What will you tell the census taker?

I will welcome the census taker with courtesy. I will tell him or her how many persons reside in this household, and their ages. Full Stop. I will NOT provide income information, household information, racial information, or any other personal information. It is likely to be a short visit. So, sue me.
 
Apparently it's invasive according to that guy's video. I looked up the form on the census website and all I got was a short form of 10 questions that weren't overly invasive.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/PDF/2010_English.pdf
Are there more questions they get from some other form?

Just curious, that's all.

FWIW, I won't be on the census. I'm a Nomad with absolutely no address whatsoever other than my license plate number. They don't count us because we're unfindable and extremely mobile. Here today, somewhere else tomorrow, gone the day after. Just a vehicle on the road.
 
fgcason said:
Apparently it's invasive according to that guy's video. I looked up the form on the census website and all I got was a short form of 10 questions that weren't overly invasive.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/PDF/2010_English.pdf
Are there more questions they get from some other form?

Just curious, that's all.

FWIW, I won't be on the census. I'm a Nomad with absolutely no address whatsoever other than my license plate number. They don't count us because we're unfindable and extremely mobile. Here today, somewhere else tomorrow, gone the day after. Just a vehicle on the road.
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There are multiple forms. There is the short form that everyone is supposed to get. Then a more detailed form that a (presumably) random portion of respondents are then asked to fill out. The short form has changed a bit over the years. For example, they used to ask how many free white persons, free colored persons, and slaves, broken down by age and gender, and the name of the head of household. They also asked for occupation (mining; agriculture; commerce; manufacture and trade; navigation of the ocean; navigation of canals, lakes, and rivers; and learned professional engineers). They also asked for the number and name of pensioners for the revolutionary war, number of deaf, dumb, blind, and insane persons, segmented by color, age, and infirmity. This was, of course, the 1840 census.
 
fgcason said:
Apparently it's invasive according to that guy's video. I looked up the form on the census website and all I got was a short form of 10 questions that weren't overly invasive.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/PDF/2010_English.pdf
Are there more questions they get from some other form?

Just curious, that's all.

FWIW, I won't be on the census. I'm a Nomad with absolutely no address whatsoever other than my license plate number. They don't count us because we're unfindable and extremely mobile. Here today, somewhere else tomorrow, gone the day after. Just a vehicle on the road.
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Actually, they will count you based on your local as of a specific date. Of course, it's a rather arbitrary locale, and they need to be able to get you the form. But you should certainly count.

From the FAQ link on the site previously posted:
At the Census Bureau we understand that these can be challenging times for many people. Because of this, we created the Service Based Enumeration (SBE) operation. The SBE is designed to provide an opportunity for people experiencing some form of displacement or lack of permanent address to be included in the census, by counting them at service-based locations, such as homeless shelters, soup kitchens, etc. The Be Counted form is another way people can take part in the census. Be Counted forms are census forms that are available at various community locations for use by people who either did not receive a census form in the mail or who believe they were not otherwise included on any other census form.
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Emphasis mine. Clearly, they're not thinking of the mobile group you're part of, but you can still be counted.
 
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Last time in the blank marked "Race" I wrote "Human". Never heard a word from them.
 
I limit my response to number of folks in the house.

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I am really steamed about the ads they have been running on television and radio lately - you know, the ones where they admonish you to answer the census so they can know how many kids will be where and your community will be able to get enough money to pay for the schools it needs?

Hel-LO! Don't take the money to Washington, we won't need to kiss ass to get it back to the states, from where it should not have been taken in the freakin' first place.
 
SCCutler said:
I limit my response to number of folks in the house.

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I am really steamed about the ads they have been running on television and radio lately - you know, the ones where they admonish you to answer the census so they can know how many kids will be where and your community will be able to get enough money to pay for the schools it needs?

Hel-LO! Don't take the money to Washington, we won't need to kiss ass to get it back to the states, from where it should not have been taken in the freakin' first place.
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All that really accomplishes is that when local government does not get the money they expect form Washington for programs, is to make them spend local cash on a more accurate 'special census' to prove the federal one was not accurate. I think that no matter what happens with this census now that will happen. There has already been enough complaining about it that no one trusts the outcome. So in the end it will be a big waste of money but mostly because the Americans have all ready predetermined it to be a big waste of money and are sabotaging it. Sometimes we are own own worst enemies. SIGH!

Oh and all I planned to tell them was how many, ages and race.
 
