With Harrison Ford in the news...

What did Ford do to earn the Bob Hoover award?

  • Crash on a golf course?

    Votes: 5 10.9%

  • Land on a taxi way?

    Votes: 6 13.0%

  • Runway incursion?

    Votes: 6 13.0%

  • Fly the Kessel run in less than twelve parsecs?

    Votes: 29 63.0%
  • Total voters
    46
NordicDave said:
Trying to remember What Ford did to earn the Bob Hoover award?
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Hmm, well, it does seem like a stretch, so I looked it up, and the AOPA says this:

the trophy is presented to an “aviator who exhibits the airmanship, leadership, and passion for aviation and life demonstrated by Bob Hoover.​

Maybe only one, if you're a good at acting at the other two?
 
I'm waiting for the "Harrison Ford Flight School" to open.

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He's a celebrity, who makes his money being a public person. Hence the coverage of him flying the hiker to safety. If he gets that kind of press, then its to be expected that that he gets this press when he does a runway incursion. Or lands on a taxi way overflying a full airliner, or ...........

And it was a slow news day.
 
I'm pretty sure TMZ has a constant tracker on 9HU and checks the ATC tapes anytime it flies. The HHR thing was something that could be confusing, especially if it was loud out. I'm not sure why they told him to make a left turn anyway.
 
k9medic said:
Seriously though, Mr. Ford has been involved in several incidents that would have had the normal pilot grounded.
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? Beyond the 2017 incident what others have there been? Certainly surviving an off-airport landing after an engine failure is more laudable than a pilot error.

Is there something the FAA has ignored? Seems like they're equally aware and they actually have to investigate and make a determination. We'll see what they say about this one but I've read a whole lot of pilots opinions about what happened and even they can't agree so I would say there is nothing cut and dried about this one.
 
4 incidences.
1) a very old helicopter accident as a student.
2) engine trouble in Santa Monica
3) landing taxiway
4) now.

Mr. Ford is guilty of being old in many people's eyes.
 
bflynn said:
4 incidences.
1) a very old helicopter accident as a student.
2) engine trouble in Santa Monica
3) landing taxiway
4) now.

Mr. Ford is guilty of being old in many people's eyes.
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Don't forget he's guilty of being in a spotlight as well.

Of those, the only ones' that appear to me to be his fault are the helo (maybe, as the article I saw couldn't even say he was flying it at the time) and the taxiway incident and perhaps the current one. That doesn't strike me as a lot given the 20+ years and how many hours he's flown but then I'm sure I'll get castrated by the Internet someday too. :eek:
 
Would need need to compare that list to GA pilots at large. What percent of pilots sho have flown for 30 (?) years have had to call the 800 number 4 times ? I honestly don’t know - but seems that would be the context to say if this was “normal”. I’ll take the dead engine golf course landing off the table because the engine dying wasn't from what he did or don’t do


Edit: Pugs typed faster than I. My reply is basically “what he said “
 
Did Ford get a phone number to call at HHR last week? If not, and he wasn't famous, that'd be the end of it. If he did, wouldn't really matter if he's famous. I agree with N1120A re TMZ.
 
I think runway incursions are indeed on the list to get you a phone call. Same as landing on taxi way. But - landing on golf course I don’t believe is. Unless you declared an emergency in which case you do.
 
WDD said:
Would need need to compare that list to GA pilots at large. What percent of pilots sho have flown for 30 (?) years have had to call the 800 number 4 times ? I honestly don’t know - but seems that would be the context to say if this was “normal”. I’ll take the dead engine golf course landing off the table because the engine dying wasn't from what he did or don’t do


Edit: Pugs typed faster than I. My reply is basically “what he said “
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I would take the helicopter training accident off the table too, since there was an instructor on board.

I don't remember where, but I read somewhere he was working on getting back up to speed and knocking off rust this week when he had the runway incursion.
 
The tape is on LiveATC. He's told "continue holding short" but evidently what is heard (or perhaps expected) is an instruction to cross and he proceeds. Given a number on the spot, yes.

Thing about the length of his career is that two of those "call this number" incidents have occurred within about three years, not thirty. They aren't stick and rudder deficiencies or symptomatic of attitude problems (he's commendably apologetic in tapes of both). Might be a hearing issue on the latest, but they both look like brain farts which - dare I say - do seem to affect some people more often as they age.

Given all that and that he's 77 years old I don't think it's wildly inappropriate or unkind to discuss whether it might be time for him to hang it up, or modify his habits in some way (quieter airspace / airports, instructor or copilot, whatever). Doesn't have to take away from his many flying accomplishments. Nothing but admiration for the ADM demonstrated by pilots who decide that day has come.
 
tiger said:
The tape is on LiveATC. He's told "continue holding short" but evidently what is heard (or perhaps expected) is an instruction to cross and he proceeds. Given a number on the spot, yes.

