mtuomi
En-Route
Do they really have to memorize that? That sounds crazy.
When dreams come true... (long)
- Thread starter LDJones
- Start date
Do they really have to memorize that? That sounds crazy.
mscard88
Touchdown! Greaser!
I dunno, but it's not that difficult. Just look at each individual overhead panel, say electric for example, and know what and where the switches should be. Once you do it a few times should be good.
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Kayoh@190
Exactly. That's what cool about a flow - it's a flow! There are huge numbers of items, but taken methodically it's not too bad. Just lots and lots of chair flying. Same thing with all the call outs - while studying together at the hotel, we'd bounce a tennis ball back and forth and say our call once the ball gets to us. Forces us to make the calls in a timely manner - no saying "uuuuuh....".
mtuomi
En-Route
Yeah, I started thinking about it and our after start and before taxi and taxi "flows" have around 50 items too. It just sounds like a big number when it's written down like that
Exactly....our Originating Check. And it's counting all the items including the responses we're looking during things like the FIREX monitor test, which is only done on First Flight of the Day (FFOD). Similar tests for duct overheat monitoring and ice protection tests. It gets pretty involved. Then the actual checklist is only about ten all-encompassing items!
I'd forgotten that trick...I need to go find a tennis ball!
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No tennis balls available, but we found an orange worked just fine. My sim partner practicing callouts with me before our sim session!
Congratulations!
So, a few details about the LOE...
The final "checkride" is called an LOE...Line Oriented Evaluation. It's done by a company FAA designated examiner. It started with a Knowledge Validation (KV)...same as an oral exam in any checkride. It was an hour of firing limitations, emergency procedure memory items, deicing procedures, SOPs, IFR minutiae, etc. at myself and my sim partner who was also doing her LOE. We were well-prepared, aided by some excellent gouges provided by the Captains that have gone before us, but still learned a lot via the ensuing discussions.
We took a short break and then headed into the sim. I went first. We originated a flight in LAX, from bringing a cold, dark airplane to life, preparing it for flight, doing the initial ICE briefing with the crew (introductions, emergency communications, etc.), followed by the All Flights briefing (details about that particular leg...altitude, time enroute, expected ride, etc.) We programmed the FMS and briefed the routing, then ran all the preflight checklists.
Once cleared everyone was onboard I told the Flight Attendant he was good close, and then talked to the ground crew about the pushback. We ran the prestart checklist, then the engine start check before calling ramp for a pushback clearance. We were at gate A65 in LAX so departed the C8 alley and joined Charlie taxiway for runway 8L departure. It was a loooong taxi! The sim is a bit herky-jerky taxing with the tiller so we were told ahead of time the examiners are aware of that "sim-ism" and won't dock us! Thank goodness.
When approaching the runway I called for the Before Takeoff Check, confirmed the designated runway and that final was clear. We were cleared into position, then cleared to takeoff. We were in a 700 weighing in at 67,000 lbs. so rotation was at 121 kts. We were cleared via the LAXX1 departure, TRM transition then into PHX via the ARLIN4 arrival. We were given some level offs to see how we handled that, the were cleared direct TRM. The 200 kt tailwind was sorta fun!
On the way to TRM I had an IDG 1 fault. I transferred the controls to my FO so I could run the QRH procedures. There's no real recovery from the loss of the IDG (Integrated Drive Generator) other than to turn off the GEN switch and then start the APU as a secondary electrical source. That imposed a system limitation of 31,000', lower than our FL330 filed altitude so I had to advise ATC that FL310 would be our final.
After TRM we were advised of traffic, which turned into a full blown RA (Resolution Advisory), which is our TCAS telling us what action we must take IMMEDIATELY. AP off, pitch for the green indication on the VSI...averting a collision with a SWA 737. Advised TC, they apologized and we continued on our way.
Once on the ARLIN we were told there was a disabled aircraft on the runway and advise ready to copy holding instructions. We programmed the hold into the FMS, complete with the EFC time, after which ATC asked how long we could hold. So more computations, evaluation of options and then gave him the latest we could stay in the hold. Miraculously the runway cleared almost immediately and we were vectored for the ILS to runway 8.
On final approach we got an AC SERV BUS caution message. I just told the FO that we were landing and would deal with it on the ground.
