Why do they always call me Skyhawk?

[Salty]

Someone put me in the system wrong once on a long cross country and at every handoff, the new guy would call me a skyhawk and then later ask me if I was really a Skyhawk (tas was about 150 knots at 10,000), then they’d say I was in the system wrong, but apparently not bother to fix it since it happened about 5 times.

worst one though was when a tower called me a piper cub when I was taxiing right in front of the tower in a Mooney.

 

[Deelee]

Me - "Arrow 1234R, level 7,000"

Controller - "Arrow 1234R radar contact Dulles altimeter 30.10" =
Controller - "Cherokee 1234R radar contact Dulles altimeter 30.10" =
Controller - "Archer 1234R radar contact Dulles altimeter 30.10" =
Controller - "Cessna 1234R radar contact Dulles altimeter 30.10" = (Cancel IFR, plz I'm giving YOU a phone number to call...)
Now... this has never happened, but - "Aerostar 1234R radar contact Dulles altimeter 30.10" =

 

[jordane93]

Probably because in the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter. If you were flying a Citation, I’m sure it would be a bigger deal.

 

[RussR]

It so doesn't matter. I mean, the only time it actually matters is if there is a Skyhawk 123 AND a Skylane 123 both on frequency at the same time, but the controller is supposed to do certain things in that case.

It amazes me how much importance some people (not necessarily anybody here) place on getting the right aircraft name, as if their self-worth and ego is all tied up in that name.

For example, I went to formal training in a Cessna 421 several years back, and on my first CTAF call, "XXX traffic, Twin Cessna 123 departing runway 18", the CFI immediately said "um, it's GOLDEN EAGLE". Yeah, sure - it's a Twin Cessna for all anybody really cares. "Twin Cessna" gives everybody who cares a good enough idea of what performance it will have.

I owned a Warrior for 11 years. I just called it "Cherokee". Because the performance is about the same, and really, insisting it be called a "warrior" seemed a little silly for a 150-hp 4 seat airplane! Also because I was never going to "win" - the ATC code for most PA-28s is simply P28A. Cherokee, Warrior, Archer, Challenger, etc., etc. The blip on the radar scope looks exactly the same.

Remember that the only 2 reasons ANYBODY (ATC or otherwise) needs to know your type aircraft are 1) some rough idea of performance, and 2) which one you are in the event they see more than one airplane.

For 1), this mostly applies to ATC, but can also apply to uncontrolled field operations too. If there's a "Cessna" on 3 mile final, can I takeoff (or as a tower controller, can I clear you for takeoff) before they get to the runway? Whether it's a 152 or a 172 or a 182 makes no effective difference. Whether it's a 152 or 421 or a Citation might - so that level of distinction is important.

Or, can I have that airplane climb to 15000 to clear traffic? If it's a 172, no. If it's a 421, yes.

 

[Salty]

It so doesn't matter. I mean, the only time it actually matters is if there is a Skyhawk 123 AND a Skylane 123 both on frequency at the same time, but the controller is supposed to do certain things in that case.

It amazes me how much importance some people (not necessarily anybody here) place on getting the right aircraft name, as if their self-worth and ego is all tied up in that name.

For example, I went to formal training in a Cessna 421 several years back, and on my first CTAF call, "XXX traffic, Twin Cessna 123 departing runway 18", the CFI immediately said "um, it's GOLDEN EAGLE". Yeah, sure - it's a Twin Cessna for all anybody really cares. "Twin Cessna" gives everybody who cares a good enough idea of what performance it will have.

I owned a Warrior for 11 years. I just called it "Cherokee". Because the performance is about the same, and really, insisting it be called a "warrior" seemed a little silly for a 150-hp 4 seat airplane! Also because I was never going to "win" - the ATC code for most PA-28s is simply P28A. Cherokee, Warrior, Archer, Challenger, etc., etc. The blip on the radar scope looks exactly the same.

