When dreams come true... (long)

denverpilot said:
Honest question, don't know. Can that run a risk of bumping you up against timing out for a day/crew rest numbers, like if they call you in on reserve for a standing overnight?
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Nope. Flight instructing isn't considered "commercial flying" so doesn't count against our FAR 117 time limits.
 
Well, I just finished my second CQ, our annual recurrent training. I'm exhausted.

I'm a pretty laid back guy. My average stress level hovers around a 1.0. Nothing really causes me angst.

Except CQ.

My stress level has been at a 9.9 since Monday. I hate it.

Day One is just a classroom day. Very laid back. That's the easy part except for all the dread running through your mind knowing what's ahead.

Then Day Two hits. It's called the the Maneuvers Valudation or MV. The sim chews you up and spits you out. Engines failing. Systems failing. CAT II approaches on one engine with a single-engined missed approach. It was exhausting.

You go back to your hotel spent...then realize you still have to review for the Knowledge Validation (KV) and Line Oriented Evaluation (LOE) the next day.

So, up at 5 am to continue your review.

The KV is a two hour oral on all the regs, policies, systems, procedures and anything else they can think of. It feels like a checkride oral on steroids because of the intricacies of 121 regs and airline Ops Specs, plus a myriad of complex jet systems.

So I survived that, but without some embarrassing stump the chump moments. I knew I could have done better, but he passed me. I swear, I'm going start prepping for next year's KV starting TOMORROW!

Then back into the monster...but the -700 monster this time rather than the lowly -200 we did the MV in. This is a simulated line flight from power up to shut down. It's what we do every day so it's generally easier than the MV. Except they always throw one or two mechanical issues or ATC glitches to mess you up. At 23,000' ATC advised of crossing traffic 1,000' above. Nothing in sight on the visuals. Then BOOM, I'm on a 90 degree knife edge!! Kick the autopilot off, roll her wings level, pitch to regain assigned altitude and re-engage the autopilot.

That was fun.

Then we get an icing report from SEA. Naturally it's our wing anti-ice that's been deferred. Time for a diversion. Off to PDX we go...after the obligatory ATC traffic delay and holding procedure.

There was more, but I'm too tired to type any more. I need to be up at 4:15a to catch my early flight home in the morning, followed by a full day of students.

That sounds positively relaxing at this point.
 
That's quite the couple of days you had there!

Ironically, another line Captain at a completely different company I talked at length with recently said the merger his company went through some time ago, completely trashed their training. (Trying not to name names here...)

He's typed in about six different Boeings and likes domestic so he's on the 73.

He said he actually misses the workouts like yours that the trainers used to give him.

He recently went to training and said he showed up and kids half his age had bid the training roles and when he showed up they ran a couple easy scenarios that were already hinted at in some online training they had to do prior, and then they literally said, "Is there anything else you'd like to do? We always learn more about the real airplane from you guys when you come here than we seem to teach."

It's almost sad, he said.

Only mention it because you'd probably miss it if things went that way where you are. I've go no dog in the fight either way, but it didn't sound like anyone was giving him anything challenging anymore. Some of that's experience, but the way he was talking, this is a lot deeper.

Again, no dog in the fight at all just sharing what he said. He thinks it's all related to a "retired Air Force" mentality that took over the training department. Whatever that means.
 
Shepherd said:
FO Jones, sir!
We are all going to show up for a flight some day.
With score cards.
"Lets she how the judges rate that takeoff: That's a good start, a 9.6 from Shep, 9.5 from Timbec. Ouch. That's going to hurt, An 8.7 from denverpilot. What do you think, mscard88?"
"Well flyingcheeshead, I think it's more sourgrapes than a comment on the takeoff." Let's see what happens with the landing."
"Right you are, mscard88. Let's go back to Ghery in the studio. Take it away Ghery."
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We'll return to the flight in a few minutes. In the meantime, let's take a look at what else is happening in the world of airlines. United has announced a new nonstop from LAX to SIN. 18+ hours gate to gate. That's a long time to be crammed in a coach seat, don't you think? FO Jones needn't worry, the equipment he flies doesn't have the legs for a trip like that.

