Do I have to get a bachelor's?

[TCABM]

There seems to be two different groups, either go to college and get a bachelors or don't go, and go to flight school and build hours as quickly and cheaply as possible. I'd definitely like to go to college, and probably somewhere along the way get a bachelor's online(currently I am looking towards probably business management). Is an associate's degree considered that much worse than a bachelor's? If I were to apply to an airline would they reject me for only having an associates? Academics wise I'm honors/Ap in everything available to me, and plan to continue that. Another question I have that I'd like to clear up, taking written tests/ground school, am I able to go an just take written tests? I was under the impression that I had to go to a ground school, take their classes then have the test administered by them; would I just be able to self study/study using online material for free? I live in eastern illinois if anyone has any suggestions or recommendations that would be pertinent to my location. I am very thankful for all answers

Lots to unpack there. Broadly, any employer has their own set of ‘discriminators’ when two equally qualified people apply for one available job. Rock>Scissors>Paper. Bachelors>Associates>no degree.

Next, you need to be 23 for an ATP, so doing Part 61 to commercial/CFI gets hours quickly and building experience; you can figure out the college piece separately.

You can do a home study course like Sportys and get the endorsement to take the written exams without ever seeing a CFI. Lots of people have done that and it won’t be any different from someone going a different path.

 

[ArrowFlyer86]

Over the last few decades college has made itself into a joke for 80% of it

College is entirely what you make of it.

If you treat it as a 4 year getaway from responsibility and your degree choice and course load reflect as much, then it's pretty much a joke. Likewise, if you refuse to break out of your social comfort zone and spend all your time in the dorm streaming tv, watching TikTok or playing video games, it's also a horrendous waste.

But if you treat it as a period of your life to focus and aggressively learn about nearly any topic you want and combine that with even a modicum of common sense in choosing a major -- then it's a fantastic experience that significantly expands your perspective and opportunities. And I think that's especially the case if you invest in building your social/soft skills along the way.

That said, college can't perform miracles. Parents don't like to hear it but some kids really are just total crap as raw material (no work ethic, no focus, bad moral ethics, generally dumb, etc). It doesn't matter if you send them to the worst community college in the country for 1 semester before they drop out, or you send them to Princeton for 4 years, they're still gonna be hot garbage when they get out.

There's limitations to what college can do for you that are entirely dependent on how much you do for yourself while you're there .

 

[AKiss20]

Not just writing. Being able to stand up and make a coherent, interesting presentation is also important. Customer meetings, design reviews, flight readiness reviews, failure review boards, etc., all demand excellent verbal communication skills.

Yes I sorta lumped all those together. Writing was the wrong word to use, but good technical writing will craft a good technical presentation, associated verbal communication, and generally clear and precise technical thinking.

 

[Roller]

You should probably get out more.

Nauga,
who gets out more

You too brother

 

[Roller]

College is entirely what you make of it.

If you treat it as a 4 year getaway from responsibility and your degree choice and course load reflect as much, then it's pretty much a joke. Likewise, if you refuse to break out of your social comfort zone and spend all your time in the dorm streaming tv, watching TikTok or playing video games, it's also a horrendous waste.

But if you treat it as a period of your life to focus and aggressively learn about nearly any topic you want and combine that with even a modicum of common sense in choosing a major -- then it's a fantastic experience that significantly expands your perspective and opportunities. And I think that's especially the case if you invest in building your social/soft skills along the way.

That said, college can't perform miracles. Parents don't like to hear it but some kids really are just total crap as raw material (no work ethic, no focus, bad moral ethics, generally dumb, etc). It doesn't matter if you send them to the worst community college in the country for 1 semester before they drop out, or you send them to Princeton for 4 years, they're still gonna be hot garbage when they get out.

There's limitations to what college can do for you that are entirely dependent on how much you do for yourself while you're there .

So sounds like college is pointless if it’s just want you make of it

Sounds like one of the misses yoga classes

College and the Mil ain’t there to raise your kids, that’s the duty of yall if ya get a girl knocked up

 

[ArrowFlyer86]

So sounds like college is pointless if it’s just want you make of it

Sounds like one of the misses yoga classes

College and the Mil ain’t there to raise your kids, that’s the duty of yall if ya get a girl knocked up

By that logic I guess exercise is pointless, too. Because that's only gonna be what you make of it.
Or I guess pilot lessons are pointless too? Because they're also just what you make of it.
Show up in the left seat hungover, unmotivated and looking to do the bare minimum to not fall out of the sky, and ya just ain't gonna have the same outcome as the kid who is prepared and serious.

It's almost like a lot of your personal outcomes in life are correlated to how much effort you invest in them

 

[AKiss20]

The irony of a pilot calling college useless. Who do you think designs those planes? We moved past the “two guys in a shed” phase of technical development about 100 years ago.

 

[Albany Tom]

My recommendation is to get the bs degree, one way or another. Not because it necessarily means anything, but because it's about like a high school degree was 30 years ago - not having one doesn't mean you know any less, but you kind of have to explain why you don't have it. And some places it's a simple way to weed out the candidate pool.

