What’s going on with aircraft registration?

alaskan9974

alaskan9974

Pre-takeoff checklist
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alaskan9974
I bought a plane last summer, sent a registration application in September, just heard back from the faa that the seller needed to cross out his title on the bill of sale, write in the correct title and resend…he had gotten a promotion to CEO from CFO.

I asked if it would be processed once it’s back…they told me it’s processed in the order it was received, it looks like they are about 4 months behind now so almost a year of the plane sitting unable to be used.

Since it’s a issue with the seller bill of sale a temp can’t be issued because they can’t determine ownership :(
 
alaskan9974 said:
What's going on with aircraft registration?
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FYI: When covid shutdown the office they immediately fell 6 to 8 months behind on those registrations with no problems. Add in they were in the 3 year renew cycle of a lot of aircraft. I've been assisting with 3 registration issues since last year. Two we completed in 4 and 6 months respectively. We're into month 8 on the last but probably won't be finished until end of this year... the seller died before he could correct an error on his 8050-2. Be thankful you have a solution. Now is definitely not the time make any errors on paperwork.
 
Bell206 said:
Now is definitely not the time make any errors on paperwork.
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Yep, the FAA can make their own errors without any help.

They made a typo on my address when they processed my registration last year. Fortunately I noticed it online the day it issued and a phone call got them to fix it. They emailed me a temporary while I was waiting for the corrected version.
 
Half Fast said:
They made a typo on my address
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Fortunately when they make the error I've never had to wait for the correction. At least the reg group doesn't follow other department protocols and put their errors to the back of the pack like a certain MIDO I used to use.
 
Bell206 said:
Fortunately when they make the error I've never had to wait for the correction. At least the reg group doesn't follow other department protocols and put their errors to the back of the pack like a certain MIDO I used to use.
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I called and got routed to a nice lady who (I think) was working from home. I explained the problem, she looked at what I submitted, and said “Yes, it looks like we misread it.” By then I was within a couple of days of my temporary registration expiring, and it would take a couple of weeks to send a new form, so she emailed me an extension later that afternoon.

The FAA aeromedical folks could take a lesson or two.
 
Half Fast said:
The FAA aeromedical folks could take a lesson or two.
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Definitely. I brought up this topic a few years ago to a lady who was helping me. Told her they should take everyone from the registration office and put them in charge of all the other FAA departments. She laughed and said if they did that she couldn't be so nice and helpful anymore.
 
Bell206 said:
FYI: When covid shutdown the office they immediately fell 6 to 8 months behind on those registrations with no problems. Add in they were in the 3 year renew cycle of a lot of aircraft. I've been assisting with 3 registration issues since last year. Two we completed in 4 and 6 months respectively. We're into month 8 on the last but probably won't be finished until end of this year... the seller died before he could correct an error on his 8050-2. Be thankful you have a solution. Now is definitely not the time make any errors on paperwork.
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I know of one renewal that was submitted online Feb 14 and the new card came back Feb 22. At least that finger of the FAA is going well.
 
We had a confirmed, paid, correctly processed aircraft that was over a month behind on their sending the paper certificate. Someone at the FAA told us to go ahead and print out the online registration info proving it was "current" and go ahead and fly...
 
RyanShort1 said:
print out the online registration info proving it was "current" and go ahead and fly...
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Well, that seems reasonable if it works.

Are there any situations where someone would actually care that you’re flying it without the official paper document?
 
NoHeat said:
Well, that seems reasonable if it works.

Are there any situations where someone would actually care that you’re flying it without the official paper document?
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Ramp check. Also a renter might be a little leery.
 
Email them, they were sitting on my registration for an experimental for some reason, but I got it a week after contacting them.
 
asicer said:
I know of one renewal that was submitted online Feb 14 and the new card came back Feb 22. At least that finger of the FAA is going well.
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Completely different processes.
New registrations are checked for proper documentation all the way down to the detail whether the description of the seller (and the signers for the seller in the case of an organization) are the same as on the existing registration. Renewals are, "nothing has changed, $5 is paid."
 
My dealer's license was delayed because I put "Managing Member" instead of "Manager" on the title line for the LLC.

The folks who answered the phone were very helpful but you could tell they are way understaffed.

As to the OP, you could always do a new bill of sale and new registration and that would start the process over again. It would be processed in the order it was received but you would be legal to do so. I have a plane that I put in my business name that we initially were not going to sell. Now it's up for sale and the registration has not changed from the previous owner yet. FAA said the paperwork will catch up eventually if I sell it.
 
k9medic said:
Now it's up for sale and the registration has not changed from the previous owner yet. FAA said the paperwork will catch up eventually if I sell it.
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Wow.

Imagine what it would be like if motor vehicle titles everywhere were handled by the FAA instead of county governments.
 
Yeah. Not very reassuring to a potential buyer. Oddly I just checked and the plane is now registered in my company name. Paperwork was submitted on 10/29/21.
 
B
k9medic said:
My dealer's license was delayed because I put "Managing Member" instead of "Manager" on the title line for the LLC.

The folks who answered the phone were very helpful but you could tell they are way understaffed.

As to the OP, you could always do a new bill of sale and new registration and that would start the process over again. It would be processed in the order it was received but you would be legal to do so. I have a plane that I put in my business name that we initially were not going to sell. Now it's up for sale and the registration has not changed from the previous owner yet. FAA said the paperwork will catch up eventually if I sell it.
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Be careful doing that, in some states that will trigger the tax people to go after sales tax due again.
 
alaskan9974 said:
I bought a plane last summer, sent a registration application in September, just heard back from the faa that the seller needed to cross out his title on the bill of sale, write in the correct title and resend…he had gotten a promotion to CEO from CFO.