Let's see how that landing went. Back to Shep for his feedback.
 
Greetings, fellow POAers. I've been remiss in posting but have kinda fallen into a sweet routine of bidding for great, high-credit trips to places I like to go, then filling my off days with students and an occasional law client! I currently am number 8 FO in MSP which means I pretty much get everything I want and have whatever days off I want/need. It's been awesome!

My plan was to hold off upgrading to Captain until next year, enjoying my sweet schedule thru the Holidays. But then ten CA slots were announced for November, with two classes available, 11/9 & 11/26. So I bid for the 26th on the theory that it will be after Thansgiving and I should be able to complete ground and sims before Christmas. Then there's usually a week or two wait for IOE which means I'd be sitting home for the holidays being paid at Captain rates!!

Well, surprise, surprise, yesterday I was awarded the 11/26 upgrade class!

I'm psyched and freaked at the same time. I'm finally feeling ready to slide over to the left seat and am excited to do so, but dread the idea of going back into an intense study grind. Fortunately, ground is only eight days and I have almost two months to review and get a jump on the materials. And I've been through it all before and actually kinda know the jet now! (Just over 1,700 hours in the CRJ, to date.)

So, wish me luck. Hopefully my Christmas present this year will be a Fourth Stripe and some scrambled eggs on the bill of my hat. Expect more updates through the process now that I have something new to share.

Loren
 
Loren, congratulations! Very happy to hear this.

I did have one question. I thought I recalled (perhaps incorrectly) that when you hired on that you expected to stay as an FO due to age restrictions on 121 ops. I assume that something changed (most likely the need for captains)? Just curious about the dynamics at play there.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Loren, congratulations! Very happy to hear this.

I did have one question. I thought I recalled (perhaps incorrectly) that when you hired on that you expected to stay as an FO due to age restrictions on 121 ops. I assume that something changed (most likely the need for captains)? Just curious about the dynamics at play there.
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Oh, no. I always intended to upgrade. I had hoped that it would come earlier this year but we opened DTW which became the junior base and they poured all new hires and upgrades into there. I had no interest in commuting to reserve so I stayed in the right seat.

The beauty of our seniority system is the only penalty for delaying an upgrade is the lost income. When you upgrade you slide in at your seniority even if many below you upgraded sooner. Once I upgrade I'll probably be close to holding a line (a defined flying schedule) rather than sitting reserve and taking the crumbs that fall your way on a minimum monthly guarantee.

My friend and study group partner was the first of our group to upgrade last January. He's one number ahead of me in MSP seniority. He's sat reserve for 7 months (commuting) and just got back to MSP in September and will hold a line in October, bidding 92%. If things keep moving by the time I start bidding in January I'll probably hold a line and be above 90%.

So, I definitely wanted to be a Captain, but without sacrificing my quality of life. Pretty selfish, eh?
 
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I'd have made the same choice for sure! Quality of life matters most! :yes:
 
First day of captain upgrade under my belt. A day focused on leadership and professionalism. Quite thought-provoking. I got 100% on the follow-up test, but would be quite surprised if anyone got less than that...it was pretty much a gimme if you paid any attention at all.

Also a sign of the times when a company with pretty devout religious roots (see Utah/SLC) starts a training class on a Sunday! That’s been unheard of in times past.

We’re the second class going through the new upgrade “footprint” which reduced upgrade ground school from eight days down to five days. In lieu of the three days of systems training they removed, they bumped the number of CBT modules from 30 to 55! For the last three weeks I’ve been glued to my computer every free hour going through these training modules. Most were about 1.5 hours to complete. It was grueling.

But it’s also been good. I’ve picked up on a lot of little systems details that I’ve either forgotten or never quite grasped three years ago. It helps to go through it after having spent 2.5 years actually flying the machine!