I don't work in the airplane industry, so I can't speak to that, but I can to hiring in IT, info sec, and IT PM. There are a lot of people with a lot of experience working in IT today that don't have a degree. But all of the new people coming in have that. So a bs in something technical, or military experience with something technical is kinda of table stakes. The degree will get you past the HR people in a lot of places no matter what it is. But an engineering or computer science degree of some sort is going to stand out more for an IT position. And this may bend some out of sorts, but I would probably put a higher value on an engineering degree than a CS degree, unless that CS degree had specific coursework related to the project at hand. My reasoning is that with an engineering degree, it's someone that had the common sense to get through college, and that learned some math, has some thinking skills, some PM skills, and that can think on their own...at least most of the time. I don't have the same faith in computer science programs, they can be too focused on the "tech of the day".

Or to put it another way, if I have an applicant that has an associates in history, but several years of programming, I probably am looking at someone that can do IT. An applicant with no IT experience but an EE degree, I'm looking at someone that can almost certainly learn how to code and come up to speed fairly quickly. A history degree and no experience? It's like the box of chocolates thing, no idea what I have.

All that about the backup plan, and sorry for the ramble...it's late and I'm too lazy to go back and hack 75% of it out.

 

[AlphaPilotFlyer]

There seems to be two different groups, either go to college and get a bachelors or don't go, and go to flight school and build hours as quickly and cheaply as possible. I'd definitely like to go to college, and probably somewhere along the way get a bachelor's online(currently I am looking towards probably business management). Is an associate's degree considered that much worse than a bachelor's? If I were to apply to an airline would they reject me for only having an associates? Academics wise I'm honors/Ap in everything available to me, and plan to continue that. Another question I have that I'd like to clear up, taking written tests/ground school, am I able to go an just take written tests? I was under the impression that I had to go to a ground school, take their classes then have the test administered by them; would I just be able to self study/study using online material for free? I live in eastern illinois if anyone has any suggestions or recommendations that would be pertinent to my location. I am very thankful for all answers

just to be clear on my earlier pontificating advice, and seems your initial post has drifted off centerline a bit...... I don't mean to not get a 4 year degree....I suggested find a 2 year program that will give you about 26 units for faa certs so you're half way done...other units mostly gen Ed so can meet 4 yr degree requirements as well...... you can do a BS online and get it in basket weaving or interpative dance major if all u want is to say you got a bachelor degree.... do on your layover when flying for the regionals..... id suggest find a major you like in case u need a backup career..... BUT, get your licenses and hours is first priority, you'll have a bachelor's degree done by time u interview with majors. I did it this way and was at a major at age 25 when average new hire was age 34.

good luck. and may the force be with you.

 

[Roller]

The irony of a pilot calling college useless. Who do you think designs those planes? We moved past the “two guys in a shed” phase of technical development about 100 years ago.

Not someone with tons of debt that can not be discharged, and degree one of the many many useless degrees.


No matter “what you make of it” a BS in art history/dance/english/aviation management etc is a worse financial decision than a buying new Escalade

 

[Checkout_my_Six]

Not someone with tons of debt that can not be discharged, and degree one of the many many useless degrees.


No matter “what you make of it” a BS in art history/dance/english/aviation management etc is a worse financial decision than a buying new Escalade

In addition.....going full bore on Riddle...and leaving with $200K in loans.

 

[brien23]

It's not if but when, Boeing CEO Dave Calhoun revealed an open secret in the world of aviation. “The future of autonomy is real" The point is get in now if you can, seniority in aviation is everything who knows what 20 years will be if airliners still require pilots or a computer it / flight attendant.

 

[Checkout_my_Six]

It's not if but when, Boeing CEO Dave Calhoun revealed an open secret in the world of aviation. “The future of autonomy is real" The point is get in now if you can, seniority in aviation is everything who knows what 20 years will be if airliners still require pilots or a computer it / flight attendant.

It might be longer than that. The current pipeline of Boeing airliners are good for a while....till they re-design and certify a new platform.....that's not a risk. But, Airbus is working automation and could get there faster.

 

[brien23]

It might be longer than that. The current pipeline of Boeing airliners are good for a while....till they re-design and certify a new platform.....that's not a risk. But, Airbus is working automation and could get there faster.

The Pilot job now is to not run into another airplane or helicopter and manage the computer system on a airliner and taxi the plane to and from the gate without running into a tail of another plane.

 

[Roller]

It's not if but when, Boeing CEO Dave Calhoun revealed an open secret in the world of aviation. “The future of autonomy is real" The point is get in now if you can, seniority in aviation is everything who knows what 20 years will be if airliners still require pilots or a computer it / flight attendant.

I wouldn’t look to Boeing for advise these days

 

[Clip4]

At the end of the Industrial Revolution, the transistor replaced millions of jobs. The micro processor is replacing millions of jobs today and pilots will be one of those jobs lost. Get a science degree so you are prepared for your second career.

 

[Roller]

At the end of the Industrial Revolution, the transistor replaced millions of jobs. The micro processor is replacing millions of jobs today and pilots will be one of those jobs lost. Get a science degree so you are prepared for your second career.

Well, bless your heart if you’ve never had a computer freeze up or throw an error! Must be nice!

Now, back in my day, I flew singlepilot for quite some time. We’d often have some young buck with 500-1,000 hours sitting in the right seat. Now, don’t get me wrong, it was all for safety, or at least that’s what we told folks. You see, it was more for show, passengers felt a lot better knowing Junior was up there with me. Even though he didn’t need to be, and more times than not, he was making me juggle being both the pilot and the instructor at the same time.

Now, if you take the average airline pilot, and you think about how we train, the idea of flying singlepilot a hard pill to swallow. But zero-pilot? Well, that’s downright laughable. I wouldn’t trust a penny in any aviation company sellin’ that dream.