We landed, found our way to the gate, ran all our flows and checklists, did the QRH on the last caution message, then called maintenance to advise of the write-ups. The DPE said, "Go ahead and terminate it", which is another flow/checklist. He said, "Good...now flow all the switches for takeoff."
Next thing we knew we were sitting at the end of Rwy 8 ready for takeoff, this time with the FO being the Pilot Flying and me the Pilot Monitoring. Almost immediately after rotation we got a SMOKE CARGO warning message. That's serious stuff. I told the FO to declare an emergency and get vectors to a 10 mile file and have them roll the trucks. I flipped over to the intercom and hit the EMER intercom button. Our flight attendant answered and said it was getting pretty smoky in the back. I said we were returning to the field and to expect an evacuation. We did our NTSBO brief before signing off. I then ran the QRC procedure for the SMOKE CARGO which included blowing the halon bottles in the cargo bay. Fire was still persisting as we came around for the approach and landing.
Once on the ground we turned into the wind, I told my FO to grab the QRC for an emergency evacuation while I talked to the FA in back. I said the magic words "ASSESS AND WAIT FOR MY COMMAND", before returning to the FO to complete the emergency evac procedures, during which I made the "EVACUATE, EVACUATE, EVACUATE" command, shut everything down, hit the FIRE PUSH switches for both engines and the APU, flipped the master off and bailed out.
After which the DPE said, "Congratulations, you passed."
The feeling of relief was indescribable.
The final "checkride" is called an LOE...Line Oriented Evaluation. It's done by a company FAA designated examiner. It started with a Knowledge Validation (KV)...same as an oral exam in any checkride. It was an hour of firing limitations, emergency procedure memory items, deicing procedures, SOPs, IFR minutiae, etc. at myself and my sim partner who was also doing her LOE. We were well-prepared, aided by some excellent gouges provided by the Captains that have gone before us, but still learned a lot via the ensuing discussions.
We took a short break and then headed into the sim. I went first. We originated a flight in LAX, from bringing a cold, dark airplane to life, preparing it for flight, doing the initial ICE briefing with the crew (introductions, emergency communications, etc.), followed by the All Flights briefing (details about that particular leg...altitude, time enroute, expected ride, etc.) We programmed the FMS and briefed the routing, then ran all the preflight checklists.
Once cleared everyone was onboard I told the Flight Attendant he was good close, and then talked to the ground crew about the pushback. We ran the prestart checklist, then the engine start check before calling ramp for a pushback clearance. We were at gate A65 in LAX so departed the C8 alley and joined Charlie taxiway for runway 8L departure. It was a loooong taxi! The sim is a bit herky-jerky taxing with the tiller so we were told ahead of time the examiners are aware of that "sim-ism" and won't dock us! Thank goodness.
When approaching the runway I called for the Before Takeoff Check, confirmed the designated runway and that final was clear. We were cleared into position, then cleared to takeoff. We were in a 700 weighing in at 67,000 lbs. so rotation was at 121 kts. We were cleared via the LAXX1 departure, TRM transition then into PHX via the ARLIN4 arrival. We were given some level offs to see how we handled that, the were cleared direct TRM. The 200 kt tailwind was sorta fun!
On the way to TRM I had an IDG 1 fault. I transferred the controls to my FO so I could run the QRH procedures. There's no real recovery from the loss of the IDG (Integrated Drive Generator) other than to turn off the GEN switch and then start the APU as a secondary electrical source. That imposed a system limitation of 31,000', lower than our FL330 filed altitude so I had to advise ATC that FL310 would be our final.
After TRM we were advised of traffic, which turned into a full blown RA (Resolution Advisory), which is our TCAS telling us what action we must take IMMEDIATELY. AP off, pitch for the green indication on the VSI...averting a collision with a SWA 737. Advised TC, they apologized and we continued on our way.
Once on the ARLIN we were told there was a disabled aircraft on the runway and advise ready to copy holding instructions. We programmed the hold into the FMS, complete with the EFC time, after which ATC asked how long we could hold. So more computations, evaluation of options and then gave him the latest we could stay in the hold. Miraculously the runway cleared almost immediately and we were vectored for the ILS to runway 8.
On final approach we got an AC SERV BUS caution message. I just told the FO that we were landing and would deal with it on the ground.