One of my study group members from initial training is also going through upgrade with me so I have a built-in study buddy plus sim partner. She’s a great kid and always fun to have around. Also met two young guys who are classmates on the flight out so we had an instant study group with the four of us. We’ve been hitting it hard from the start, which bodes well, I hope!

So, four more days of ground, then a Systems Validation test and a 700/900 Limitations test, then off to sims. I think we will learn our sim schedule tomorrow.

If you’re a person of faith, whisper a prayer for me!
 
Oh, with respect to seniority, my buddy who is just senior to me has moved from 97% in September to 75% in December. Two other friends who transferred back to MSP and are junior to me, both are holding lines in MSP. All that to say it looks like I’ll have a line and maybe one that’s halfway decent by the time I’m bidding in January for February flying. Seems like the timing is working out well.

Now just to get through the training!
 
You'll make it Loren. I was at ASA and the IPs there wanted to see us pass, were very accommodating, and open to additional one-on-one training if needed. I even had one IP that offered to come in on his day off to help me when I first went to the 200. I'm sure the SKYW training department is along the same lines. Of course the key is attitude, if you have a good one they'll bend over backwards to get you through. Enjoy it, you'll do fine.
 
Loren, do you feel like, “I decided I would retire so I could study my *** off...”, yet? LOL. Goood stuff. Makes me chuckle.
 
What a week! It's been surprisingly relaxed despite the intensity of the review. Probably because it is a review...not that much that's new, but taking everything to the next level of understanding. Our instructor's have been amazing. Our systems instructor has been a Captain on the CRJ for 19 years and knows it like the back of his hand. Talk about a wealth of knowledge. I've already added him to my phone as the go-to guy when I have a technical systems question. (Which he encouraged us to do, mind you!) Some pretty amazing stories were included along the way.

Our study group was focused and sharp, which made the evening study sessions pretty productive. Ended up with a 93% on the 100 question systems exam (Systems Validation). It should have been 95%. Somewhere between my brain and the mouse the cursor decided to pick a different answer than the one I THOUGHT I was clicking on a couple of questions. I hate when I do that! But I'll take the 93. Just happy to have that behind me.

A little relaxation tonight, then I'll hit it hard again practicing flows and callouts in preparation for the Procedures training Monday followed by the Procedures Validation (practical exam) on Tuesday.

So I've cleared a big hurdle, but have three more major events to go. I'll keep you posted.
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Congrats Loren, I knew you would make it, actually had no doubts. My cousin recently gave up his job at Generous Electric to go fly for PSA, he is FO now and flying on standby. Called him before Thanksgiving and he was lounging on a beech in Biloxi MS. Said it is great to not have to work any more.
 
Sounds good. But, even if I had the hours and ratings, I'm too old now. Being retired is great. Have fun!
 
LDJones said:
First day of captain upgrade under my belt. A day focused on leadership and professionalism. Quite thought-provoking.
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What, you mean slapping them upon the back of the head anytime they screw up is not considered 'leadership' ?

We’re the second class going through the new upgrade “footprint” which reduced upgrade ground school from eight days down to five days. In lieu of the three days of systems training they removed, they bumped the number of CBT modules from 30 to 55! For the last three weeks I’ve been glued to my computer every free hour going through these training modules. Most were about 1.5 hours to complete. It was grueling.
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Here is your patch:
1000_hrs_powerpoint.gif



If you’re a person of faith, whisper a prayer for me!
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You'll be fine. The peer group you'll be compared against are millenials ;-)

Glad to hear that you are still enjoying it. I am still waiting to hear your name called out on a flight that I am on, but recently Delta has moved most of my milk-run to A321 and MD90s.
 
weilke said:
What, you mean slapping them upon the back of the head anytime they screw up is not considered 'leadership' ?

Here is your patch:
View attachment 58220

You'll be fine. The peer group you'll be compared against are millenials ;-)

Glad to hear that you are still enjoying it. I am still waiting to hear your name called out on a flight that I am on, but recently Delta has moved most of my milk-run to A321 and MD90s.
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I definitely earned that patch!

