What's the future for Cirrus?

Henning

Henning

Taxi to Parking
Gone West
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
39,463
Location
Ft Lauderdale FL
Display Name
Display name:
iHenning
To keep from derailing the What's it like to fly a Cirrus thread, I thought I'd offer this up here.

I think the Diesel SR-22 is why Chinese bought both of the companies, so they can mass produce cheap models to create a GA infrastructure there for when needed in the service of natural disasters after seeing how it was applied after the Northridge quake.

It will be interesting to see if they adopt our model of private enterprise GA, or have communal model. Think about it. The state owns and maintains a large fleet of identical planes for national interest/disaster relief efforts. To offset the costs and assure a supply of pilots, they rent them out for personal use when not tasked to emergency duty. They would be letting communism be served by consumerism.

That my friends would be a workable model for 80% of GA. If we could walk up anywhere and rent an SR-22 and go where needed and drop it off there, the utility of GA would increase 100 fold. Mass production methods of providing 5000:1 person to plane coverage (our ratio of pilots in the population IIRC) in a market of nearly 2 billion counting China and the US alone is 400,000 copies. Now we are talking a market that allows a high scale of manufacturing efficiency. The 'one fleet' model also reduces the costs of operating and maintaining that fleet (like Southwest Airlines figured out, one of the reasons behind their success). With this model, costs become comparable with automobiles.

This is kind of the model the Henry Ford was working with on the Model T. He envisioned it being the only car necessary and adamantly held that position not offering another model for 18 years and only begrudgingly relented to produce the Model A.
 
Last edited:
I've talked to people that lived behind the curtain, it is interesting that the gov paid for hobby car racing, skydiving, glider flying, etc. No idea what kind of hoops you had to jump through but hobby stuff was free.
Amazing those dirty, evil commies paying for people to have fun. Bet they will build a nationwide network of free airports or something.:lol: And gov't provided courtesy cars.:yes::D
 
Yes, those commies are amazing, 100 million plus dead and counting...:rolleyes:
 
ClimbnSink said:
I've talked to people that lived behind the curtain, it is interesting that the gov paid for hobby car racing, skydiving, glider flying, etc. No idea what kind of hoops you had to jump through but hobby stuff was free.
Amazing those dirty, evil commies paying for people to have fun. Bet they will build a nationwide network of free airports or something.:lol: And gov't provided courtesy cars.:yes::D
Click to expand...

Communism is not what the propaganda you were taught says. You got perks for what you did. Factory workers who came up with a suggestion that boosted efficiency or production, these things are used as their rewards among other things. If you showed capability at something, the state would take advantage of that and reward it.
 
Last edited:
PaulS said:
Yes, those commies are amazing, 100 million plus dead and counting...:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Don't confuse the social application with the social system. It's like blaming guns for killing and planes for crashing. How well something works is in how it is applied. They tried to apply a new construct for society that took into account the manufacturing efficiencies that technology had brought us, a construct of social evolution to match with our technical evolution. The thing the early adaptations is that the modern technological era was still a toddler in the west, and the countries that applied it did not yet have that level of technological advantage. This was compounded by the decision to use force to quell dissent. You can't force people to do the right thing, they have to decide to. The Chinese saw the problem the Soviets had and decided on re-education camps.

The dead wrought in the name of capitalism far exceed 100,000,000.
 
Gary F said:
Really? How did you arrive at that number?
Click to expand...

He probably doesn't mean domestically. As a function of the extension of capitalist regimes' foreign policies though? It's quite easy to arrive at that mark and beyond. I don't think there's a need for an American to feel personally fronted by that assertion though. Domestically, it's probably safe to say more authoritarian versions of communal regimes have been more bloody.

Our system of economic slavery is genius though, we make it just comfortable enough so the disenfranchised majority doesn't get too angry. As others have suggested in other threads before, had TV and cheap telecommunication technology not been available to the idiot American proletariat to the degree we have it available, the capital owner class of the Country would be in a world of hurt. They couldn't bank on the level of appeasement necessary to enjoy the spoils of this Country without fearing for their safety in the process. To a cynical degree, our beer and circuses are a necessary evil in the effort to secure our National Security. Likewise, conspicuous consumption is a requisite for the solvency of our economic construct even when we recognize the inherent damaging nature of beer, circuses and exponential consumption in their own right.

break break---

As to Cirrus and a rent-a-car model across the Country? I'd be cool with something like that, but it would have to have the same level of convenience as my current dispatchability with my sole-owned airplane. Merely having fractional access to a better/faster gee-whiz airplane I can't afford to sole-own is not good enough reason for me to give up dispatchability and exclusivity of use for it. That just becomes another crappy rental agreement that doesn't fit my needs.
 
