien23

brien23

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Brien
Thinking of buying a 17,500 hr Cessna 172M Factory overhaul engine 1700hr SMOH, two MK-12 radios , good price, what could go wrong.
 
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You would be stuck with it and never be able to sell it. Unless it is almost free.
 
Well, let's see: the 172M had some weakness that should have shown up long before 17K hours, but depending on how carefully the mechanics have been inspecting it, I'd be looking for:
A cracked horizontal stabilizer front spar, around the center lightening hole
A cracked aft fuselage bulkhead, where the tail tiedown ring attaches
Cracked rudder hinge brackets, on the rudder itself, where they're folded to meet the rudder spar flanges
Cracked front doorposts at the lower door hinges (seen only by taking off the side panels and looking through the small hole there)
Cracked rear doorposts where they attach to the gear box, in the tiny radius at the level of the top of the box
Worn landing gear leg retention bolts (braking forces try to shear them)
A cracked bulkhead flange at the rear of the main baggage compartment, just aft of the baggage door, down low near the floor, both sides
A trim actuator that hasn't been out for inspection in a long time
Fuel tank covers that haven't been off for many years and the screws might be rusted in. Bad news, that
Fuel tank rubber pads falling off and the tank chafing on the airframe. Rubber fuel vent crossover connections rotted
Worn cables and pulleys and hinges. Seized pulleys
Early M models cracked their engine mounts at the crosstube. Later models had finger patches there
Cracked firewall at the cowling shockmount brackets just below the shelf in the firewall
Worn seat parts and seat rails
Rotted-out battery box
Narco Mk12D radios are a money pit, and Narco went bust long ago. Some parts scarce

No such thing as a cheap old airplane.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Well, let's see: the 172M had some weakness that should have shown up long before 17K hours, but depending on how carefully the mechanics have been inspecting it, I'd be looking for:
A cracked horizontal stabilizer front spar, around the center lightening hole
A cracked aft fuselage bulkhead, where the tail tiedown ring attaches
Cracked rudder hinge brackets, on the rudder itself, where they're folded to meet the rudder spar flanges
Cracked front doorposts at the lower door hinges (seen only by taking off the side panels and looking through the small hole there)
Cracked rear doorposts where they attach to the gear box, in the tiny radius at the level of the top of the box
Worn landing gear leg retention bolts (braking forces try to shear them)
A cracked bulkhead flange at the rear of the main baggage compartment, just aft of the baggage door, down low near the floor, both sides
A trim actuator that hasn't been out for inspection in a long time
Fuel tank covers that haven't been off for many years and the screws might be rusted in. Bad news, that
Fuel tank rubber pads falling off and the tank chafing on the airframe. Rubber fuel vent crossover connections rotted
Worn cables and pulleys and hinges. Seized pulleys
Early M models cracked their engine mounts at the crosstube. Later models had finger patches there
Cracked firewall at the cowling shockmount brackets just below the shelf in the firewall
Worn seat parts and seat rails
Rotted-out battery box
Narco Mk12D radios are a money pit, and Narco went bust long ago. Some parts scarce

No such thing as a cheap old airplane.
Click to expand...

Long story short: Avoid the high-time 172M - it's on crack.
 
The C152 I got my PPL in had 11k hours on it when I took my ride - 24 years ago. The plane is still on the line, North of 19k hours.

The fastest pre-restart C172 I ever flew had over 11k hours. Cruised easily at 120 kts and the doors clicked shut with finger pressure. Smelled like a wet dog inside.

As pointed out, you'll face a tough road when it comes time to sell. So just like a plane with lost logbooks, you need to get a screaming deal now to have this make any sense.
 
At minimum you should read over the SID (Supplemental Inspection Document), but I don't know where to find a copy.

I would only consider it if I was working with an A&P with experience with high time Cessna 172s. I flew with a club in Georgia that has a high time (I think it's past 14000 hours now) 172. It flys great, but last year it was scheduled to get a paint job only to find a crack in the landing gear a couple months before the scheduled time. I don't know the numbers, but I was lead to believe that the landing gear replacement/repair cost more than was budgeted for a paint job. Expensive repairs can hit any air frame, but they seem more likely with a high time bird.

The last thing to consider is the question you are asking now. Keep in mind that if you choose to sell, every buyer will be asking this question, but instead of 17000 hours it will have 17000+the hours you flew it.
 
