What difference in Pitts models?

flhrci

flhrci

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David
So, I was dreaming on trade-a-plane again, :mad2:

and was wondering what the difference is between the S-1 and other similar Pitts bi-planes are?

Thanks,

David
 
Wickipeda has a nice summary of the various Pitts models.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitts_Special

Christen Eagles have some nice features, but don't seem to do as well at hard core aerobatics

Skybolts are much bigger.

Hyperbipe is an interesting alternative.

Looking for one or two place?
 
Here are some good resources for you to review.

All things Pitts: www.airbum.com
To quote Budd: "There are two types of airplanes. Pitts and everything else."

A very active and knowledgeable biplane community: www.biplaneforum.com
All your answers will be found there about all types of biplanes.
 
Smutny said:
Here are some good resources for you to review.

All things Pitts: www.airbum.com
To quote Budd: "There are two types of airplanes. Pitts and everything else."

A very active and knowledgeable biplane community: www.biplaneforum.com
All your answers will be found there about all types of biplanes.
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Will check those out.

Thanks much.

David
 
flhrci said:
So, I was dreaming on trade-a-plane again, :mad2:
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Forget TAP, there's much more on Barnstormers. :)

flhrci said:
Just dreaming of one day owning an airplane one day. At 41 the dream is fading a little.
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Only if you let it. If you want it bad enough you'll find a way. You can get decent experimental S-1C's (flatwing) in the $20K-$25K range. And decent experimental S-1S's in the $25K-$35K range. Hell, you could probably sell that bike of yours and be halfway there. :) There are also a few rare factory S-1S's and S-1T's out there, with the T's topping out in the $55K-$60K range. I've got a factory S-1S, and there just isn't a more fun airplane anywhere, not that a single-seat Pitts doesn't have drawbacks. Keep in mind that an S-2 will give you no more performance, but that extra seat will cost twice as much, and will be empty most of the time. The S-1's really are the best bang for the buck aerobatic airplane available. My S-1S is competitive in all but the top level of aerobatic competition. Just moved to Advanced this season, but I'm still a ways off from flying the airplane to its full potential. It'll take you far. PM me if you have any Pitts flying/ownership questions.

Eric
 
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whifferdill said:
Forget TAP, there's much more on Barnstormers. :)



Only if you let it. If you want it bad enough you'll find a way. You can get decent experimental S-1C's (flatwing) in the $20K-$25K range. And decent experimental S-1S's in the $25K-$35K range. Hell, you could probably sell that bike of yours and be halfway there. :) There are also a few rare factory S-1S's and S-1T's out there, with the T's topping out in the $55K-$60K range. I've got a factory S-1S, and there just isn't a more fun airplane anywhere, not that a single-seat Pitts doesn't have drawbacks. Keep in mind that an S-2 will give you no more performance, but that extra seat will cost twice as much, and will be empty most of the time. The S-1's really are the best bang for the buck aerobatic airplane available. My S-1S is competitive in all but the top level of aerobatic competition. Just moved to Advanced this season, but I'm still a ways off from flying the airplane to its full potential. It'll take you far. PM me if you have any Pitts flying/ownership questions.

Eric
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That extra seat definitely adds considerable cost but for most pilots, especially those with only one airplane it's likely worth the price. If your only interest is perfecting your advanced competition routine, a single seat is the way to go but IME sharing flight with others adds considerably to the fun (especially if they don't vomit) whether said flight involves aerobatics or not.
 
gismo said:
That extra seat definitely adds considerable cost but for most pilots, especially those with only one airplane it's likely worth the price. If your only interest is perfecting your advanced competition routine, a single seat is the way to go but IME sharing flight with others adds considerably to the fun (especially if they don't vomit) whether said flight involves aerobatics or not.
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I disagree with your generalization - it's too personal a choice, and personal preference varies. I'm just being realistic, given what I've seen among pilots of high-performance aerobatic airplanes including Pitts'. Heck, for just about everyone I know with a 2-seat Pitts, I've never once seen them with a passenger. Maybe multiple seats are great for Cessna types, but high performance acro planes have an inherently different mission and appeal. Saw this post on the Acro Exploder and thought it was fitting regarding single vs. two-seat acro plane. Much truth:

"The same plot plays out many times. A newish acro pilot gets all motivated and decides it's time to buy an airplane. They are certain they need a two-place, with various reasons given such as "give my friends acro rides", "take wife to contests", etc. The truth is, even the shallowest extravert has about 25 friends. 10 to 15 will submit to an aerobatic ride. Perhaps 1 will ever go a second time. Done."

But it is true that pilots are attracted to capability, whether or not they actually need or will use that capability. I just don't kid myself, so it's definitely not worth it for me to pay an extra $60K for a second seat, which I might only find a few folks a year willing to go for an aerobatic ride. Most of what I hear from the 2-seater aerobatic folks is that they actually have to hunt down folks to give rides.

Folks who can afford a nice 2-seat Pitts don't so much buy them for the 2-seat capability, but because they are factory-built, newer, and bigger airplanes, with more utility. And there's the performance increase of the IO-540's of the two-seaters. They are also quite a bit bigger than the S-1's, and present much better to those on the ground. You don't see too many S-1's flying airshows.
 
I only have around 10 hours in a Pitts and it was all in an S2-B, however it sure made acro much easier. The only negative was visability on landing [and fuel burn]. If the opportunity arises I would like an S1-S.
 
whifferdill said:
But it is true that pilots are attracted to capability, whether or not they actually need or will use that capability. I just don't kid myself, so it's definitely not worth it for me to pay an extra $60K for a second seat, which I might only find a few folks a year willing to go for an aerobatic ride. Most of what I hear from the 2-seater aerobatic folks is that they actually have to hunt down folks to give rides.

Folks who can afford a nice 2-seat Pitts don't so much buy them for the 2-seat capability, but because they are factory-built, newer, and bigger airplanes, with more utility. And there's the performance increase of the IO-540's of the two-seaters. They are also quite a bit bigger than the S-1's, and present much better to those on the ground. You don't see too many S-1's flying airshows.
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I bought my Pitts for fun, not for airshows and not for competition (although a previous owner had used it in airshows). I bought a 2 seater, but the price premium was nowhere like $60K -- more like $15K, which I'm sure I got back when I sold it. I found a nice experimental amateur built with an S-2A fuse, long gear, S-2B wings, smoke, high compression IO-360 that put out about 225 HP, built by a craftsman. Really fun airplane.

Good deals can be had for the careful, patient shopper.

The other issue with a 2 seater is that it makes transition training easier. You just have to find an instructor rather than an instructor with a plane like yours. Admittedly it's a minor issue over the long term, but I did also do a flight review in mine.
 
Ken Ibold said:
I bought a 2 seater, but the price premium was nowhere like $60K -- more like $15K, which I'm sure I got back when I sold it. I found a nice experimental amateur built with an S-2A fuse, long gear, S-2B wings, smoke, high compression IO-360 that put out about 225 HP, built by a craftsman. Really fun airplane.
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Neat plane, Ken. I was talking about an S-2B when I said $60K extra, since good B's go for around $100K. The S-2A has a little less performance than the S-1S, and the S-2B has a little more. I had in mind an airplane equal or slightly better performing than my S-1S. You rarely see good S-2A's for sale, and they seem to be go up to around $70K...so in this case, only around $30K for that extra seat compared to an equally nice factory S-1S.
 
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