Remember that the only 2 reasons ANYBODY (ATC or otherwise) needs to know your type aircraft are 1) some rough idea of performance, and 2) which one you are in the event they see more than one airplane.

For 1), this mostly applies to ATC, but can also apply to uncontrolled field operations too. If there's a "Cessna" on 3 mile final, can I takeoff (or as a tower controller, can I clear you for takeoff) before they get to the runway? Whether it's a 152 or a 172 or a 182 makes no effective difference. Whether it's a 152 or 421 or a Citation might - so that level of distinction is important.

Or, can I have that airplane climb to 15000 to clear traffic? If it's a 172, no. If it's a 421, yes.

I agree. But man, I called a buddies warrior a Cherokee once and I don’t think he’ll ever get over it.

 

[schmookeeg]

We should be happy they don't adopt a single and pejorative word for "any winged nuisance under 250kt" and just use that.

Kiddo might be an amusing choice.

"Approach, y u call me skyhawk? don't you know who I am?"

"Kiddo 12345, radar service terminated, squawk 1200, good day"

 

[Palmpilot]

We should be happy they don't adopt a single and pejorative word for "any winged nuisance under 250kt" and just use that.

Kiddo might be an amusing choice...

What about "FLIB"?

 

[Stan Cooper]

When I call on initial contact and identify as "experimental Zodiac six zero one kilo echo", I'm often often requested to "say type", so I respond with "charlie hotel six zero" which is the ICAO type identifier for my Zodiac. Nine times out of ten, the next time they call me it's "helicopter six zero one kilo echo." It turns out the ICAO identifier for Blackhawk helicopters is H60.

If I'm not asked for the type, the next time they call me it's often "Kodiak six zero one kilo echo." A Kodiak is a single engine turboprop, and about half again as fast as my LSA.

It takes an exchange or two to clarify that I'm a single engine fixed wing LSA with a cruise speed of about 110 knots, and not a helicopter or a turboprop Kodiak.

 

[Albany Tom]

The C (or X or L) wasn't really part of the registration, just the way you displayed the number on the plane. I believe if you look at the old Airworthiness Certificates or registrations, you won't find it there.

I could have sworn the original registration is NCxxxx, but I've been wrong before. I'm sure the registration software only stores the numeric portion these days.

 

[clear_prop]

Well, after reading this thread I don't think I can complain about the Glasair getting called a Glastar.

I fly a Sportsman (GLSP) and get called 'gee, uh light sport' all the time.

They called me a Gulfstream once. I didn't complain.

 

[flyingron]

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, how many of you guys can distinguish all types of aircraft you see?

Controllers are no different and the type aircraft that gets typed in the data block by the clearance delivery controller isn’t always readily apparent to what the aircraft is called. Pilot - “I’m a navion” Most controllers - “WTF is a navion?”

Yep, when filing (or the like) I always respond to the type inquiry as Navion - November Alpha Victor India Slash Golf

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

Most controllers - “WTF is a navion?”

The Navions that the old man owned would be best described as a collection of hydraulic leaks flying in close formation.

 

[Pilawt]

It so doesn't matter. I mean, the only time it actually matters is if there is a Skyhawk 123 AND a Skylane 123 both on frequency at the same time, but the controller is supposed to do certain things in that case.

It amazes me how much importance some people (not necessarily anybody here) place on getting the right aircraft name, as if their self-worth and ego is all tied up in that name.

For the most part I agree. But the distinction might become important if the controller uses that type name to describe you to other traffic.

For example, one controller somehow got it in his craw that my C172 was a BE33. The frequency was busy so I didn't bother correcting him (I don't care what you call me, so long as you call me for dinner). Then he called me out as traffic to somebody else, "Your traffic is a Debonair, at your ten o'clock, two miles ... " Then I spoke up, to avoid confusion by the other guy.

 

[RussR]

For the most part I agree. But the distinction might become important if the controller uses that type name to describe you to other traffic.

