Walmart drones are here.

Lndwarrior said:
The thing about technology is that it never quite works the way you want it to.
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Never? That can't be right. These are already like third or fourth generation of testing. And they don't have to be perfect. They just have to be equally as efficient as human delivery drivers. Already in California, Pizza Hut has stopped delivering pizza because the state has overpriced delivery drivers. Uber Eats, 4-hour Prime delivery, it's only a matter of time before this technology surpasses human efficiency for those gigs, if it hasn't already.

As for capturing one, they know where they are at all times, probably have cameras in all directions, and are always talking to the cloud. The penalty for aircraft piracy is up to 20 years in prison.
 
Half Fast said:
Where’s the sport in that?

Surf casting rod, cast a line with a lead weight so it wraps around the drone down line, then reel that sucker in.
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I like the way you think.

That should scare you…
 
Lindberg said:
As for capturing one, they know where they are at all times, probably have cameras in all directions, and are always talking to the cloud. The penalty for aircraft piracy is up to 20 years in prison.
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Just hijack it in the neighbor's yard. Preferably wearing a Nixon mask. :biggrin:
 
This video delves into a number of inherent limitations of the concept.

 
Drone delivery is akin to urban air mobility and evtol's...just upscaled
 
Lindberg said:
Why is it a bad idea? This can replace limited-area delivery drivers for all manner of products.
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I guess I would phrase it as "borderline useless" idea, rather than "bad".

Between the weight restrictions and airspace restrictions this just has such limited utility that I'd bet the benefits don't outweigh the costs.


Skyrys62 said:
hmm..
Google search revealed a 10lb limit.


Hope these have an automatic weight-checking device, cuz if the folks loading them are the same as the cashiers....

View attachment 126869
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Best photoshop I've seen in weeks.

Lindberg said:
As for capturing one, they know where they are at all times, probably have cameras in all directions, and are always talking to the cloud. The penalty for aircraft piracy is up to 20 years in prison.
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Yeah, I'm really not liking the chest pounding "jokes" about shooting them, stealing them, etc... Just what we want to do, joke about things to the point that knuckle draggers forget it's a joke and start shooting at aircraft.

So, I'll just add that these things are about 100% likely to be worth more than the boundary between felony and misdemeanor level damage as well.
 
Lndwarrior said:
The thing about technology is that it never quite works the way you want it to. Also the never-ending software and hardware issues create a continuous significant effort to manage. Add to this security, vandalism, on-going personnel training, hardware maintenance, and hardware failures, and I don't see this being a long term solution for a company like Walmart. I think the overall logistics will eventually result in an end to this idea.

Some areas where this can be effective is in the medical field and a few others that are part of a closed loop, repeatable system.

They may resolve the current issues at some point in the future, but the industry isn't there yet.
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I saw something not too long ago where they were using long(er) range drones for delivery of medical supplies to remote areas of the bush of Africa. They were much larger units and used a catapult launch and a catch net for controlled crash retrieval, IIRC. That is a use case that makes sense. But delivering Mt. Dew and Doritos to gamers who don't want to be bothered to leave their parents' basement doesn't seem like a long-term sustainable market. We'll see, though... My parents used to say "Well, you can't make a living playing video games!", yet there is a whole multi-billion dollar 'E-Sports' enterprise now (which I am NOT a part of, just to be clear).
 
rwellner98 said:
Yeah, I'm really not liking the chest pounding "jokes" about shooting them, stealing them, etc... Just what we want to do, joke about things to the point that knuckle draggers forget it's a joke and start continue shooting at aircraft.
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FTFY
 
X3 Skier said:
A solution in search of a problem.
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Devils advocate:
Quite a few consumers and Wal Mart would disagree.

The big stores, Walmart, Target, etc. lost a ton of business to Amazon. “I need this thing but two day delivery is fine, and shipping is free, I’ll just order it.”

