Cherokee down in West Palm Beach

2

2bahamas

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Jul 11, 2024
Messages
2
Display Name
Display name:
2bahamas
any info on the Cherokee that ended up in the lake off North Palm Beach Airport? Its one of my local airports, but the news is not saying much other than it veered off the runway during takeoff. RIP to the two souls onboard.
 
Sad condolences and RIP
 
Last edited:
I hope they find out why there was a loss of power. I fly a Warrior out of Boca and losing the engine on takeoff there leaves very few options.
 
tobnpr said:
Edit

Found it


Runway excursion Accident Piper PA-28-161 Warrior II N81250, Wednesday 10 July 2024

On July 10, 2024, about 1410 eastern daylight time, a Piper PA-28-161, N81250, was substantially damaged when it was involved in an accident near West Palm Beach, Florida. The flight inst...
asn.flightsafety.org

Stall/spin on go-around attempt after loss of power.

R.I.P.
Click to expand...
I hope what they wrote actually means to say “stall/spin after loss of power during go-around.” What you quoted would be a different issue.
 
If you look at the airborne footage of the pond, you'll see the position/strobe light on the wing that's still attached to the fuselage is still flashing while most of that electrical system is underwater. I know that's not salt water, but still impressive.

www.wptv.com

2 people killed after plane goes off runway, crashes into water at North Palm Beach County Airport

Two people were taken to the hospital Wednesday after a single-engine aircraft went off a runway and crashed into a body of water at North Palm Beach County General Aviation Airport.
www.wptv.com www.wptv.com

I also wonder if there was a loss of power, or if it was perceived that way by the witnesses due to the fading in and out that would happen because of the spin. I find to hard to believe someone would attempt a return to the runway at that point. Easier to just turn right and put it on 32, or some other piece of flat land nearby.
 
I've flown this plane many times, and also flew with one of the victims. This is the first 'close to home' accident since I've been flying (about 4 years now).

Based on where the right wing was found in relation to the rest of the airframe, I'm fearful that this was a structural failure of the wing spar. I remember when I started flying, it was right after the wing spar AD came out and various owners and clubs were doing a lot of mental gymnastics to get around having to do the eddy current inspection because "they weren't a flight school" but it sure seemed like a lot of technicalities being drummed up with a "head in the sand" mentality.

Curious to see what the NTSB report says. :-(
 
BocaFlyer said:
Based on where the right wing was found in relation to the rest of the airframe, I'm fearful that this was a structural failure of the wing spar.
Click to expand...
The water was deep and that wing was floating, most likely due to the buoyancy of the fuel tank. More likely scenario is that it floated away from the rest of the wreckage.
Eyewitnesses described the accident as a stall/spin on departure scenario, with no mention of a wing departing in-flight.
 
AV8R_87 said:
The water was deep and that wing was floating, most likely due to the buoyancy of the fuel tank. More likely scenario is that it floated away from the rest of the wreckage.
Eyewitnesses described the accident as a stall/spin on departure scenario, with no mention of a wing departing in-flight.
Click to expand...

I dunno. In the footage I saw, the wing was on the edge of the pond in a vertical orientation nearly a couple hundred feet away from the airframe. The way the water was moving around it seemed to indicate it was stuck in the muck. Also, the first responders said they had to wade about 20-30 feet through muck before they were in water deep enough to swim in.

See the image below -- top circle is the wing, bottom circle is the rest of the airframe. Obviously, I could be wrong, but I've got a bad feeling about this.

mpv-shot0008.jpg

mpv-shot0009.jpg
 
Flying Keys said:
The majority of accidents in which people want to jump right to the spar issue end up being run of the mill stall-spins, spatial disorientation, or overstressing in extreme maneuvering.
Click to expand...