Thing about the length of his career is that two of those "call this number" incidents have occurred within about three years, not thirty. They aren't stick and rudder deficiencies or symptomatic of attitude problems (he's commendably apologetic in tapes of both). Might be a hearing issue on the latest, but they both look like brain farts which - dare I say - do seem to affect some people more often as they age.

Given all that and that he's 77 years old I don't think it's wildly inappropriate or unkind to discuss whether it might be time for him to hang it up, or modify his habits in some way (quieter airspace / airports, instructor or copilot, whatever). Doesn't have to take away from his many flying accomplishments. Nothing but admiration for the ADM demonstrated by pilots who decide that day has come.
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Use of the word “continue” in that context could result in this error with many of us. “Remain” would have been much better. Ford is at fault, yes, but ATC could use some improvement as well.
 
"Continue holding short runway 25, traffic on the runway" was the full phrase. I agree starting an instruction to not move with "continue" is arguably sub-optimal but you do have to not fully process (or fully hear) quite a lot of that sentence to make the mistake.
 
Cogito said:
Did Ford get a phone number to call at HHR last week?
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Yes. You can hear "possible pilot deviation" and a number given at the end of this recording:

 
The entry for CONTINUE in the P/CG is interesting as all the examples involve moving, not holding.

Not that "Continue holding..." is wrong, it just leaves more room for a pilot error due to expectation bias. Something like, "Hold position, traffic on the runway" might have been less likely to be misinterpreted.

CONTINUE− When used as a control instruction should be followed by another word or words clarifying what is expected of the pilot. Example: “continue taxi,” “continue descent,” “continue inbound,” etc.
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Larry in TN said:
The entry for CONTINUE in the P/CG is interesting as all the examples involve moving, not holding.

Not that "Continue holding..." is wrong, it just leaves more room for a pilot error due to expectation bias. Something like, "Hold position, traffic on the runway" might have been less likely to be misinterpreted.
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Yeah, I had looked at that as well. It technically means "keep doing what I already told you to do", but I can see the point.
 
bucket
 
There but for the grace of God go I....

Maybe not this way, I'm sure I'll find a more creative way for a pilot deviation.
 
If he was already holding short why did the tower even communicate with him? Seems like a waste of bandwidth to say keep doing what you're doing.

I think he wasn't expecting any communication until he was granted permission to cross. A big mistake on his part and it's good no one was injured.
 
NordicDave said:
Didn’t realize he had a helo accident as a student pilot.
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He also had an accident later fully rated, if that’s not the same accident. Because he had that time he picked up some lost hikers with his helicopter near his ranch, and he wasn’t a student anymore.

He talked about it on Inside the Actor’s Studio once. RIP James Lipton.

He mentioned that he wanted to get back to flying helicopters but celebrities and insurance companies and contracts and such... he was essentially banned from it.

He’s taking a lot of crap right now but he’s done a lot of flying over a long time. The celebrity status, depicting a space hot shot pilot, and supreme boredom of commentators online during a quarantine are a perfect bad PR storm for him.

In the end, he probably needs that t-shirt a whole bunch of us have seen and would wear...

“World’s okayest pilot.”

Have seen so many scarier pilots do stuff at our home drome, WITH CFIs on board... I just can’t get too fussed about Harrison without seeing in person, in a cockpit, what if any bad habits and behaviors he’s got.

And that’s pretty damn unlikely to happen, so... meh.

I do think the memes are funny, if a bit cruel, though! :)

I suspect from a VERY brief personal meeting of him once that he is the sort who can at least laugh at himself a little with a pained expression — knowing even his aviation peers won’t have a stitch of mercy, even the ones who’ve made bigger mistakes.

Not the pros, but the hobbyists tend to do the hobby a disservice flame broiling anybody in front of the aviation clueless. They’re already convinced the hobby is an unnecessary death sentence. :)
 
I like his movies, and his passion for aviation. I also really like he seems normal, and not some Hollywood nut job. At some point Incidents start to hurt the cause as aviation champion. As mentioned earlier, the guy is flying in a fishbowl.

i’m guessing with a long and successful career in the public eye as he has enjoyed, he has to have a fairly tough hide.
 
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Larry in TN said:
The entry for CONTINUE in the P/CG is interesting as all the examples involve moving, not holding.

Not that "Continue holding..." is wrong, it just leaves more room for a pilot error due to expectation bias. Something like, "Hold position, traffic on the runway" might have been less likely to be misinterpreted.
Click to expand...

“continue holding” actually is approved phraseology for not allowing movement but only in a LUAW application.
 
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