They started clawing back some of that business with the DoorDash delivery of items or the curbside pickup options. These stores already have a massive distribution system to get items to their stores, what they are lacking is the last mile from store to home where Amazon was beating them. Now things like this are starting to take business from Amazon.
 
Seanaldinho said:
The big stores, Walmart, Target, etc. lost a ton of business to Amazon. “I need this thing but two day delivery is fine, and shipping is free, I’ll just order it.”

They started clawing back some of that business with the DoorDash delivery of items or the curbside pickup options. These stores already have a massive distribution system to get items to their stores, what they are lacking is the last mile from store to home where Amazon was beating them. Now things like this are starting to take business from Amazon.
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Last year I moved to a location that makes Walmart my only viable in-person option after over a decade of having many, many options in a retail space that was dominated by family owned businesses. Given an opportunity to look at walmart with fresh eyes, I suggest that you sit outside one sometime and count the percentage of people leaving with less than ten pounds of goods. It's a very small percentage. Then subtract from that the ten pounders that wouldn't be eligible for drone service (like me, 14 miles away from the store) and those walmarts that are in protected air space (lots of rural airports are close enough to town for this to be an issue, plus see the video I posted earlier about more congested airspaces).

And remember that Amazon has, to a first approximation, every product manufactured anywhere on earth in its inventory. Your local walmart carries absolute junk in most categories, and nothing else. Walmart does have food and Amazon has been mostly unsuccessful in competing in this space, but, again, ten pounds.

Prediction: Drones will never be more than a novelty in this space. Expect driverless vehicles (not necessarily cars, expect to be sharing sidewalks) to be the eventual winners.
 
rwellner98 said:
Last year I moved to a location that makes Walmart my only viable in-person option after over a decade of having many, many options in a retail space that was dominated by family owned businesses. Given an opportunity to look at walmart with fresh eyes, I suggest that you sit outside one sometime and count the percentage of people leaving with less than ten pounds of goods. It's a very small percentage. Then subtract from that the ten pounders that wouldn't be eligible for drone service (like me, 14 miles away from the store) and those walmarts that are in protected air space (lots of rural airports are close enough to town for this to be an issue, plus see the video I posted earlier about more congested airspaces).

And remember that Amazon has, to a first approximation, every product manufactured anywhere on earth in its inventory. Your local walmart carries absolute junk in most categories, and nothing else. Walmart does have food and Amazon has been mostly unsuccessful in competing in this space, but, again, ten pounds.

Prediction: Drones will never be more than a novelty in this space. Expect driverless vehicles (not necessarily cars, expect to be sharing sidewalks) to be the eventual winners.
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Completely agree.

they aren’t trying to replace your weekly grocery run. They are trying to replace your Amazon order for one thing. And yes, Amazon has everything under the sun but in large urban areas where they do one day / same day delivery they stock a much smaller set of high demand items. That is where these stores are trying to compete.

Nothing is a silver bullet but as part of a larger strategy to regain market share if it gets them a few % they are happy.



My own opinion is that this is a lot of superfluous work for my bag of Doritos. I also don’t pay for DoorDash and probably order one thing from Amazon a month. But there are a lot of people that use both of those services on a daily and weekly basis.
 
Seanaldinho said:
Completely agree.

they aren’t trying to replace your weekly grocery run. They are trying to replace your Amazon order for one thing. And yes, Amazon has everything under the sun but in large urban areas where they do one day / same day delivery they stock a much smaller set of high demand items. That is where these stores are trying to compete.

Nothing is a silver bullet but as part of a larger strategy to regain market share if it gets them a few % they are happy.



My own opinion is that this is a lot of superfluous work for my bag of Doritos. I also don’t pay for DoorDash and probably order one thing from Amazon a month. But there are a lot of people that use both of those services on a daily and weekly basis.
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I'm one of those near-daily Amazon customers. Like Rich, I live 15 miles from a Walmart, and as you said 97% of the stuff I need I can wait a couple days for. I have no loyalty to Amazon, actually I try to order from other places when I have the option, but Amazon is usually where I start and more often than not has the best deal. It gets really old however digging through pages of trash that are actually worse than the selection at Walmart before finding something worth buying. Amazon has gotten far worse in the last couple years in every area.