hindsight2020 said:
He probably doesn't mean domestically. As a function of the extension of capitalist regimes' foreign policies though? It's quite easy to arrive at that mark and beyond. I don't think there's a need for an American to feel personally fronted by that assertion though. Domestically, it's probably safe to say more authoritarian versions of communal regimes have been more bloody.
Click to expand...
Good. Then you will have no trouble providing a detailed accounting of how that number was derived.
hindsight2020 said:
Our system of economic slavery is genius though, we make it just comfortable enough so the disenfranchised majority doesn't get too angry. As others have suggested in other threads before, had TV and cheap telecommunication technology not been available to the idiot American proletariat to the degree we have it available, the capital owner class of the Country would be in a world of hurt. They couldn't bank on the level of appeasement necessary to enjoy the spoils of this Country without fearing for their safety in the process. To a cynical degree, our beer and circuses are a necessary evil in the effort to secure our National Security. Likewise, conspicuous consumption is a requisite for the solvency of our economic construct even when we recognize the inherent damaging nature of beer, circuses and exponential consumption in their own right.

break break---

As to Cirrus and a rent-a-car model across the Country? I'd be cool with something like that, but it would have to have the same level of convenience as my current dispatchability with my sole-owned airplane. Merely having fractional access to a better/faster gee-whiz airplane I can't afford to sole-own is not good enough reason for me to give up dispatchability and exclusivity of use for it. That just becomes another crappy rental agreement that doesn't fit my needs.
Click to expand...
The SR22 is a fairly high performance aircraft that does not forgive sub par airmanship. Maybe they should also have a fleet of more docile aircraft like 172s or Diamond DA40s so pilots can develop the requisite skill to fly Cirrus aircraft safely.
 
hindsight2020 said:
He probably doesn't mean domestically. As a function of the extension of capitalist regimes' foreign policies though? It's quite easy to arrive at that mark and beyond. I don't think there's a need for an American to feel personally fronted by that assertion though. Domestically, it's probably safe to say more authoritarian versions of communal regimes have been more bloody.

Our system of economic slavery is genius though, we make it just comfortable enough so the disenfranchised majority doesn't get too angry. As others have suggested in other threads before, had TV and cheap telecommunication technology not been available to the idiot American proletariat to the degree we have it available, the capital owner class of the Country would be in a world of hurt. They couldn't bank on the level of appeasement necessary to enjoy the spoils of this Country without fearing for their safety in the process. To a cynical degree, our beer and circuses are a necessary evil in the effort to secure our National Security. Likewise, conspicuous consumption is a requisite for the solvency of our economic construct even when we recognize the inherent damaging nature of beer, circuses and exponential consumption in their own right.

break break---

As to Cirrus and a rent-a-car model across the Country? I'd be cool with something like that, but it would have to have the same level of convenience as my current dispatchability with my sole-owned airplane. Merely having fractional access to a better/faster gee-whiz airplane I can't afford to sole-own is not good enough reason for me to give up dispatchability and exclusivity of use for it. That just becomes another crappy rental agreement that doesn't fit my needs.
Click to expand...

Interesting, why is the majority disenfranchised?
 
hindsight2020 said:
He probably doesn't mean domestically. As a function of the extension of capitalist regimes' foreign policies though? It's quite easy to arrive at that mark and beyond. I don't think there's a need for an American to feel personally fronted by that assertion though. Domestically, it's probably safe to say more authoritarian versions of communal regimes have been more bloody.

Our system of economic slavery is genius though, we make it just comfortable enough so the disenfranchised majority doesn't get too angry. As others have suggested in other threads before, had TV and cheap telecommunication technology not been available to the idiot American proletariat to the degree we have it available, the capital owner class of the Country would be in a world of hurt. They couldn't bank on the level of appeasement necessary to enjoy the spoils of this Country without fearing for their safety in the process. To a cynical degree, our beer and circuses are a necessary evil in the effort to secure our National Security. Likewise, conspicuous consumption is a requisite for the solvency of our economic construct even when we recognize the inherent damaging nature of beer, circuses and exponential consumption in their own right.

break break---

As to Cirrus and a rent-a-car model across the Country? I'd be cool with something like that, but it would have to have the same level of convenience as my current dispatchability with my sole-owned airplane. Merely having fractional access to a better/faster gee-whiz airplane I can't afford to sole-own is not good enough reason for me to give up dispatchability and exclusivity of use for it. That just becomes another crappy rental agreement that doesn't fit my needs.
Click to expand...

Nope, this is like booking a rent a car level of service. Show up and it's ready to go. One way rates available. The one way ability is what opens up the practicality of GA.
 
Henning said:
It's the cause of every war for a few thousand years.
Click to expand...

