Would you give up ILS for LPV approaches?

David Megginson said:
No, that won't happen, but I've flown through two real wide-area GPS outages so far in 18 years, both due to military jamming exercises. I wouldn't want to be stuck in IMC with no backup when the military jammed GPS for real because of a major terror attack.
Click to expand...
See Post #38, for example.
 
David Megginson said:
No, that won't happen, but I've flown through two real wide-area GPS outages so far in 18 years, both due to military jamming exercises. I wouldn't want to be stuck in IMC with no backup when the military jammed GPS for real because of a major terror attack.
Click to expand...
For the record, I have dual ILS capability in my plane. I was answering if I had to have 1 which it would it be.

I’ve been flying/controlling for 21 years and I’ve never experienced the loss you and @Palmpilot speak of. For those of you that have, did they do this test while it was IFR at the airports within radius? I’ve only heard stories of the desert SW during VFR.

I guess in the fake senecio where I gave up ILS for GPS and it was low IMC during the jamming I’d just put my flight path vector on the runway and let her rip. (After asking for a PAR and the controller asking what that is.) :)
 
Been to VNY quite a few times myself for work, unfortunately often arriving in the early AM, and have had my fair share of approaches to mins or near.

Personally, I don't see much of a point in prioritizing RNAV (LPV) vs. ILS approaches, they are both important tools which aren't going away anytime soon and either/or may be needed based on the user, the application, and the location.
 
Radar Contact said:
I’ve been flying/controlling for 21 years and I’ve never experienced the loss you and @Palmpilot speak of. For those of you that have, did they do this test while it was IFR at the airports within radius? I’ve only heard stories of the desert SW during VFR.

I guess in the fake senecio where I gave up ILS for GPS and it was low IMC during the jamming I’d just put my flight path vector on the runway and let her rip. (After asking for a PAR and the controller asking what that is.) :)
Click to expand...

Has happened to me two or three times in the last 20 years, mostly in the SW if memory serves. Large swath of real estate in which non-RNAV approaches were not available, not to mention enroute GPS navigation.
 
Radar Contact said:
For the record, I have dual ILS capability in my plane. I was answering if I had to have 1 which it would it be.

I’ve been flying/controlling for 21 years and I’ve never experienced the loss you and @Palmpilot speak of. For those of you that have, did they do this test while it was IFR at the airports within radius? I’ve only heard stories of the desert SW during VFR.

I guess in the fake senecio where I gave up ILS for GPS and it was low IMC during the jamming I’d just put my flight path vector on the runway and let her rip. (After asking for a PAR and the controller asking what that is.) :)
Click to expand...
I haven't experienced GPS loss due to interference testing as far as I know, but I'm not as close to the test locations as the folks in Southern California. However, they (and we) are probably protected by the intervening mountains, especially when flying below ridge-top elevations.
 
As a last-ditch backup in Canada, Nav Canada publishes the frequency, power, and lat/lon of all commercial AM radio transmitters in the Canada Flight Supplement (our AFM). I've never had to use that — and I know that frequencies getting up and above 1,000 KHz won't give as stable a reading on my ADF as lower frequencies used for NDBs — but it's still good to know the option's there. With the decommissioning of so many VORs and NDBs, there's no guarantee I'd be able to pick any of them up below 10,000 ft in an unscheduled GPS outage, and the AM transmitter would at least let me get close enough to a big city to pick up their ground-based approach navaids.
 
I got bored and read this part of the AIM yesterday, and it speaks of the Minimum Operational Network that will still be in place as a backup in case that Satellite-Based navigation is unavailable. The plan is that you'll always have a ground-based approach capability within 100Nm no matter where you are in the system.
Click to expand...

IIRC (and correct me if I am wrong) the "approach within a 100mn" refers to an ILS approach that doesn't require any additional equipment (e.g., DME). There would be plenty of other, closer approaches, but they would have additional equipment requirements.
 
Palmpilot said:
I haven't experienced GPS loss due to interference testing as far as I know, but I'm not as close to the test locations as the folks in Southern California. However, they (and we) are probably protected by the intervening mountains, especially when flying below ridge-top elevations.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've never had an outage during one of the NOTAMs. I have had LPV once downgrade to LNAV, but that seemed like a WAAS failure.

David Megginson said:
As a last-ditch backup in Canada, Nav Canada publishes the frequency, power, and lat/lon of all commercial AM radio transmitters in the Canada Flight Supplement (our AFM). I've never had to use that — and I know that frequencies getting up and above 1,000 KHz won't give as stable a reading on my ADF as lower frequencies used for NDBs — but it's still good to know the option's there. With the decommissioning of so many VORs and NDBs, there's no guarantee I'd be able to pick any of them up below 10,000 ft in an unscheduled GPS outage, and the AM transmitter would at least let me get close enough to a big city to pick up their ground-based approach navaids.
Click to expand...

That's convenient, but what percentage of the US fleet still even has ADFs? I know more people still keep their ADFs in Canada than in the US, but I'm betting it still isn't much.

Papa Pilot said:
IIRC (and correct me if I am wrong) the "approach within a 100mn" refers to an ILS approach that doesn't require any additional equipment (e.g., DME). There would be plenty of other, closer approaches, but they would have additional equipment requirements.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if it means only an ILS, or any ground based approach without the need for DME. I think a LOC will be the minimum.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top