Walmart's biggest problem is that their website is an absolute disaster. It's impossible to tell what they actually have locally. They have "solved" the last mile problem by hiring a bunch of really sketchy looking people to drive to my house in their ****box cars. My wife has ordered a couple things that way and every time they pull in the driveway I'm preparing for a home invasion. Walmart's delivery has actually caused us to never order from them again. Somebody can't do math because the delivery charge is something like three dollars, and I guarantee the gas alone costs more than that. Maybe they're using a "loss-leader" model to try to get some of that Amazon business back? If so they need to at least buy the drivers vests or something so I know what's going on. I suspect the drone system is running on a similar model, and they will eventually have to stop the bleeding. We live in interesting times.
 
rwellner98 said:
Between the weight restrictions and airspace restrictions this just has such limited utility that I'd bet the benefits don't outweigh the costs.
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I'm not familiar with any airspace restrictions on them, but they all have waivers for flight beyond VLOS, and as a nobody Part 107 pilot, I obtained a blanket waiver for operations in Class B surface area, so I'm sure they have that as well. While there are certainly places they won't/don't fly (probably x miles from airport, etc.) those areas are likely pretty small and will get smaller as time goes on.
 
Jim K said:
I'm one of those near-daily Amazon customers. Like Rich, I live 15 miles from a Walmart, and as you said 97% of the stuff I need I can wait a couple days for. I have no loyalty to Amazon, actually I try to order from other places when I have the option, but Amazon is usually where I start and more often than not has the best deal. It gets really old however digging through pages of trash that are actually worse than the selection at Walmart before finding something worth buying. Amazon has gotten far worse in the last couple years in every area.

Walmart's biggest problem is that their website is an absolute disaster. It's impossible to tell what they actually have locally. They have "solved" the last mile problem by hiring a bunch of really sketchy looking people to drive to my house in their ****box cars. My wife has ordered a couple things that way and every time they pull in the driveway I'm preparing for a home invasion. Walmart's delivery has actually caused us to never order from them again. Somebody can't do math because the delivery charge is something like three dollars, and I guarantee the gas alone costs more than that. Maybe they're using a "loss-leader" model to try to get some of that Amazon business back? If so they need to at least buy the drivers vests or something so I know what's going on. I suspect the drone system is running on a similar model, and they will eventually have to stop the bleeding. We live in interesting times.
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I gave up on Walmart delivery, Walmart app, and Walmart.com a long time ago too. It's a ****show in tall order. A little easier for me as I live 3 miles away from multiple stores.
The biggest catch is, Harbor Freight is right by those other stores, so it not only costs more in gas...

I guess since they don't provide them, if someone does show up in a blue vest, I'd be real skeptical.
 
Jim K said:
I'm one of those near-daily Amazon customers. Like Rich, I live 15 miles from a Walmart, and as you said 97% of the stuff I need I can wait a couple days for. I have no loyalty to Amazon, actually I try to order from other places when I have the option, but Amazon is usually where I start and more often than not has the best deal.
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I'm remote enough now that if I want two day, it has to go to my PO box at the post office next to the Walmart. I still find myself choosing that option 90% or more of the time over the Walmart one due to the selection on Amazon.

In case anyone is interested, my PO box is served from the big city directly and my farm address is served by a Post Office that is served by the one that houses my PO Box. So that extra handoff adds time. As far as I can tell, it's an extra day being processed in the medium sized town, then a day to move to the little Post Office, missing the delivery time, then another day to get scheduled and delivered. Best case it's five working days, sometimes it can be seven. And if it's a third party fulfillment, it can take up to a couple weeks. Amazon seems to just give up and just have the third party use the slowest/cheapest thing available at that point.