First of all learn the definition of capitalism....not what your "idea" of it is.

Once you figure that out...you will see how silly your statement is.
 
The topic on Cirrus's future derailed by the doom and gloom on this board again. So many people disgruntled with America.. No one ever said you have to stay here. It is free to come and go.... go and try that as a Chinese factory worker....
 
TEFLONSEAN said:
First of all learn the definition of capitalism....not what your "idea" of it is.

Once you figure that out...you will see how silly your statement is.
Click to expand...


Don't confuse iHenning with facts, he gets on a roll and just spews down with Capitalism, etc... all the time....
 
Dear baby Jesus please tell me there is a way to ignore users of my choice...if not I would gladly chip in for the programming costs. It would truly be a holiday miracle if I could do that.
 
Welcome to 2014 folks. We now live in a global world. I pray that we will accept this fact, give up thinking we run the world and realize we compete with countries that wisely value education more than we do. Let us accept this New Order and focus how we can best function in it.

Without the Chinese, Cirrus would be dead. Like it or not, China is our peer. Let's deal with it and refrain from thinking we solve anything by using terms like "commies".
 
tlrussell said:
Dear baby Jesus please tell me there is a way to ignore users of my choice...if not I would gladly chip in for the programming costs. It would truly be a holiday miracle if I could do that.
Click to expand...
Click on their name, click "view public profile", click "user lists", click "add to ignore list". Not that straightforward but doable. It doesn't block posts which are quoted, however.
 
VWGhiaBob said:
Welcome to 2014 folks. We now live in a global world. I pray that we will accept this fact, give up thinking we run the world and realize we compete with countries that wisely value education more than we do. Let us accept this New Order and focus how we can best function in it.

Without the Chinese, Cirrus would be dead. Like it or not, China is our peer. Let's deal with it and refrain from thinking we solve anything by using terms like "commies".
Click to expand...

They, China, are communist, so "commie" is an accurate description of them. And I beg to differ that their government is anywhere near a peer to ours, they actively oppress and jail their opposition. While Obama has oppressed his political adversaries thru the IRS, our government is nowhere near as bad.
 
If you want to ignore the whole thread, go to the line above the first post on the page, click "thread tools", "ignore thread".
 
Note to the posters on Tapatalk who can't tell. This is not a SZ thread, yet.
 
Cirrus has the best piston aircraft, not much more market to go after and organic growth is perhaps a negative. Diesel and jet A is the next big announcement, probably on the G5 since they now have the useful to make it work. That opens up the world and brings buyers because of fuel cost alone. That will give them the killer app as far as Pistons. Then all of the foreseeable ongoing efforts will be focused on generations of the Jet. More margin, proven demand, etc.

My .02
 
Henning said:
Communism is not what the propaganda you were taught says.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter what someone says communism is or how it is 'supposed' to work. It doesn't work in practice, all attempts at it were dismal failures. I can design something beautiful on paper which will have no chance to succeed in practice. Communism = fascism though color happens to be different.
 
Last edited:
Oh, I disagree, communism works very well for the elite class! :D It works exactly as it's designed, to keep the powerful in power and their friends living in luxury by squashing anyone who disagrees. :nono:
Now, it certainly doesn't work from a peasant point of view, but they don't matter as they have no say so! :rolleyes2:
olasek said:
It doesn't matter what someone says communism is or how it is 'supposed' to work. It doesn't work in practice, all attempts at it were dismal failures. I can design something beautiful on paper which will have no chance to succeed in practice. Communism = fascism though color happens to be different.
Click to expand...
 
Places where communism would have worked were sabotaged by bankers and spooks. You do need a white homogeneous population. Diversity = culture war, no room for anything to function in a diverse and non segregated society. Murica is toast.
 
jmp470 said:
The topic on Cirrus's future derailed by the doom and gloom on this board again. So many people disgruntled with America.. No one ever said you have to stay here. It is free to come and go.... go and try that as a Chinese factory worker....
Click to expand...

I very much agree with this notion. I had the "privilege" of being born in Eastern Europe. Through my grandfather’s fascination and appreciation of America he managed to migrate to the US during the early 80's. Several years later my father followed and eventually through their combined efforts I have joined them with the rest of my immediate family soon before the fall of communism in Eastern Europe.

I am very thankful for their efforts. I spent my childhood under communist rule, which was relatively mild in comparison to what was happening further east and south of our borders. I have vivid memories of genuine struggles that were inflicted by the regime on the populous. A book can be written even from my experience, which is very limited due to my young age at the time. In fact many books are on the shelfs that clearly discuss the subject, yet many misguided souls fail to understand the perils of socialist and communist ideologies and embrace them degrading America and its exceptionalism.