Actually, I have to say I've been impressed by a few of my millennial classmates. They've been pretty sharp and came prepared. I think they'll do well. It will be interesting to see what I find once out on the line with the brand new ones in the right seat.
 
denverpilot said:
"Skywest allows you do to do outside flying? That's surprising"

I was headed there too...
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Been reading through this thread the past few days. Very good.

I was going to say @denverpilot (I realize this is two years ago from where I'm quoting so it may have changed more) but we have a flight school here in Atlanta that is owned by a couple of Delta pilots and do the instructing. They also have a Redbird sim there that Planesense uses to do evaluation. Apparently Delta doesn't mind either.
 
BrianNC said:
Been reading through this thread the past few days. Very good.

I was going to say @denverpilot (I realize this is two years ago from where I'm quoting so it may have changed more) but we have a flight school here in Atlanta that is owned by a couple of Delta pilots and do the instructing. They also have a Redbird sim there that Planesense uses to do evaluation. Apparently Delta doesn't mind either.
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Seems less prevalent an issue as in days long past. But thanks for the info.
 
@LDJones, I've just spent several days reading through this entire thread. I couldn't 'put it down'. Inspiring! I really appreciate (and I'm sure everybody here does) taking the time to relate your experience the past few years. This is just a classic thread. Since they've started hiring old folks like me, I'd really love to do it but with my low hours I just wouldn't have enough time to build hours and still have enough time to fly before having to retire at 65. If I would have heard about this just even two years ago (I've just recently discovered this 'shortage') when you started this thread I would have had the time to fly 2 or 3 years (one person told me that he knew someone just hired at 62 or 63, and they told him if they could get 18 months out of you they would hire you). I could come close to getting the hours needed and get hired, but I'd have to become an instructor and fly my tail off for the next year and a half and hope I could get 80-100 hours a month.

Keep the thread going for sure. It's an inspiration to many of us.
 
BrianNC said:
Been reading through this thread the past few days. Very good.

I was going to say @denverpilot (I realize this is two years ago from where I'm quoting so it may have changed more) but we have a flight school here in Atlanta that is owned by a couple of Delta pilots and do the instructing. They also have a Redbird sim there that Planesense uses to do evaluation. Apparently Delta doesn't mind either.
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You still have to get permission from your employer before flying for pay outside of 121 world. If those guys own the company and do stuff in the sim they aren't required to get the approval letter. Mine got denied when I was a new-hire at Delta even though the request was likely to be less than 100 hours a year. That was in 2015, so maybe times have changed - I understand the idea behind the rule; but like many good ideas-turned-regulations there are specific circumstances that are really apples and oranges but still end up covered by the reg.
 
Great narratives and glad it’s working for you. Lots of signs up around here at FBOs to hire replacement CFIs and IIs this last year because they’re all flocking to the airlines.
 
Dave Krall CFII said:
Great narratives and glad it’s working for you. Lots of signs up around here at FBOs to hire replacement CFIs and IIs this last year because they’re all flocking to the airlines.
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Yeah, it has really been a challenge for flight schools to staff their teaching ranks. It even hit my little school's maintenance. Our mechanic, and my good friend, has watched with a bit of envy my journey the last three years. We both did our ATP written tests in the same week to beat the deadline in 2014, then I helped finish up his ATP last year just before his written expired. We added his initial Flight Instructor this summer. He finally took the plunge, I put in a recommendation and he finished ground school last week and hit the sims yesterday. He's in his early to mid-50s.

He was awarded MSP so, hopefully, we will get to fly together early next year, if all goes well!
 
Great to see you posting about this again, I remember reading it and hanging on every word. Congratulations on upgrade.

Inspired in part by you writing this I took a run at the airlines myself. I did not end up going to Skywest but am finishing up my first year at PSA. Its been a great experience and very fun job.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday to you and your family.
 
jaybee said:
Great to see you posting about this again, I remember reading it and hanging on every word. Congratulations on upgrade.

