FlexJet - SWA Runway Incursion MDW 2/25/2025

midwestpa24 said:
One thing pointed out on another board, there are no hold short markings on Runway 4L at either Runway 31L or 31C. Still doesn't absolve the Flexjet crew, but is a contributing factor.

Using 4L as a taxiway honestly seems like poor procedure, lack of these markings for one. The FAA in Airport Design discourages taxiway crosses near the "high speed" portion of the runway, approximately the center third or half. There isn't a parallel to 4L probably for that reason, so ATC just uses the runway.

Like the DC crash, normalization of deviation. If they had only made Flexjet follow the taxiway system perhaps this could have been avoided. Fortunately this time the SWA crew was on their game and went around. Watching it again it doesn't appear their gear ever touched.
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Yeah. But there is a big fat white runway edge line that crosses 4L. He had been instructed to hold short of a runway and then crossed the big fat white line. There are runway marking issues here though. How far back of that line should you hold? I think someone may already be opening some cans of paint getting ready to deal with this.
 
luvflyin said:
Yeah. But there is a big fat white runway edge line that crosses 4L. He had been instructed to hold short of a runway and then crossed the big fat white line. There are runway marking issues here though. How far back of that line should you hold? I think someone may already be opening some cans of paint getting ready to deal with this.
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How far back? Certainly not fully on the other side of it.

Controller was on top of it and saw this coming. Did Southwest start the go around before or after he called for it?
 
FPK1 said:
Chicago Midway International Airport (MDW) remains one of the most dangerous airports in the United States. This is due to its complex runways, busy location, and history of safety incidents...
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History doesn't cause accidents, it might be evidence of accidents, but it isn't the cause.

The runways aren't that complex. There's two parallels going NE-SW and two roughly perpendicular. What is problematic is that it's tightly crammed into the middle of Chicago and space for everything (runways, taxiways, parking, etc...) is all at a premium. Of course, a lot of the problem is the corrupt politics in the city that got rid of the prime GA reliever.
 
This is called expectation bias. the controller was imprecise the first time, and confused 31L with 31C; the pilot got the readback incorrect the first time, was corrected, got the readback right the second time but crossing 31 was what he expected. This about human cognition and data processing.
 
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The live audio I heard had ATC stepped on when yelling at 560 to holdshort. They likely didn't hear that transmission (when just about to cross onto 31C).

I could tell what he said because I read the transcript here. In the live playback of ground only - atc was stepped on.

In that same live feed that then played tower, SWA went around. Controller didn't seem to tell them to go around. CT acknowledged and gave a climb and maybe turn but never told them to go around.
 
MauleSkinner said:
if it was expectation bias as Bruce indicated, Foreflight would have also had to tell them to stop in order to make a difference.
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Yes it would have, but do you think the crew was occupied with other tasks, too.... Add foreflight and you have total lack of any human processing power left for situational awareness.....
 
Given this is Chicago in February (where we see the sun w/clear skies 2-3 days during the month if we're lucky), this was a miracle. If there was poor visibility we'd be reading about a disaster. The Eyeball Mk1 may not be glamorous but it saved the day. Kudos to the SWA pilots.
 
Terry M - 3CK (Chicago) said:
The live audio I heard had ATC stepped on when yelling at 560 to holdshort. They likely didn't hear that transmission (when just about to cross onto 31C).

I could tell what he said because I read the transcript here. In the live playback of ground only - atc was stepped on.

In that same live feed that then played tower, SWA went around. Controller didn't seem to tell them to go around. CT acknowledged and gave a climb and maybe turn but never told them to go around.
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I made that transcript by listening to the LiveATC files. I had put it into Audition so I could listen to it repeatedly. Admittedly, stepped on transmissions are going to sound different at each receiver so we don't know if FlexJet heard the stepped on one or not.

I suspect that tower was "uh, yeah" because even if they weren't looking at the runway, they did when they heard the "on the go" called. It's also quite possible local heard the ground controller screaming at this point.
 
midwestpa24 said:
One thing pointed out on another board, there are no hold short markings on Runway 4L at either Runway 31L or 31C. Still doesn't absolve the Flexjet crew, but is a contributing factor....
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Wait...what?! They still have it that way? Yikes!!
 
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