We landed, found our way to the gate, ran all our flows and checklists, did the QRH on the last caution message, then called maintenance to advise of the write-ups. The DPE said, "Go ahead and terminate it", which is another flow/checklist. He said, "Good...now flow all the switches for takeoff."
Next thing we knew we were sitting at the end of Rwy 8 ready for takeoff, this time with the FO being the Pilot Flying and me the Pilot Monitoring. Almost immediately after rotation we got a SMOKE CARGO warning message. That's serious stuff. I told the FO to declare an emergency and get vectors to a 10 mile file and have them roll the trucks. I flipped over to the intercom and hit the EMER intercom button. Our flight attendant answered and said it was getting pretty smoky in the back. I said we were returning to the field and to expect an evacuation. We did our NTSBO brief before signing off. I then ran the QRC procedure for the SMOKE CARGO which included blowing the halon bottles in the cargo bay. Fire was still persisting as we came around for the approach and landing.
Once on the ground we turned into the wind, I told my FO to grab the QRC for an emergency evacuation while I talked to the FA in back. I said the magic words "ASSESS AND WAIT FOR MY COMMAND", before returning to the FO to complete the emergency evac procedures, during which I made the "EVACUATE, EVACUATE, EVACUATE" command, shut everything down, hit the FIRE PUSH switches for both engines and the APU, flipped the master off and bailed out.
After which the DPE said, "Congratulations, you passed."
The feeling of relief was indescribable.
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mscard88
Touchdown! Greaser!
Congrats! Having been in your shoes at one time, I know what's involved and what you went thru to get there. Enjoy IOE! It's all easier from here on.
gkainz
Final Approach
Congrats and well done! Another chapter in this great story!
denverpilot
Tied Down
Been so fun to follow this!
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Can't hit the like button hard enough, go Captain!
Great news! Nice job. Looking forward to hearing your OE stories.
TRocket
Line Up and Wait
Congrats!! Best write up yet. Keep in mind a lot of us live vicariously through your posts!
Thanks, everyone. I'm enjoying some relaxed days at home...and flying with my students, again. Flew with the first one an hour after landing on Monday! I have two more doing checkrides later this week.
The IOE coordinator said it would probably be after the 1st before my IOE is scheduled. Score!! The plan is coming together...both Thanksgiving off BEFORE upgrade and Christmas off AFTER upgrade. Can't complain about that!
Dropped off the uniform blazer for it's fourth stripe addition. New Captain hat shipped today. I should be ready to go when they finally get something on my schedule.
I'll keep you posted. In the meantime, I'll be running my flows in my sleep so I don't forget them.
Loren
The IOE coordinator said it would probably be after the 1st before my IOE is scheduled. Score!! The plan is coming together...both Thanksgiving off BEFORE upgrade and Christmas off AFTER upgrade. Can't complain about that!
Dropped off the uniform blazer for it's fourth stripe addition. New Captain hat shipped today. I should be ready to go when they finally get something on my schedule.
I'll keep you posted. In the meantime, I'll be running my flows in my sleep so I don't forget them.
Loren
denverpilot
Tied Down
Shepherd
Final Approach
Hot damn, old man! Good for you.
jaybee
Cleared for Takeoff
Congratulations Captain !
Abram
Pre-takeoff checklist
Congrats, Jonesy!
This is by far my favorite thread on the website and has been a big part of the inspiration for me to embark on my own adventure.
One of these days, I need to post about that...
Great work and keep the updates coming.
Abram Finkelstein,
N48KY
This is by far my favorite thread on the website and has been a big part of the inspiration for me to embark on my own adventure.
One of these days, I need to post about that...
Great work and keep the updates coming.
Abram Finkelstein,
N48KY
Congratulations Captain.
Heh. That’s the last time that’ll happen until they kick you out for being too old.
Sadly, probably very true. My buddies who upgraded earlier this year were all on multi day trips over Christmas. I’m sure I’ll be doing the same next year. But it has been a glorious vacation this year!
Jonesy, got a question for you. Since acquiring all this added experience has it caused you to change anything you do with training your GA students? I know my training regime changed as I flew with other pilots. Would see something they did that I liked better and thus would incorporate into my program. Just a general question not aimed at derailing your thread!