I will add that throughout out history there have been times where American interests have led to conflicts, war and loss of life, however I firmly believe that the founding of America has brought much more prosperity then grief to the world. I am sure some of you will criticize what I have said but keep one thing in mind, "they" will never stop undermining, infiltrating and stealing from those who produce until there is no more to plunder.... Have a wonderful ThanksGiving to all of you, and be Thankful for what you have!

Oh, and one last thing, if you don't like how things operate here, you are free to go elsewhere. Otherwise respect what has commenced here 238 years ago and don't try to change it.
 
Wait am I supposed to vote for what I think is right or not try to change anything? Hilarious. I vote we don't change anything starting pre women's right to vote.
 
Henning said:
Communism is not what the propaganda you were taught says. You got perks for what you did. Factory workers who came up with a suggestion that boosted efficiency or production, these things are used as their rewards among other things. If you showed capability at something, the state would take advantage of that and reward it.
Click to expand...

When was production efficiency ever a priority in the former Soviet Union? :dunno:
 
inactive15 said:
I very much agree with this notion. I had the "privilege" of being born in Eastern Europe. Through my grandfather’s fascination and appreciation of America he managed to migrate to the US during the early 80's. Several years later my father followed and eventually through their combined efforts I have joined them with the rest of my immediate family soon before the fall of communism in Eastern Europe.

I am very thankful for their efforts. I spent my childhood under communist rule, which was relatively mild in comparison to what was happening further east and south of our borders. I have vivid memories of genuine struggles that were inflicted by the regime on the populous. A book can be written even from my experience, which is very limited due to my young age at the time. In fact many books are on the shelfs that clearly discuss the subject, yet many misguided souls fail to understand the perils of socialist and communist ideologies and embrace them degrading America and its exceptionalism.

I will add that throughout out history there have been times where American interests have led to conflicts, war and loss of life, however I firmly believe that the founding of America has brought much more prosperity then grief to the world. I am sure some of you will criticize what I have said but keep one thing in mind, "they" will never stop undermining, infiltrating and stealing from those who produce until there is no more to plunder.... Have a wonderful ThanksGiving to all of you, and be Thankful for what you have!

Oh, and one last thing, if you don't like how things operate here, you are free to go elsewhere. Otherwise respect what has commenced here 238 years ago and don't try to change it.
Click to expand...

Nothing like a clear outside perspective to combat the self-loathing Left viewpoint so often expressed here. Thanks for sharing. Happy Thanksgiving.
 
ClimbnSink said:
Wait am I supposed to vThe ote for what I think is right or not try to change anything? Hilarious. I vote we don't change anything starting pre women's right to vote.
Click to expand...

I'd say anytime pre-1960 with the exception of accelerating the Civil Rights movement by 50 or more years. This would eliminate the damage done by the Warren Court and Johnson's War on Poverty that decimated the Black families.

Women voting is just fine.
 
Henning said:
It's the cause of every war for a few thousand years.
Click to expand...

I have to ask, in all seriousness, why do you live in this country? You seem to hate capitalism and our political system, you rail against our domestic industries. You praise socialism and other countries. You've probably seen most of the world, and considering your feelings about greed, I know you don't stay out of pecuniary self interest, so is there no where in the world that you dislike less than America?
 
inactive15 said:
I had the "privilege" of being born in Eastern Europe. .... I spent my childhood under communist rule, which was relatively mild in comparison to what was happening further east and south of our borders. .... I have vivid memories of genuine struggles that were inflicted by the regime on the populous.
Click to expand...
Though I suspect I belong to slightly different generation the above describes me too, perhaps we could compare notes.....
 
olasek said:
It doesn't matter what someone says communism is or how it is 'supposed' to work. It doesn't work in practice, all attempts at it were dismal failures. I can design something beautiful on paper which will have no chance to succeed in practice. Communism = fascism though color happens to be different.
Click to expand...

Of course it didn't, we have not yet evolved into thinking communally yet so a system based on community cannot possibly work. The only problem with Communism is the human factor. We still believe there is an "Us and Them", we have failed to adopt the "We", that we are all bound together. Christ tried to teach it, but it didn't stick because the proof was unavailable. Luckily science hasn't quit developing the proof yet, so we have a chance.
 
Henning said:
The only problem with Communism is the human factor.
Click to expand...
Yeah, it is a bit like saying the only problem with building a true Perpetuum mobile are the Laws of Physics.
 
Last edited:
I had the great good fortune of spending some time in East Berlin during the 80s. That experience proved to me that socialism is both evil and unworkable.

Try imagine an economic system that could make an entire country of Germans both poor and living in filth!

Cars with two stroke motors and paper bodies! And those only for the top 5%!

Crappy binoculars that would embarrass a Chinese toy maker! That's socialism for you!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top