Selling a homebuilt that was never registered

KarenBR

Filing Flight Plan
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KarenBR
My siblings and I are trying to sell Dad's homebuilt since he passed away. He never flew it due to some health issues and FAA regulations changing, maybe before the 1990s. Everything was left in a trust so we can prove the chain of ownership for the plane. That's not the problem. Our issue is that the plane was never registered after building it, and it was never flown. Can we legally sell this plane since it was never registered? Any potential owner will have the full background story, of course. It was completed and assembled for photos, and then the various pieces stored indoors. Thanks for any insight on this.
 
Ya, it’s basically just parts. No aircraft bill of sale or anything.

No N number, faa not involved at all.
 
Is there a data plate on it? Might be more beneficial to the trust to go ahead and register it.
 
No problem, you're selling it as an uncompleted project. Make sure the buyer gets all build logs, photos, and other documentation. When the buyer reassembles the plane they will effectively be "completing" the build and be listed as the manufacturer.

What kind of plane is it?
 
It only has value if you have the build logs and pictures showing your dad actually building the airplane. To register it and get an airworthiness certificate the new owner will need to prove to the FAA/DAR that at least half of the airplane was built by an amateur and that your dad didn’t just pay someone to build the majority of it for him. If all you have are pictures of it assembled and no build logs or pictures of your dad working on it at various stages of completion the new owner won’t be able to register it as experimental-amateur built and the value of the airplane will be close to zero. You can legally sell it but may not be able to find a buyer.
 
No problem, you're selling it as an uncompleted project. Make sure the buyer gets all build logs, photos, and other documentation. When the buyer reassembles the plane they will effectively be "completing" the build and be listed as the manufacturer.

What kind of plane is it?
It's a TEAM Mini-Max/Hi-Max 1700R. I keep the 107 page Construction Log Report in a safe place, and it does indeed show Dad gluing, sewing, cutting, gluing, measuring, gluing (lots of gluing) all the various pieces and parts.
 
It only has value if you have the build logs and pictures showing your dad actually building the airplane. To register it and get an airworthiness certificate the new owner will need to prove to the FAA/DAR that at least half of the airplane was built by an amateur and that your dad didn’t just pay someone to build the majority of it for him. If all you have are pictures of it assembled and no build logs or pictures of your dad working on it at various stages of completion the new owner won’t be able to register it as experimental-amateur built and the value of the airplane will be close to zero. You can legally sell it but may not be able to find a buyer.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my question. Yes, I do have the 100-plus pages Construction Log Report complete with all the pictures of Dad doing the wings, empennage, fuselage, etc. A handful of people have expressed an interest, but no serious buyer yet.
 
Is there a data plate on it? Might be more beneficial to the trust to go ahead and register it.
Hi, no data plate. Will probably talk to the attorney and see if he wants to check into your suggestion. Thank you very much.
 
Cool!

Just for reference, here's the link to the kit associated with this plane:

Great minds think alike. I was just on this site about an hour ago adding up all the fees for the various kits. Thanks!
 
It only has value if you have the build logs and pictures showing your dad actually building the airplane. To register it and get an airworthiness certificate the new owner will need to prove to the FAA/DAR that at least half of the airplane was built by an amateur and that your dad didn’t just pay someone to build the majority of it for him. If all you have are pictures of it assembled and no build logs or pictures of your dad working on it at various stages of completion the new owner won’t be able to register it as experimental-amateur built and the value of the airplane will be close to zero. You can legally sell it but may not be able to find a buyer.
When my plane was inspected, the DAR had no interest in build logs. All he was interested in was whether the aircraft was airworthy. He told me build logs and pictures were important when you apply for the Repairman's certificate.

YMMV
 
It's a TEAM Mini-Max/Hi-Max 1700R. I keep the 107 page Construction Log Report in a safe place, and it does indeed show Dad gluing, sewing, cutting, gluing, measuring, gluing (lots of gluing) all the various pieces and parts.
That airplane *can* be an ultralight. What engine does it come with? If it is a Rotax engine or maybe a 1/2 VW, the airplane is probably sellable as an ultralight and none of the build log stuff matters, nor does FAA registration, nor does a data plate, since by the FAA's definition, it isn't an airplane.

If it does have a Rotax engine, I'd put it on Barnstormers.com as a near-finished Ultralight project and sell it that way.
 
That airplane *can* be an ultralight.
Not according to the website... it weighs 328# empty. There are ultralight versions of the minimax, but not the 1700R.
 
Sell it as-is and let the buyer deal with the FAA. Most of the advice you’ll get is from guys who haven’t done the E-AB process. It’ll be simple for the buyer to move forward with it as he/she sees fit.

Best wishes.
 
Not according to the website... it weighs 328# empty. There are ultralight versions of the minimax, but not the 1700R.
If you look 1/3 of the way down the page that advertises the Hi-max, there are a couple of videos listed as "Hi-max Ultralight".
 
If you look 1/3 of the way down the page that advertises the Hi-max, there are a couple of videos listed as "Hi-max Ultralight".
Yes, but the 1700R, which the OP said it is, isn't the ultralight version.
 
Yes, but the 1700R, which the OP said it is, isn't the ultralight version.
Dana, is that explicitly stated anywhere? I can't find it. Not that I'm a Team expert by any stretch, but I can't find a set of spec's on their website which defines what the "R" version is and what differentiates it from whatever other versions they have (which are alluded to, but not really listed in an objective sense...at least that I can find.)
 
Dana, is that explicitly stated anywhere? I can't find it. Not that I'm a Team expert by any stretch, but I can't find a set of spec's on their website which defines what the "R" version is and what differentiates it from whatever other versions they have (which are alluded to, but not really listed in an objective sense...at least that I can find.)
Not explicitly for the HiMax, but for the MiniMax it looks like the MiniMax 1030 is UL (250#), the 1100 can be (230-2678#), but the 1500 and 1600 aren't (269 & 300#). They don't list specs for the HiMax other than the 1700 version, the website says, "You can build the Hi-Max to be FAR Part 103 compatible", but the quoted specs for the 1700 say 328#. So I infer that this particular aircraft, being a 1700, is not a UL.
 
@KarenBR - First off, sorry for the loss of your father.

Bear in mind that none of the above debate will matter to you. You have the documentation needed for the buyer to move forward with any work that needs to be done. You've received some good advice to list it for sale as an uncompleted/unregistered project. Be sure to state in the ads that you have all of the build documentation.

Figuring out how to get it completed and registered is for the buyer to figure out, and if they're buying they likely already know the deal. Not surprisingly, what you're doing has been done many, many times before.
 
That airplane *can* be an ultralight. What engine does it come with? If it is a Rotax engine or maybe a 1/2 VW, the airplane is probably sellable as an ultralight and none of the build log stuff matters, nor does FAA registration, nor does a data plate, since by the FAA's definition, it isn't an airplane.

If it does have a Rotax engine, I'd put it on Barnstormers.com as a near-finished Ultralight project and sell it that way.
Yup, a Rotax 447. I had it on Barnstormers for a month, but maybe I'll try it the way you suggested. Thanks
 
@KarenBR - First off, sorry for the loss of your father.

Bear in mind that none of the above debate will matter to you. You have the documentation needed for the buyer to move forward with any work that needs to be done. You've received some good advice to list it for sale as an uncompleted/unregistered project. Be sure to state in the ads that you have all of the build documentation.

Figuring out how to get it completed and registered is for the buyer to figure out, and if they're buying they likely already know the deal. Not surprisingly, what you're doing has been done many, many times before.
Thank you, and I appreciate all the advice given here.
 
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