Inspired in part by you writing this I took a run at the airlines myself. I did not end up going to Skywest but am finishing up my first year at PSA. Its been a great experience and very fun job.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday to you and your family.
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It's great to discover a thread like this a year or 2 into it. You can read it for several days without having to wait on new posts. Not so much after you catch up. lol.

I wish I had discovered this thread when it started though. I could have built my time over the last 2 years and applied to the regionals. Pretty much too late now.

And congrats on PSA!
 
BrianNC said:
@LDJones, I've just spent several days reading through this entire thread. I couldn't 'put it down'. Inspiring! I really appreciate (and I'm sure everybody here does) taking the time to relate your experience the past few years. This is just a classic thread. Since they've started hiring old folks like me, I'd really love to do it but with my low hours I just wouldn't have enough time to build hours and still have enough time to fly before having to retire at 65. If I would have heard about this just even two years ago (I've just recently discovered this 'shortage') when you started this thread I would have had the time to fly 2 or 3 years (one person told me that he knew someone just hired at 62 or 63, and they told him if they could get 18 months out of you they would hire you). I could come close to getting the hours needed and get hired, but I'd have to become an instructor and fly my tail off for the next year and a half and hope I could get 80-100 hours a month.

Keep the thread going for sure. It's an inspiration to many of us.
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Brian - I am in the same boat (or plane). I am too old to make the transition to the airlines but I am exploring options to do some part time flying. Do keep in mind there are other flying jobs out there beside the airlines. The strong pull from the airlines is opening up a lot of those "time building" jobs. I talked to an acquaintance that flys for a small cargo outfit and they are struggling to hold onto pilots. If you have any interest in flying for hire - even part time, keep working your way through your ratings.
 
Jim_CAK said:
Brian - I am in the same boat (or plane). I am too old to make the transition to the airlines but I am exploring options to do some part time flying. Do keep in mind there are other flying jobs out there beside the airlines. The strong pull from the airlines is opening up a lot of those "time building" jobs. I talked to an acquaintance that flys for a small cargo outfit and they are struggling to hold onto pilots. If you have any interest in flying for hire - even part time, keep working your way through your ratings.
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Thanks Jim. Exactly what I'm going to do.
 
jaybee said:
Great to see you posting about this again, I remember reading it and hanging on every word. Congratulations on upgrade.

Inspired in part by you writing this I took a run at the airlines myself. I did not end up going to Skywest but am finishing up my first year at PSA. Its been a great experience and very fun job.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday to you and your family.
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Congrats on the PSA gig! That’s terrific. Merry Christmas!
 
Update: Crossed the second hurdle with the Procedures Validation. We have about a dozen "flows", seven key ones for Captains, the longest one with around 80 things to do/test/check/verify, etc. You do the flows, then run the checklists. I really dislike the pressure of evaluation events! Things I can generally do in my sleep suddenly become a challenge under the scrutinizing gaze of a check airman. Having a pseudo-airplane in a make-believe situation doesn't make it any easier. But, that's part of the gig so you suck it up and push through.

On to Maneuvers training in real sim tomorrow. You have no idea how happy I'll be when this is all over!

Stay tuned.
 
LDJones said:
Update: Crossed the second hurdle with the Procedures Validation. We have about a dozen "flows", seven key ones for Captains, the longest one with around 80 things to do/test/check/verify, etc. You do the flows, then run the checklists. I really dislike the pressure of evaluation events! Things I can generally do in my sleep suddenly become a challenge under the scrutinizing gaze of a check airman. Having a pseudo-airplane in a make-believe situation doesn't make it any easier. But, that's part of the gig so you suck it up and push through.

On to Maneuvers training in real sim tomorrow. You have no idea how happy I'll be when this is all over!

Stay tuned.
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Holy Moses..!!! 80 items on a flow????
 
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