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According to wikiP there is only the short form this year
Also a search for long form, 2010 was unrewarded.

"The Census Bureau will no longer use a long form for the 2010 Census. In previous censuses, one in six households received this more detailed form asking for detailed social and economic information.[citation needed] The 2010 Census will use only a short-form asking basic questions, such as name, gender, age, date of birth, race, ethnicity, relationship, and housing tenure.[2]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_United_States_Census
 
It went over my right shoulder into the circular file as will any other letters...

denny-o
 
SCCutler said:
I limit my response to number of folks in the house.

---

I am really steamed about the ads they have been running on television and radio lately - you know, the ones where they admonish you to answer the census so they can know how many kids will be where and your community will be able to get enough money to pay for the schools it needs?

Hel-LO! Don't take the money to Washington, we won't need to kiss ass to get it back to the states, from where it should not have been taken in the freakin' first place.
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I agree with you 100%
 
In my opinion holding information from a Census taker to deprive the government of information they are not entitled too is a terribly naive understanding of the modern information network.

Just as thinking a robots.txt file prevents your site from being indexed ...

Your income, liabilities, MLB medical data, phone traffic, every byte on the internet are already very efficiently databased. The Census is like Churchill letting Conventry be bombed*

It is an innefficient economic stimulus/hiring program and a thin smokescreen. Nothing more. Your mailman already knows the answers so why send an army of Census takers around?

* Note: The Conventry analogy is a poor one, probably betrays my affinity for conspiracy theories and for the record, I believe the story is apocryphal.
 
As we all know, after the 2000 census, the goverment went out and collected all the guns, arrested the illegals and sent delinquent tax bills to all the respondents who entered an income higher than that on on their tax return in the survey.

I'm not that old, but the questions about the census are the same, every time. They are not asking for anything they don't already know, it is the standardized format that makes the information valuable.

But that's ok. For every conservative who is worried about the goverment knowing too much, there are a couple of minorities who listen to their pastor and refuse to answer based on a different set of irrational fears. Net-net they cancel each other out ;)
 
weilke said:
As we all know, after the 2000 census, the goverment went out and collected all the guns, arrested the illegals and sent delinquent tax bills to all the respondents who entered an income higher than that on on their tax return in the survey.

I'm not that old, but the questions about the census are the same, every time. They are not asking for anything they don't already know, it is the standardized format that makes the information valuable.

But that's ok. For every conservative who is worried about the goverment knowing too much, there are a couple of minorities who listen to their pastor and refuse to answer based on a different set of irrational fears. Net-net they cancel each other out ;)
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Same rabble-rabble every census. At least the arm-wavers aren't organizing burnings of the Statistical Abstract of the United States yet...


Trapper John
 
I will probably tell them whatever they want to know. I really don't have anything to hide, and as far as "personal" information, I don't have much of that either. I don't care if they know how much money I make, I've already told them that, and I'll them again for the census. There isn't much in my life that is a secret.
 
weilke said:
As we all know, after the 2000 census, the goverment went out and collected all the guns, arrested the illegals and sent delinquent tax bills to all the respondents who entered an income higher than that on on their tax return in the survey.

I'm not that old, but the questions about the census are the same, every time. They are not asking for anything they don't already know, it is the standardized format that makes the information valuable.

But that's ok. For every conservative who is worried about the goverment knowing too much, there are a couple of minorities who listen to their pastor and refuse to answer based on a different set of irrational fears. Net-net they cancel each other out ;)
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+1, happens every ten years.

The thing that I find that most amusing this time is that the government, thanks to the US PATRIOT ACT is already data mining significant information about citizens. But hardly anyone is complaining about those laws. It is the census that is bad
 
weilke said:
As we all know, after the 2000 census, the goverment went out and collected all the guns, arrested the illegals and sent delinquent tax bills to all the respondents who entered an income higher than that on on their tax return in the survey.

I'm not that old, but the questions about the census are the same, every time. They are not asking for anything they don't already know, it is the standardized format that makes the information valuable.

But that's ok. For every conservative who is worried about the goverment knowing too much, there are a couple of minorities who listen to their pastor and refuse to answer based on a different set of irrational fears. Net-net they cancel each other out ;)
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That's exactly how I look at it. The government already knows everything it's asking, but only in a "left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing" kind of way.

The census just puts it all in one place. The government could do that now with the information it has, but it would take a lot of money.