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Jonesy, got a question for you. Since acquiring all this added experience has it caused you to change anything you do with training your GA students? I know my training regime changed as I flew with other pilots. Would see something they did that I liked better and thus would incorporate into my program. Just a general question not aimed at derailing your thread!
Oh, I’ve changed many things I teach based on the training I’ve received through this adventure, from my approach to Threat and Error Management practices to efficiently managing multiple radios. There’s quite a bit of applicability down the chain.
Well, after just over four weeks of paid vacation over the holidays, I'm finally off and running on my Captain IOE (Initial Operating Experience). They allowed us to give them a list of Check Airmen we'd prefer to fly with, with the caveat that they couldn't guarantee who we'd be assigned. I gave them a list of five or so that were my preferred and I was assigned Tim, one my top choices! My first trip with him 2.5 years ago proved to be one of the most enjoyable, and I've flown with him a couple of times since then. So getting assigned to him was a huge plus.
I contacted him a few days ahead of time to see if there was anything in particular I should have prepared ahead of time, as well as asking for a list of the common gotchas for new captains so I could brush up accordingly. He responded with a few tips, then followed up a few days later saying since we'd flown together we didn't need much of a brief in advance so he'd just meet me at the plane.
I arrived an extra hour early to just have some extra time to prepare. I checked the flow board on the aircraft, finding (much to my dismay) that we had a deferred APU, which always adds to the operational complexity, especially in the CRJ-200 since its doesn’t provide enough oomph to drive both the anti-ice systems AND the pressurization system...meaning more complex takeoff and landing configurations when icing is present.
I then checked the weather at MDW since that was our first turn. MDW in and of itself provides challenges just because of the relatively short runways, surrounded tightly by city on all sides. The weather was 300' and a half mile when I checked...just over our minimums to get in. So, no APU and low weather! Yay! :-(
Tim arrived, then the plane arrived and we boarded. It felt really weird in the Left Seat, despite all the sim time I had there in training. Once you're in the real aircraft it all changes and I felt a sorta of tunnel vision setting in as I tried to focus on all the tasks and flows assigned the captain, in addition to all the other things we're responsible for. And Tim, in his role, is there to let me be captain, so whenever I started to defer to him he'd say, "What do YOU want to do, Captain?" Oh, yeah...the ball is in my court from now on.
I worked my way through the prep for the first turn, did the initial crew brief, made the pax announcement while we coordinated with the ground crew for an air start (no APU, remember?) Net result: We pushed back about 10 min. late. :-( While pushing back the tug operator says, "Ops wants to know why you guys are pushing late?" Tim, clearly annoyed, says, "Training!" That was that!
So now I get to taxi a CRJ for the first time! Turns out, the 200 is a piece of cake. And MUCH smoother than in the sim, which tended to jerk around constantly. It was actually quite delightful to taxi. They gave us a runway swap at the last minute, which shortened our taxi by about ten minutes which pretty much made up for our late push. Winning!
The flight to MDW went pretty well, including a good approach except for missing a couple of callouts I shouldn't have missed. Tim gently backed me up on those. The tunnel vision was beginning to lift. Once on the ground (a nice landing, if I do say so myself....just a slight float at the end. The alternating red/white centerline lights come up fast at MDW!) Took the last turnoff to avoid stomping the brakes, got our taxi instructions then started for the gate. It was then I realized how easy I had it in the Right Seat! I've always tried to be actively engaged in the taxi to assist the Captain, but now the responsibility was on me and in my left hand! It was a little nerve-wracking.
The MDW turn went well and we pushed five minutes early. Second time through the flows was definitely better. I had briefed that I'd be calling for the autopilot earlier than usual due to the complexity of Chicago airspace and their usual level-offs and vectoring and that's how I flew it. It was a smooth flight back, other than a slight slam-dunk into MSP since they were visual and they'd kept me high a little longer. I told him I was going to hand fly it (instead of doing an ILS like originally planned), kicked off the AP and got it on the LOC and GS visually and landed. Taxied in (forgetting to set my lights...DOH! One of those Captain tasks I still need to adapt to performing!), but remembered to kill the nose lights before blinding the marshaller.
In our debrief he credited me for the autopilot call early on. He said he sees too many trying to hand fly in busy airspace and it usually isn't pretty.