As long as "good price" is < 25K, I say party on wayne. If it's a roach it'll fetch it in parts quickly. For some reason everyone mews and whinges about > 10K TTAF on entire planes but nobody seems to care how much TT is on, say, that flap or aileron or wheel assembly that you need and don't wanna pay $Textron prices for.
 
This is spot on:
schmookeeg said:
For some reason everyone mews and whinges about > 10K TTAF on entire planes but nobody seems to care how much TT is on, say, that flap or aileron or wheel assembly that you need...
Click to expand...

Maybe the FAA will start asking to track these but given the regs, if it meets spec it's as good as new...
 
I believe any aircraft is the material condition of the aircraft.
 
If that 17KTT airplane has been properly maintained and all the usual cracks and other defects have been repaired along that way, it should be fine. But a lot lot airplanes don't get that care, as I have found too often. There was nothing in my long list of stuff to look for that isn't addressed in Cessna's inspection checklists, CAPs (replaced by SIDs) SIDs, SBs or ADs. As a flight school director of maintenance I read all that stuff and did the inspections to find them and fix them. When we sold high-time 172s they were in decent shape.
 
I have seen some of the early 170/172 in really restored condition, I'd not rule them out on time only. (material condition) is the only thing that matters.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Well, let's see: the 172M had some weakness that should have shown up long before 17K hours, but depending on how carefully the mechanics have been inspecting it, I'd be looking for:
A cracked horizontal stabilizer front spar, around the center lightening hole
A cracked aft fuselage bulkhead, where the tail tiedown ring attaches
Cracked rudder hinge brackets, on the rudder itself, where they're folded to meet the rudder spar flanges
Cracked front doorposts at the lower door hinges (seen only by taking off the side panels and looking through the small hole there)
Cracked rear doorposts where they attach to the gear box, in the tiny radius at the level of the top of the box
Worn landing gear leg retention bolts (braking forces try to shear them)
A cracked bulkhead flange at the rear of the main baggage compartment, just aft of the baggage door, down low near the floor, both sides
A trim actuator that hasn't been out for inspection in a long time
Fuel tank covers that haven't been off for many years and the screws might be rusted in. Bad news, that
Fuel tank rubber pads falling off and the tank chafing on the airframe. Rubber fuel vent crossover connections rotted
Worn cables and pulleys and hinges. Seized pulleys
Early M models cracked their engine mounts at the crosstube. Later models had finger patches there
Cracked firewall at the cowling shockmount brackets just below the shelf in the firewall
Worn seat parts and seat rails
Rotted-out battery box
Narco Mk12D radios are a money pit, and Narco went bust long ago. Some parts scarce

No such thing as a cheap old airplane.
Click to expand...

Is that all? :p
 
Ugh- the nattering nannies.

My first bird was a 1976M. I still have it in the stable.

I’ve replaced all the glass - easy to find.

The interior plastics were t easy but certainly were available when needed. They get brittle over time.

Just about every shop has parts for it, and the ones that are harder to find still come up often.

I purchased mine from a flight school at...8000 hours or so? No cracks as indicated and its been through 4-5 meticulous IAs, some of who made major alterations to it.

On principle, I slapped an HSI in it before Garmin came out with the G series.

That 172M has flown coast to coast a few times, has done a ton of longer range flights, and only left me stranded when I dumped an alternator over tornado alley.

Mine had two narco radios also along with a GX50, which I turned into a 60, and now sports an SL30 and a GNS480.

Is it my 104 gallon tank M20k Mooney? No. It’s also cheaper to fly by a long shot. In a pinch, take friends up and the conversation is done. I don’t need to take people up in a Mooney for the $100 burger.

Old reliable. I think I picked it up for $30k.

She’s about to get an engine I’ve already paid for that had compressions in the 70’s just because it’s at about 2400/2500 hours and burning more oil than I want.

Nothing wrong with a high time 172 if there’s no structural issues with it.
 
No, Dan - if anything, you were genuinely helpful and informative to the point of me mentally checking through my service records. All the remaining quippy crap without substance is what my comment was aimed at...and in plural
 
For the right price and no major deal breakers (ie: look closely for cracks and corrosion), go for it. If you can afford the labour to fix something major, parts are plentiful.
 
The good thing about 172s is the fleet is so large and has so many hours flown the problems with each older model are well known and understood.
 
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