Do I like that the government has all of that information already? Not particularly; I am, however, not going to be doing anything about it - there's skiing to be done today, and tomorrow I have to go to work.
 
When the census taker came to our house we knew him. So Kevin invited him in, shared tea/coffee, yacked in general and answered how many in the house, ages and race (the man already knew that stuff anyway) but didn't answer regarding income or the other stuff he asked. I was glad that I wasn't here.
 
I'll tell them whatever they want to know. THe vast majority is already known to the government, a fact to which others have alluded. I just think that the government can better serve its population if it has quantitative data on who the population is.
 
Paranoid rantings. Names, ages, and race of individuals is okay but income information isn't? Income information that the IRS already knows about?

Next thing you know we'll hear people on PoA talking about the FEMA camps that Obama has setup for the re-education of conservatives.

:rofl:
 
Well, when I was younger, it was simplier. Now that I have thirteen business entities and assets in several different places, not so easy. The IRS is restricted by law from sharing my tax information. The Census Bureau says they won't share it. Have you seen any Gov'ment data bases compromised? And, why is my income the Census Bureau's business?

My income is highly complex. Divulging my income was X,XXX,XXX would be misleading because it comes from partnership interests that I have obligations against them. So, although I have a large income, I pay most to a lender until that lender is paid off. It would be highly misleading without knowing the entire picture and I'm not going into that.

My neighbors have no idea what my income and assets are and I intend for it to stay that way. There are a lot of other invasive questions on those forms: who owns each house; who lives in each one, etc. None of their business.

Last time I gave information to local government they immediately turned it over to city and state tax authorities. I was immediately charge tax and fined on my personal aircraft. It took time, professional fees and frustration to finally show it's not a business aircraft. No more sharing information to which the busy bodies aren't entitled without a cite as to why they are entitled and maybe a fight.

Best,

Dave
 
wbarnhill said:
Paranoid rantings. Names, ages, and race of individuals is okay but income information isn't? Income information that the IRS already knows about?
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Does the census form define "income"? Is the definition clear wrt
incoming being taxable income? or is it gross income? or is it
net income? and if the definition of incoming is ambiguous, then
what's the point of asking?

What about "race"?
 
I vigorously object to any governmental program which attempts to shape policy around the reallocation of wealth from one state to another, including the profoundly ridiculous practice of federal funding for schools. I further object to responding to any questions relating to race; government has no business possessing this information.
 
SCCutler said:
I am really steamed about the ads they have been running on television and radio lately - you know, the ones where they admonish you to answer the census so they can know how many kids will be where and your community will be able to get enough money to pay for the schools it needs?

Hel-LO! Don't take the money to Washington, we won't need to kiss ass to get it back to the states, from where it should not have been taken in the freakin' first place.
Click to expand...

+1. Fill out the form so you can say "gimme, gimme, gimme."
 
wbarnhill said:
Paranoid rantings. Names, ages, and race of individuals is okay but income information isn't? Income information that the IRS already knows about?

Next thing you know we'll hear people on PoA talking about the FEMA camps that Obama has setup for the re-education of conservatives.

:rofl:
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Speaking just for me, the income info is just too personal to reveal to an unknown person. The conspiracy theorist in me is concerned that said person may use the knowledge of my income to make assumptions about assets inside the abode.
 
SCCutler said:
I vigorously object to any governmental program which attempts to shape policy around the reallocation of wealth from one state to another, including the profoundly ridiculous practice of federal funding for schools. I further object to responding to any questions relating to race; government has no business possessing this information.
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AMEN!!!
 
smigaldi said:
All that really accomplishes is that when local government does not get the money they expect form Washington for programs, is to make them spend local cash on a more accurate 'special census' to prove the federal one was not accurate. I think that no matter what happens with this census now that will happen. There has already been enough complaining about it that no one trusts the outcome. So in the end it will be a big waste of money but mostly because the Americans have all ready predetermined it to be a big waste of money and are sabotaging it. Sometimes we are own own worst enemies. SIGH!

Oh and all I planned to tell them was how many, ages and race.
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I don't think it's a waste of time, as it is necessary for the allocation of representation among the states. However, the social engineering questions are what is most troublesome to many people.
 
Here's a link to what I refer to as the long form (American Community Survey).
http://tinyurl.com/ygqobfo

It's also quite time consuming. I read this last year when it was sent to me. There were several issues on here I was not comfortable addressing. On income, I just gave an amount over xxx.