We swapped into a CRJ-900 for our last leg to IAD. Tim flew that so I could do Pilot Monitoring duties. The taxiing was a bit more of a challenge with the 900, partly because of the extra length (you really have to overshoot your turns), but mostly because of the super-powerful brakes. I guess you need monster brakes to stop 85,000 lbs.! It was a smooth, uneventful flight (but dark as dark can be....you couldn't see anything anywhere!), with an easy visual arrival around 11:40p. By the time we got to our hotel after midnight, I was beat.
So today I've been hanging out in my hotel room reviewing procedures and callouts to make sure I don't get sidetracked again. Due to a storm in MSP we were notified later this morning that our IAD-MSP leg had been cancelled, so now we will go direct CLE for the night, getting in around 6:30p instead of after 11p. Another win! (But that will probably mean the first round is on me since we will be in early enough to actually go out for dinner, a burden I'll happily bear!)
I contacted him a few days ahead of time to see if there was anything in particular I should have prepared ahead of time, as well as asking for a list of the common gotchas for new captains so I could brush up accordingly. He responded with a few tips, then followed up a few days later saying since we'd flown together we didn't need much of a brief in advance so he'd just meet me at the plane.
I arrived an extra hour early to just have some extra time to prepare. I checked the flow board on the aircraft, finding (much to my dismay) that we had a deferred APU, which always adds to the operational complexity, especially in the CRJ-200 since its doesn’t provide enough oomph to drive both the anti-ice systems AND the pressurization system...meaning more complex takeoff and landing configurations when icing is present.
I then checked the weather at MDW since that was our first turn. MDW in and of itself provides challenges just because of the relatively short runways, surrounded tightly by city on all sides. The weather was 300' and a half mile when I checked...just over our minimums to get in. So, no APU and low weather! Yay! :-(
Tim arrived, then the plane arrived and we boarded. It felt really weird in the Left Seat, despite all the sim time I had there in training. Once you're in the real aircraft it all changes and I felt a sorta of tunnel vision setting in as I tried to focus on all the tasks and flows assigned the captain, in addition to all the other things we're responsible for. And Tim, in his role, is there to let me be captain, so whenever I started to defer to him he'd say, "What do YOU want to do, Captain?" Oh, yeah...the ball is in my court from now on.
I worked my way through the prep for the first turn, did the initial crew brief, made the pax announcement while we coordinated with the ground crew for an air start (no APU, remember?) Net result: We pushed back about 10 min. late. :-( While pushing back the tug operator says, "Ops wants to know why you guys are pushing late?" Tim, clearly annoyed, says, "Training!" That was that!
So now I get to taxi a CRJ for the first time! Turns out, the 200 is a piece of cake. And MUCH smoother than in the sim, which tended to jerk around constantly. It was actually quite delightful to taxi. They gave us a runway swap at the last minute, which shortened our taxi by about ten minutes which pretty much made up for our late push. Winning!
The flight to MDW went pretty well, including a good approach except for missing a couple of callouts I shouldn't have missed. Tim gently backed me up on those. The tunnel vision was beginning to lift. Once on the ground (a nice landing, if I do say so myself....just a slight float at the end. The alternating red/white centerline lights come up fast at MDW!) Took the last turnoff to avoid stomping the brakes, got our taxi instructions then started for the gate. It was then I realized how easy I had it in the Right Seat! I've always tried to be actively engaged in the taxi to assist the Captain, but now the responsibility was on me and in my left hand! It was a little nerve-wracking.
The MDW turn went well and we pushed five minutes early. Second time through the flows was definitely better. I had briefed that I'd be calling for the autopilot earlier than usual due to the complexity of Chicago airspace and their usual level-offs and vectoring and that's how I flew it. It was a smooth flight back, other than a slight slam-dunk into MSP since they were visual and they'd kept me high a little longer. I told him I was going to hand fly it (instead of doing an ILS like originally planned), kicked off the AP and got it on the LOC and GS visually and landed. Taxied in (forgetting to set my lights...DOH! One of those Captain tasks I still need to adapt to performing!), but remembered to kill the nose lights before blinding the marshaller.
In our debrief he credited me for the autopilot call early on. He said he sees too many trying to hand fly in busy airspace and it usually isn't pretty.