Jim K said:
Somebody can't do math because the delivery charge is something like three dollars, and I guarantee the gas alone costs more than that.
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And the gas alone isn't the cost. I use 50 cents a mile as my planning number to cover gas and wear and tear on the vehicle. I don't count my own time, though delivery services do, of course, have that as a big part of the cost. When we were living mostly in Mexico our US cars didn't get many miles on them, it's been painful to watch the odometer click over at a more respectable US rate lately. :eek:

I do batch my trips to town together whenever possible, but if I really need some single thing, I do try to consciously consider if it's worth the $15 cost to go fetch it.

Now, that said, walmart does batch orders together, so the theory is that no single delivery has to absorb the entire cost.

Lindberg said:
I'm not familiar with any airspace restrictions on them, but they all have waivers for flight beyond VLOS, and as a nobody Part 107 pilot, I obtained a blanket waiver for operations in Class B surface area, so I'm sure they have that as well. While there are certainly places they won't/don't fly (probably x miles from airport, etc.) those areas are likely pretty small and will get smaller as time goes on.
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Ok, that's different from what I understood from past investigations. I guess airspace won't be as big an issue as it looked for a long time when the FAA didn't seem to be making much room for them.
 
I ordered food from a drone delivery service here in Los Angeles in 2020. It was creepy. Plus, my sandwich was damaged after the drone dropped it from 30 feet in the air, LOL. It was a tiny company and the business model seemed unsustainable. Not surprisingly, they are no longer in business.
 
Arm3 said:
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Amazing. Had no idea they were doing that over there. Excellent service for remote areas that don’t have a steady supply of blood or medical supplies on hand. Those AED drones being another good idea for hard to reach remote areas.

Don’t think my job is in danger of being replaced with his Zipline Ambulance theory though. Someday…but not today.
 
Lindberg said:
They can operate in controlled airspace.
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I’d be more worried about uncontrolled airspace. How do they maintain visual separation? They’re too tiny to see, and we do have aircraft buzzing around below 1200’.
 
Years ago, I worked at a hospital that had robots that went from the pharmacy to the various floors and dropped off medications. Great in theory, but people hated how they took up room on elevators, slowed hallway traffic, and spoke up when they arrived. The last one I saw had a sign on it that said something like, "You can tell a lot about people by how they treat inanimate objects." I took that to mean someone had been beating up the robots. They lasted a year, maybe two.

As for these drones, what do they have to do to get around the "line of sight" rule? Or is that no longer a thing?
 
I’m mystified how they ID the correct delivery location (not the 911 address, but the specific 1sq m spot within that environs) that is suitable for dropping a package.
AND so many places have wires, clotheslines, vehicles, pedestrians, cyclists, dogs, none of which many drones can deal with.
 
My bet is that wally world is big enough and has enough money that they can afford to throw away a bit of it on stupid projects once in a while. Very little bottom line impact to them. On the plus side, maybe some part of it will work for some specific use case. And maybe they confuse/distract their competitors with it, too.

Maybe we could help. Require zoning that any box store over 35,000 ft2 needs to have not only a 10 acre park complete with trees, but also a 2800'x50' paved runway for pubic use. Then they can land fixed wing drones as well as vertical takeoff. Motorhomes, airplanes, same thing.
 
Velocity173 said:
Don’t forget helicopters. I could fly 300 ft all day long if I wanted to.
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Not to mention hot-air balloons. Morning balloon rides are quite popular around here. And they couldn’t maneuver away from a drone even if they did see it.
 
Albany Tom said:
My bet is that wally world is big enough and has enough money that they can afford to throw away a bit of it on stupid projects once in a while. Very little bottom line impact to them. On the plus side, maybe some part of it will work for some specific use case. And maybe they confuse/distract their competitors with it, too.
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The coverage is free publicity also. That has value that is part of the equation.
 
When do the drone pirates appear?
 
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