For example, one controller somehow got it in his craw that my C172 was a BE33. The frequency was busy so I didn't bother correcting him (I don't care what you call me, so long as you call me for dinner). Then he called me out as traffic to somebody else, "Your traffic is a Debonair, at your ten o'clock, two miles ... " Then I spoke up, to avoid confusion by the other guy.

Well that kind of fits into what I intended for my reason #2, which is that it's only important if you have to actually see an airplane, and know what it is so you don't get it confused for another airplane.

 

[luvflyin]

For the most part I agree. But the distinction might become important if the controller uses that type name to describe you to other traffic.

For example, one controller somehow got it in his craw that my C172 was a BE33. The frequency was busy so I didn't bother correcting him (I don't care what you call me, so long as you call me for dinner). Then he called me out as traffic to somebody else, "Your traffic is a Debonair, at your ten o'clock, two miles ... " Then I spoke up, to avoid confusion by the other guy.

Reminds me of a story. Well, not a story, it happened. I'm working Approach at Burbank and have a Mirage. I call it as traffic to another plane. While I'm doing it, it dawns on me that calling a Mirage as traffic sounds kinda silly. It must have shown in my voice. Pilot comes back with kinda a chuckle in his voice and says "...let me know if it disappears."

 

[Pilawt]

Reminds me of a story. Well, not a story, it happened. I'm working Approach at Burbank and have a Mirage. I call it as traffic to another plane. While I'm doing it, it dawns on me that calling a Mirage as traffic sounds kinda silly. It must have shown in my voice. Pilot comes back with kinda a chuckle in his voice and says "...let me know if it disappears."

Back in the 1990s I was flying near Palmdale CA when Joshua Approach told me, "Traffic is an F-117, eleven o'clock, five miles, southbound, a thousand feet below. Report that traffic in sight."

The obvious comeback line would have been too easy, and I'm sure he'd heard it before, so I let it go.

 

[EdFred]

Back in the 1990s I was flying near Palmdale CA when Joshua Approach told me, "Traffic is an F-117, eleven o'clock, five miles, southbound, a thousand feet below. Report that traffic in sight."

The obvious comeback line would have been too easy, and I'm sure he'd heard it before, so I let it go.

"I have him on RADAR."

 

[Albany Tom]

"I have him on RADAR."

...only if you can do it in an eastern European accent.

 

[Hang 4]

My owners manual calls my PA28 a Challenger. Needless to say, I've never called it that to ATC. I just call it a Cherokee. Sometimes ATC refers to me as an Archer when I'm IFR. Class D towers occasionally call me a Cessna to other planes that are supposed to follow me.

 

[tawood]

I used to fly a tri-Q2. I've gotten "biplane", "canard", and even "thing on taxiway alpha".

 

[WDD]

Took my wife for a ride when I got my ppl. Called ground “this is Tiger 1234”. Oh yeah, wife babe - you’re with a pilot tiger now.

Ground called back “Grumman 1234”. I was having none of that.

So - do pilot egos drive what they want to be called? Pilots have egos? Surely you jest……..

 

[tawood]

Took my wife for a ride when I got my ppl. Called ground “this is Tiger 1234”. Oh yeah, wife babe - you’re with a pilot tiger now.

Ground called back “Grumman 1234”. I was having none of that.

So - do pilot egos drive what they want to be called? Pilots have egos? Surely you jest……..

I've jokingly corrected ATC when they've called my Piper a Cessna...I'll respond, "Was that call for PIPER 1234?"

 

[Coinneach]

My owners manual calls my PA28 a Challenger. Needless to say, I've never called it that to ATC. I just call it a Cherokee. Sometimes ATC refers to me as an Archer when I'm IFR. Class D towers occasionally call me a Cessna to other planes that are supposed to follow me.

My current ride is a '73 Challenger. I've flown Cherokees, Warriors, Archers, and Arrows. ATC referred to all of them as Cherokee, except for the one time Phoenix Approach called me a Cessna when I was trying to get permission to enter the bravo.