I asked if it would be processed once it’s back…they told me it’s processed in the order it was received, it looks like they are about 4 months behind now so almost a year of the plane sitting unable to be used.

Since it’s a issue with the seller bill of sale a temp can’t be issued because they can’t determine ownership :(
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The frustrating part, is the letter says their records indicate the LLC is managed by managers or officers. So either title should have been fine.

It doesn’t specifically say which correction to make, we just assumed it was a title issue but it sounds like the seller has to cross out the formal title and write manager.
 
k9medic said:
My dealer's license was delayed because I put "Managing Member" instead of "Manager" on the title line for the LLC.

The folks who answered the phone were very helpful but you could tell they are way understaffed.

As to the OP, you could always do a new bill of sale and new registration and that would start the process over again. It would be processed in the order it was received but you would be legal to do so. I have a plane that I put in my business name that we initially were not going to sell. Now it's up for sale and the registration has not changed from the previous owner yet. FAA said the paperwork will catch up eventually if I sell it.
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I wish we could, the actual registration is expired now more then 6 months so a temp is not possible, especially with the document establishing legal transfer in question by them.
 
Don't get me started. Just write it out the way they want. It took us about 30 seconds at Oshkosh to get my wife's pilot certificate changed to her married name when we got married. It took several years to get the airplane registration changed.
 
I bought a plane in August of last year and I finally got the registration in January.
The engine hp is wrong.
Sigh
 
alaskan9974 said:
the letter says their records indicate the LLC is managed by managers or officers. So either title should have been fine.
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Unfortunately it does require the correct title as it is a legal issue. My LLCs indicate managers or members and in the official records held by the State I'm listed as a member. On one aircraft I mistakenly put "manager" and when they check against the state records it was wrong and sent it back. The aircraft registration is the equivalent to a title or deed on the aviation legal side plus it also ensures the person registering the aircraft meets the regulatory requirements.
 
Still haven’t got my registration, have a temporary. I mean just use “Covid” as an excuse for everything, it is pretty much acceptable. I bought some fuel from Signature and somehow they lost my credit card number and called the previous owner. :D The new norm to just not care…. Govt should provide a service not a hindrance to its people.
 
This nonsense has been going on long before COVID hit.
 
NoHeat said:
Wow.

Imagine what it would be like if motor vehicle titles everywhere were handled by the FAA instead of county governments.
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Actually, it's done with vehicle titles too. On a trade in, dealers often have the title signed in blank so they can enter the name of the ultimate buyer. There would probably also be no issue if they submitted the chain of title at one time either. And if there is a problem with the paperwork - signed by the wrong person, the will probably reject it. Real estate transfers too. The correct seller on a documented transfer of something with a title is not "an FAA thing."
 
SkyDog58 said:
Are they putting the engine hp on the registration now?
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It's in the registration database (but not on the form). Mine still has the original factory engine listed. Never worried about updating it (not sure there's any reason to). The engine was changed with an STC, but there are some changes you can do with just a logbook entry.
 
flyingron said:
It's in the registration database (but not on the form). Mine still has the original factory engine listed. Never worried about updating it (not sure there's any reason to). The engine was changed with an STC, but there are some changes you can do with just a logbook entry.
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Yes, I know it is in the database. Thank you very much. However the way he phrased his post, it sounds like it was on his form. And yes, even if a 337 gets submitted to OKC, the info in the database does not get updated. The folks there just scan the 337 into the system. So while he possibly thinks something was done incorrectly or insufficiently, it simply isn’t the case.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Yes, I know it is in the database. Thank you very much. However the way he phrased his post, it sounds like it was on his form. And yes, even if a 337 gets submitted to OKC, the info in the database does not get updated. The folks there just scan the 337 into the system. So while he possibly thinks something was done incorrectly or insufficiently, it simply isn’t the case.
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My bad. It's not on the copy I got in the mail, just in the database.
I should have been more clear.
 
Well new copies are finally filed.

Bad new is looks like they are about 130 days behind in processing..so maybe a year after buying the plane and lord willing they don't send it back again I can finally fly it :(
 
RyanShort1 said:
Can’t you fly it with the pink slip?
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The temporary is only good for 90 days. Unfortunately, the registration branch is taking longer than that to process the applications due to staffing problems and being overwhelmed with new applications since there are so many aircraft being bought and sold right now. This is putting the rule followers in a position where they may not be able to use their aircraft for several months because the temporary registration has expired and the FAA hasn't processed the application yet. And you had better pray that your application and bill of sale are 100% correct the first time or else you get to start all over again on the waiting game after you submit the corrected paperwork.

When I called the registration folks about a month ago I was verbally told that we could just keep flying on the temporary registration until the permanent one arrives, even if it is longer than 90 days. I don't have that in writing though, so that advice probably isn't worth a whole lot.
 
RyanShort1 said:
I thought you could do another temp... would call your FSDO.
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The original registration from prepurchase is now expired, so the registration is not valid according to them even with a temporary. I assumed the same until they told me otherwise.
 
alaskan9974 said:
The original registration from prepurchase is now expired, so the registration is not valid according to them even with a temporary. I assumed the same until they told me otherwise.
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Can you sell it to a friend for a dollar and they sell it back to you for $2? I mean, as long as you have a valid bill of sale…
 
RyanShort1 said:
Can you sell it to a friend for a dollar and they sell it back to you for $2? I mean, as long as you have a valid bill of sale…
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That sounds like a great way to make a bigger mess of the paperwork and make the wait times for registration paperwork even longer, unless you're suggesting just filling out a new form and not submitting it.
 
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