The thing is the ADSB doesn’t show the go around, looks like it lost contact at ~500ft, so I can’t see how you can stress an aircraft at such a low altitude, not enough to get up to speed.
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
The thing is the ADSB doesn’t show the go around, looks like it lost contact at ~500ft, so I can’t see how you can stress an aircraft at such a low altitude, not enough to get up to speed.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I originally replied based on a misunderstanding of your post. I tend to agree - there’s not much stress going on. It looks like an instrument approach to 9R, circle to land 27L, then in the water north of the departure end of 27L. I’d surmise a lot of things (for which we have no evidence other than the eyewitness report) before midair separation.
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
The thing is the ADSB doesn’t show the go around, looks like it lost contact at ~500ft, so I can’t see how you can stress an aircraft at such a low altitude, not enough to get up to speed.
Click to expand...
If wing attachment was failing, it will, at some point, let go in level flight, will it not?
 
Kenny Phillips said:
If wing attachment was failing, it will, at some point, let go in level flight, will it not?
Click to expand...

I’ve never heard of wing structure/attachment failing in level flight, have you? Not saying it can’t happen but it would be a rare failure.
 
Was it a rejected landing go-around, or a bounced landing followed by go-around?
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
I’ve never heard of wing structure/attachment failing in level flight, have you? Not saying it can’t happen but it would be a rare failure.
Click to expand...
I lost my best friend and plane partner to a wing attachment failing and separating in level flight on a calm clear day due to the defective design/construction of an aircraft by SeaMax. It is rare and shouldn't happen, but it can. You can look it up under N46PD, SeaMax M7 on Oct 6, 2022. Unfortunately SeaMax knew it was a defective design because the same thing had killed their head engineer in Italy a year prior but since the FAA and Italian ENAC don't share reports and SeaMax covered it up, we didn't know until too late.
 
Preliminary report:

Key points:

The airplane then flew south to North Palm Beach County General Aviation Airport (F45), West Palm Beach, Florida, where it performed a touch and go landing. During the subsequent takeoff, the airplane reached an altitude of 75 ft above ground level (agl), made a right turn and was 25 ft agl above a pond at the last recorded data point.

A witness at the airport stated that he observed an airplane perform a touch and go landing on runway 27L. The airplane took off, performed a 180° descending right turn and disappeared behind trees. He then heard the airplane splash into water.

The airplane was located in a pond about 600 ft to the right of the departure end of runway 27L. The airplane was submerged in about 15 ft of water. The right wing was impact separated and located on the north side of the pond. Flight control cable continuity was confirmed throughout the main wreckage. The stabilator trim actuator was found with 0.6 inches of extension on the top side of the drum, which corresponded to a partial nose down trim position.

The propeller remained attached to the engine crankshaft flange. The propeller spinner was impact damaged. No damage was noted to one of the two propeller blades. The other propeller blade was bent aft about 5°degrees, about 6 inches from the blade tip.
The carburetor remained attached to the engine. The carburetor air box and carburetor heat valve were partially crushed. The throttle cable remained attached to the carburetor throttle control arm. The arm was observed against the full throttle stop.

Both electronic magnetos remained attached to the engine. Power was applied to both electronic magnetos. One tower of the left magneto produced spark when the magneto drive was rotated by hand. The right magneto produced no spark when rotated by hand.

According to a mechanic, on or about July 2, 2024, he removed the airplane’s previously installed Lycoming O-320-D3G engine and installed a Lycoming O-320-D2B. He further converted the engine to a O-320-D2A by replacing the Bendix magnetos with Slick magnetos. The owner of the airplane then supplied the mechanic with two Surefly, electronic ignition modules, which were installed under a supplemental type certificate (STC) which also required the installation of a backup battery system.

So...
Looks like it wasn't an ERAU-style wing departure.
There was a decent amount of nose-down trim that I wouldn't expect for a landing and subsequent take-off.
Prop damage seems to indicate no power at water impact, but throttle seems to have been fully open (that could be caused by impact, though).
A lot of engine work had been performed in the preceeding week.
Even if we assume there was an engine failure, the outcome shouldn't have been fatal. Plenty of space at/around F45 for a safe landing.
 
New engine and addition of surefly.

This appears to have nothing to do with a structural failure.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top