What's more annoying is when they transpose my tail number, as happened on my last flight. "Cherokee 142, cleared to land 25R." "Was that for Cherokee 412?" "Affirmative, Cherokee 412 cleared to land 25R." One minute later: "Cherokee 142, turn at A6, ground point 8."

 

[Pilawt]

I’m in the process of changing my airplane’s tail number now. The old number ended in 48C. At least once on every long flight a controller would call “November 4 Bravo Charlie … “ and would get upset if I didn’t answer. I got in the habit of asking, “Was that for 48 Charlie?”

I guess on their display the ‘8’ looks a lot like a ‘B’.

 

[asicer]

Took my wife for a ride when I got my ppl. Called ground “this is Tiger 1234”. Oh yeah, wife babe - you’re with a pilot tiger now.

Ground called back “Grumman 1234”. I was having none of that.

So - do pilot egos drive what they want to be called? Pilots have egos? Surely you jest……..

Interestingly, I always call up with "Grumman 1234" and ATC often responds with "Grumman Tiger 1234".

I guess they've been handling a lot of Widgeons lately?

 

[Pilawt]

I guess they've been handling a lot of Widgeons lately?

Years ago I was flying my Cheetah near the Siskiyou Mountains where wildfires were active. ATC said, "Say type Grumman." It made sense; several exotic Grumman warbird types based at Redding were involved in fighting the fire.

 

[Plano Pilot]

I’m in the process of changing my airplane’s tail number now. The old number ended in 48C. At least once on every long flight a controller would call “November 4 Bravo Charlie … “ and would get upset if I didn’t answer. I got in the habit of asking, “Was that for 48 Charlie?”

I guess on their display the ‘8’ looks a lot like a ‘B’.

I flew a Falcon 20, N28C for years. I got used to being called N 2 Bravo Charlie.

 

[Plano Pilot]

Back in the early 90's I was flying the Falcon 20 when the Diamond DA20 Katana showed up. The Falcon had been DA20 for several years and the controller's started confusing us with the Diamond. Never understood why since we were so much faster. I once had a controller, at an airport with 2 longer runways, try to put us on a runway just over 3,000 feet. FYI, as far as I know the Falcon 20 has been FFJ, DA20 and DA02. The type rating on my cert says DA-20.

 

[Palmpilot]

My current ride is a '73 Challenger. I've flown Cherokees, Warriors, Archers, and Arrows. ATC referred to all of them as Cherokee, except for the one time Phoenix Approach called me a Cessna when I was trying to get permission to enter the bravo.

What's more annoying is when they transpose my tail number, as happened on my last flight. "Cherokee 142, cleared to land 25R." "Was that for Cherokee 412?" "Affirmative, Cherokee 412 cleared to land 25R." One minute later: "Cherokee 142, turn at A6, ground point 8."

The last Arrow I flew was one of the very early ones that said "Cherokee" on the POH!

 

[Pilawt]

The last Arrow I flew was one of the very early ones that said "Cherokee" on the POH!

All PA-28s and PA-32s had "Cherokee" in the name through the 1977 model year. For 1978 the "Cherokee" name only appeared in the PA-32 "Cherokee Six" 260 and 300. Then for 1979 the 260 hp model was gone, and the PA-32-300 became simply "Six 300".

 

[Tusayan]

I use ‘Monsun 123AB’ (pronounced Monsoon) for the reason that Bölkow makes controllers vector you towards a helipad, and also because their pronunciation would hurt my ears. The third option, Messerschmitt, gets them all excited. I don’t like drama when dealing with government employees, whether they are ATC or IRS, no good comes of it. ATC seems to do OK with Monsun and can pronounce it.

An upside of flying an unusual type is that there isn’t typically more than one at a time for ATC to deal with.