We swapped into a CRJ-900 for our last leg to IAD. Tim flew that so I could do Pilot Monitoring duties. The taxiing was a bit more of a challenge with the 900, partly because of the extra length (you really have to overshoot your turns), but mostly because of the super-powerful brakes. I guess you need monster brakes to stop 85,000 lbs.! It was a smooth, uneventful flight (but dark as dark can be....you couldn't see anything anywhere!), with an easy visual arrival around 11:40p. By the time we got to our hotel after midnight, I was beat.
So today I've been hanging out in my hotel room reviewing procedures and callouts to make sure I don't get sidetracked again. Due to a storm in MSP we were notified later this morning that our IAD-MSP leg had been cancelled, so now we will go direct CLE for the night, getting in around 6:30p instead of after 11p. Another win! (But that will probably mean the first round is on me since we will be in early enough to actually go out for dinner, a burden I'll happily bear!)
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Shepherd
Final Approach
Keep on having fun!
(And keep on posting)
(And keep on posting)
bluesky74656
Line Up and Wait
I probably won’t be able to get out of the house, but let me know if you need Cleveland celebratory restaurant suggestions.
denverpilot
Tied Down
Congrats on that first trip in the left seat!
Day Two was pretty easy. It was just a reposition flight of a -200 from IAD to CLE so no pax to deal with. I did get a little concerned when I checked the flow board on our inbound aircraft and saw the attached! 
Thankfully it proved to be nothing more than a slightly leaky escape hatch (not uncommon), but the other mechanical write-up was a broken ground power receptacle that had been deferred. Again, no biggie since we could just fire up the APU to get going.
I did have a little fun with the captain’s passenger announcement, introducing the flight attendants to each other and suggesting they could take turns serving each other refreshments.
The more senior of our two flight attendants commented that she’d never sat up front. Since it was a reposition flight we invited her to sit in the jumpseat. She thoroughly enjoyed the view up front!
Leaving gate B78 it was a pretty quick taxi to runway 30 and we were number one for takeoff when we got there. I lined up and she launched like a rocket! Yes, even the lowly 200 can impress when you have an empty cabin and only 5000 lbs of fuel!
1.5 hours of easy flying and I was being vectored for the approach. We still had 61 knots at 6000’ and it was gusting to 30 on the ground with about a 40 degree crosswind. Let’s just say it was “sporty” on the way in. But we landed just fine. A light CRJ stops pretty quickly, too! We taxied in uneventfully, with me even remembering to do my lights properly at the right times, thereby making my check airman happy.
Getting in five hours earlier than originally scheduled gave us the opportunity for a relaxing dinner together as a crew (with one addition from another crew) and I happily picked up the bar tab for the evening.
It was a good day.
Thankfully it proved to be nothing more than a slightly leaky escape hatch (not uncommon), but the other mechanical write-up was a broken ground power receptacle that had been deferred. Again, no biggie since we could just fire up the APU to get going.
I did have a little fun with the captain’s passenger announcement, introducing the flight attendants to each other and suggesting they could take turns serving each other refreshments.
The more senior of our two flight attendants commented that she’d never sat up front. Since it was a reposition flight we invited her to sit in the jumpseat. She thoroughly enjoyed the view up front!
Leaving gate B78 it was a pretty quick taxi to runway 30 and we were number one for takeoff when we got there. I lined up and she launched like a rocket! Yes, even the lowly 200 can impress when you have an empty cabin and only 5000 lbs of fuel!
1.5 hours of easy flying and I was being vectored for the approach. We still had 61 knots at 6000’ and it was gusting to 30 on the ground with about a 40 degree crosswind. Let’s just say it was “sporty” on the way in. But we landed just fine. A light CRJ stops pretty quickly, too! We taxied in uneventfully, with me even remembering to do my lights properly at the right times, thereby making my check airman happy.
Getting in five hours earlier than originally scheduled gave us the opportunity for a relaxing dinner together as a crew (with one addition from another crew) and I happily picked up the bar tab for the evening.
It was a good day.
Good luck on the rest of OE. Looking forward to reading more stories!
Thanks. You’re probably not far behind me on the upgrade, right?
I start February 12. 5 days of ground, 1 FTD, 2 maneuvers training, MV, 2 LOFT, LOE. Whole thing should take about a month. There’s about 10 in our class and I’m right in the middle seniority wise so there shouldn’t be too big of a break in between ground and sims.
Excellent! Congrats on the award! You’ll enjoy it. Keep us posted on your progress.