in my case it was 5000Of course, building a plane seems to be its own category of BS, so I'm still hesitant to commit to 2 or 3000 hours of frustration and my own ineptitude. But maybe it'd be fun?We have a new EAA chapter at my airport, so seems there is a lot of support or commiserating available.
That's in line with what I was thinking. More time spent planning and setting up then actually building feels right for me, although I've never built.
i beg to differ, a carbon cub kit is 93k and they have no trouble selling kits. the fact of the matter is that vans kits were under priced all along. yes, this lead to them being the largest kit supplier in the world, but when the order book got over a year, that opened them up to being hit hard by inflation and it bit them bad. the truth is they should have raised prices in 2020 to slow down orders when the wait hit a year. yes it sucks that people are going to have to pay more for something that they have paid for but not gotten. but the option is chapter 7 and a total loss of that money.
Amen, Brother! Write your Congress-critter.
The finished aircraft inventory increase probably has little or nothing to do with the bankruptcy. Toy inventory of all types (beach houses, airplanes, boats, fancy cars) moved faster when the world was rife with COVID bailout money. That wave crested a while back and things are moving slower today...
I agree. Van's will survive this. I think many people on this forum don't have an understanding of Van's position in the market place. They simply have no competition with the reputation and the established following. Regardless of the current misstep with the lazer cut parts and financial issues. They have the unqualified best high performance homebuilt in the world. Those with $150k to spend aren't going anywhere else.
Your canceling an order that Van's would lose money fulfilling isn't going to hurt anyone's feelings. Neither would you selling your partial kit.
I saw a complete unstarted qb on barnstormers last week. No price given but don't see it any longer.
Predicated on people cancelling orders? Yes, I'm sure they're counting on it. That's part of the point of chapter 11. Voiding unprofitable contracts. If they can be restructured into profitable contracts, that's great. But just getting rid of them is the next best thing.
Then those people that cancelled go and sell their half built kit to someone willing to pay the price increase for the next kit.
Received my 10 empennage kit in august. I have made it as far as taking the top of crate off and now considering if I really have time for it. Second kid on way, business has been getting busier. Not sure what I want to do just yet but need to decide soon. I do believe that this kit was after they discovered the laser cut parts
I remember reading a stat somewhere that said way less than half the empennage kits sold ever fly.I've often wondered how many more empennage kits have been sold for the various models vs say finishing kits. I'm sure Van's knows how many kits are "in progress". It would be interesting to know how many have been abandoned, or maybe "in limbo". I think each empennage kit is assigned a builder number? I'd like to know how many of those just go cold.
I wonder if "kits in progress" are assigned any value on their balance sheet. I'm guessing not, but they are a fairly real source of future income. Maybe somebody should ask the Mooney accountants about future parts value
I wonder if those "kits in progress" would get a phone call from vans to buy and then resell...or encourage the owner to sell or get off the pot.I've often wondered how many more empennage kits have been sold for the various models vs say finishing kits. I'm sure Van's knows how many kits are "in progress". It would be interesting to know how many have been abandoned, or maybe "in limbo". I think each empennage kit is assigned a builder number? I'd like to know how many of those just go cold.
I wonder if "kits in progress" are assigned any value on their balance sheet. I'm guessing not, but they are a fairly real source of future income. Maybe somebody should ask the Mooney accountants about future parts value
Even though I sold my kit, I got a legal notice about the chapter 11 with some paltry information about options. It was far from useful IMO.
My best guess as to why they put people like you on the "mailing matrix" is because, having purchased a kit, you could have a claim for breach of contract, negligence, or product liability that arose before the Chapter 11 filing date but has not been brought to court yet. Those claims would be extinguished by the bankruptcy protection. So could claims that have not even accrued yet. I do know that there are exceptions, including voluntary exceptions that a company might use for strategic or political reasons. (E.g., the market for used cars you manufactured before filing bankruptcy is better if you honor unexpired warranties and product liability claims that you could have killed off.)
Was more thinking vans would call up these "kits in progress" that havent seen them buy the next kit. Try to convince them to continue building or sell the kit to someone waiting on a kit. Which could potentially clear up some backlog
i ordered my kit over 20 years ago and probably not even orders any parts for 4 years and still got the letter. they are covering all the based legally.
Got my cert in 2003 with a lot of parts ordered toward the end and since, including a new motor (with deposit) in 2021.
They go to everyone who has ever ordered anything (part/kit etc). I built a Velocity but ordered a manifold thingie and also got the letter
sales is not profit. I worked at a Fortune 50 and with $50bn in sales our profit was less than 3% of sales Vans needs way more than $10mm to emerge from bankruptcy healthy.
Which is why I said "especially on engines". I understand people with kits being stuck. But a 93% reorder rate for engines when there's other available options is impressive.
The "boxes" are generally less expensive even for the certified stuff like IFR navigators, radios, transponders, etc. However, you'll only realize a nice savings if you install it yourself. If you farm out the panel to an avionics shop, even ones that cater to the E-AB community, your $20K discount panel becomes a $50K-60K panel in a heartbeat.