 

[PredragVasic]

(...) how many of you guys can distinguish all types of aircraft you see? Controllers are no different and the type aircraft that gets typed in the data block by the clearance delivery controller isn’t always readily apparent to what the aircraft is called.

I don't know... Normally, every interaction with a controller begins with "Somewhere Tower, this is Cessna 4-6-2-tango-whiskey..." etc, to which the controller simply needs to repeat "Cessna 4-6-2-tango-whiskey" (or simply "Cessna 2-tango-whiskey"), at the beginning of his (her) response. I would think it takes more of a mental effort to look at that plane and decide which model and type it is, than to just repeat what (s)he heard.

 

[Todd82]

My owners manual calls my PA28 a Challenger. Needless to say, I've never called it that to ATC. I just call it a Cherokee. Sometimes ATC refers to me as an Archer when I'm IFR. Class D towers occasionally call me a Cessna to other planes that are supposed to follow me.

Part of me says you should always call yourself Challenger to be a jet, but on the other hand you wouldn't want to be confused for a lowly CRJ


Awhile back a local had a Meridian. He was a bit of a known Richard Cranium. ATC used to LOVE to call him a Cherokee, and he'd get PO'ed.

The work C404's are known as Titans in Cessna nomenclature. Find me an ATC who knows what that is or even that it's a Twin Cessna when they see C404 entered in the system.

 

[EdFred]

Part of me says you should always call yourself Challenger to be a jet, but on the other hand you wouldn't want to be confused for a lowly CRJ


Awhile back a local had a Meridian. He was a bit of a known Richard Cranium. ATC used to LOVE to call him a Cherokee, and he'd get PO'ed.

The work C404's are known as Titans in Cessna nomenclature. Find me an ATC who knows what that is or even that it's a Twin Cessna when they see C404 entered in the system.

I bet @Radar Contact would know.

 

[Todd82]

I bet @Radar Contact would know.

There are a few. I'd buy them drinks but they always claim they're not allowed to drink in that tower.

 

[Rich Holt]

"I have him on RADAR."

There is no faster way to irritate a 22 driver than to call RADAR contact when they check in. It's kinda like referring to yourself as a controller in front of a civvie controller. They get bent out of shape really fast.

 

[Rich Holt]

You can rid yourself of the embarrassment of being called a Skyhawk by getting yourself a cool callsign, like GRFFN01.

 

[PredragVasic]

You can rid yourself of the embarrassment of being called a Skyhawk by getting yourself a cool callsign, like GRFFN01.

I'm not sure what use would such callsign be when one flies in the national (or, for that matter, International) airspace. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there are only two types of callsigns one can use while communicating with ATC. For general aviation (non-scheduled flights), it is the aircraft registration number (normally preceded by the type or make of the aircraft). For scheduled flights, it is the airline identifier, followed by the flight number.

There is a bit of flexibility in the type or make of the aircraft, mainly for the purpose of making it easier to visually identify the aircraft (Bonanza, Cessna, Mooney, Piper, etc), but that part is often not of great importance; it is the tail number that is critical, and that one is never anything other than the actual registration number printed on the side of the aircraft. Airlines use their names, but there are several unique airline callsigns that don't quite immediately indicate the airline name (Speedbird, Brickyard, Redwood, Shamrock, Dragon, Cactus, Citrus, etc).

 

[TCABM]

I'm not sure what use would such callsign be when one flies in the national (or, for that matter, International) airspace.

An example. The COMPASSION call sign and it’s three-letter designator CMF is intended to clearly identify routine ambulatory patient transport and other public service missions conducted by volunteers.

https://www.aircarealliance.org/cmf/

 

[PredragVasic]

An example. The COMPASSION call sign and it’s three-letter designator CMF is intended to clearly identify routine ambulatory patient transport and other public service missions conducted by volunteers.

I think this is a different matter. There are some special callsigns that indicate special type of flight, passengers or cargo (and that includes MEDEVAC, etc).

Making up one's own callsign and using that in ATC is not going to work.