Best,

Dave
 
FWIW, I found census data extremely helpful when doing family geneaology work. The details don't become available for 70 years after the census is taken, and while the ones I researched didn't have income info, information about names, ages, race, occupation etc. helped me find my great-grandfather and his family, and his father's family, when none of my living relatives would have had any idea.

On the subject of race; I'm not always keen on filling it out, but I have fun when I do. Had to designate race on a form one time for a medical test; the condition is more prevalent in some races than others. When I got to the section where I had to provide this information, I thought... thought some more...... then asked the lab tech, quite honestly:

"how many can I check?"

She said; "choose whatever is most comfortable".

My response: "how far back do you want to go?" (that family history gets complicated...)

She didn't quite know how to respond to that one...... of the six they had listed, I checked two, and wrote in a third one on the freetext line (yeah, they missed one).

Left it up to them to decide how they wanted to classify; they asked the question :)
 
nddons said:
However, the social engineering questions are what is most troublesome to many people.
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What kind of social engineering questions do they ask?

Last time I think I got the long form. I remember puzzling over what to call the person who lived in the same house with me at that time. I don't remember what I answered.

I don't have any problem answering about my income. The government already knows that and so do a lot of other people.

My race is easy to guess and I get a kick out of probably being the only one of my kind in the county. :D
 
See my post above for a link to the form. It's all there. If you get the short for, it's pretty simple. The long form goes into a lot to allocate government funds.

BTY, as with almost all government forms, these seem to be growing this year. Uncle expects to spend up to $18 billion to perform the Census this year. The cost seems to double each decade. They send a worker to a home that doesn't respond six times. IMO, they need to rethink what is being done.

Best,

Dave
 
Dave Siciliano said:
See my post above for a link to the form. It's all there. If you get the short for, it's pretty simple. The long form goes into a lot to allocate government funds.

BTY, as with almost all government forms, these seem to be growing this year. Uncle expects to spend up to $18 billion to perform the Census this year. The cost seems to double each decade. They send a worker to a home that doesn't respond six times. IMO, they need to rethink what is being done.

Best,

Dave
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That's kind of mind-boggling when you figure, at most, there will be what, ~300 million census forms sent in?

Even assuming that large number, that's $60/form. Granted, there are obviously a lot of expenses beyond merely receiving/reviewing/processing/whatevering the form, but still....
 
I went back and checked the figure again an it's $14 billion; sorry. The largest cost seems to be in sending folks back to houses that didn't return the form. Also, they keep expanding what they do. Now, there is television advertising and they are trying to find folks that have moved, are homeless or not citizens. I'm not as well read on this as I would need to be to make well-researched points. But, this is emplematic of how governmental spending just keeps increasing. They just have to have more of everything. In the private sector, there is a point that can't be continued and folks settle for less.

Best,

Dave
 
Dave Siciliano said:
I went back and checked the figure again an it's $14 billion; sorry. The largest cost seems to be in sending folks back to houses that didn't return the form. Also, they keep expanding what they do. Now, there is television advertising and they are trying to find folks that have moved, are homeless or not citizens. I'm not as well read on this as I would need to be to make well-researched points. But, this is emplematic of how governmental spending just keeps increasing. They just have to have more of everything. In the private sector, there is a point that can't be continued and folks settle for less.

Best,

Dave
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Knock it down to $46.67/form. :)
 
Everskyward said:
What kind of social engineering questions do they ask?

Last time I think I got the long form. I remember puzzling over what to call the person who lived in the same house with me at that time. I don't remember what I answered.

I don't have any problem answering about my income. The government already knows that and so do a lot of other people.

My race is easy to guess and I get a kick out of probably being the only one of my kind in the county. :D
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Pretty much any question beyond "how many people live in this abode?" Race, income, ages, sex, etc. (See Dave's link for the American Community Survey) all are irrelevant to the underlying Constitutional purpose of the census, yet none are asked simply because it's "good to know." They are asked because some government agency or branch of government wishes to use that information for some purpose.

When you look at the incentives, disincentives, penalties, and inducements used by the government to shape behavior, it's not surprising that government wants to scoop up as much intelligence as possible come census time. While I want to keep this out of the SZ, I believe moving the Census from the Commerce Department to the White House really seems to inject politics into the process, increasing my distrust in the process and results.
 
Obi Heed Kenobi said:
Knock it down to $46.67/form. :)
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$4 of that are spent to process the 90% of forms that are turned in without questions. $44 is the expense to track down the 10% pathologically suspicious :D
 
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