Value of 100-hr Inspections

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TCABM

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Our partnership put 316hrs on the plane last year and 200hrs the year before that. Last year, one of our members who’s a long-time A&P decided to get his IA back so we started doing 100-hr inspections to help him out as well as try to catch things in-between annuals with as much flying as we’re doing.

Started the inspection this morning and found this
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Last 100-hr was in November and the flap cable was inspected and on the pulley. Glad to have caught it even though the plane is going to he down a while.
 
Is there a reason an IA is doing 100 hour inspections instead of just doing an annual every 100 hours? He wouldn’t have needed to get his IA back to do what you’re describing.

Regardless, aircraft need regular care and maintenance. This is a good example.
 
mondtster said:
Is there a reason an IA is doing 100 hour inspections instead of just doing an annual every 100 hours? He wouldn’t have needed to get his IA back to do what you’re describing.

Regardless, aircraft need regular care and maintenance. This is a good example.
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The FBO prohibits annual inspections in our hangar, has to be in the maintenance hangar. But a 100-hr following the annual inspection checklist can be performed in our hangar.

Also, all work in the maintenance hangar has to be performed under the supervision of an employee and none of are employees.
 
TCABM said:
The FBO prohibits annual inspections in our hangar, has to be in the maintenance hangar. But a 100-hr following the annual inspection checklist can be performed in our hangar.

Also, all work in the maintenance hangar has to be performed under the supervision of an employee and none of are employees.
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So the FBO examines the logbooks to see whether he wrote it down as an annual or a 100 hr inspection???
 
Always helps to know Type Aircraft.

Is a “ keeper” missing?
 
I still don’t follow the rationale behind doing 100 hour inspections to regain his IA. Doing that will not get his IA back. He will only need to retake the written provided he meets the actively engaged requirements. And if all he is doing is a couple of 100 hr inspections a year, he will not meet it.
 
Another thing is that if your airport accepts FAA money, I do not believe you can be prevented from doing your own annuals or hiring your own IA to do them. The grant assurances prohibit that sort of thing.
 
I don’t think the FBO’s objection to where you do your annual would invalidate them (the annual).
 
AA5Bman said:
I don’t think the FBO’s objection to where you do your annual would invalidate them (the annual).
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I still don't see how the FBO will know that you're doing an annual in the first place.
 
TCABM said:
all work in the maintenance hangar has to be performed under the supervision of an employee and none of are employees.
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Supervising in what capacity? Are you paying this FBO employee to supervise? Good you caught the cable issue but the FBO requirements make zero sense from any point.
 
From the FAA grant assurances:

Grant Assurance 22(f) provides that an airport sponsor:
“…will not exercise or grant any right or privilege which
operates to prevent any person, firm,or corporation
operating aircraft on the airport from performing any
services on its own aircraft with its own employees
(including, but not limited to, maintenance, repair, and
fueling) that it may choose to perform.”

The FAA considers the right to self-service as prohibiting
the establishment of any unreasonable restriction on the
owners or operators of aircraft regarding the servicing of their own aircraft and equipment. When
airport users and airport sponsors disagree about whether or not a restriction is reasonable and a
formal complaint is filed, the FAA becomes the final arbiter in the matter.
Aircraft owners must be permitted to fuel, wash, repair, and otherwise take care of their own aircraft
with their own personnel, equipment, and supplies. The airport sponsor, however, is obligated to
operate the airport in a safe and efficient manner. The establishment of fair and reasonable rules,
applied in a not unjustly discriminatory manner, governing the introduction of equipment, personnel,
or practices which would be unsafe, unsightly, detrimental to the public welfare, or which would
affect the efficient use of airport facilities by others, is not unreasonable.
 
It’s also up to you whether you want to talk to the FBO or not. You are not required to be friends with everyone on the airport. Maybe you went by saying I have a brand new SR22T and too much money, I need an annual inspection. :D

Hey, I asked a flight school for multi engine training, they asked me if I would buy the plane and they would manage it (of course for a fee).
 
SkyDog58 said:
I still don’t follow the rationale behind doing 100 hour inspections to regain his IA. Doing that will not get his IA back. He will only need to retake the written provided he meets the actively engaged requirements. And if all he is doing is a couple of 100 hr inspections a year, he will not meet it.
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Half Fast said:
So the FBO examines the logbooks to see whether he wrote it down as an annual or a 100 hr inspection???
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Bell206 said:
Supervising in what capacity? Are you paying this FBO employee to supervise? Good you caught the cable issue but the FBO requirements make zero sense from any point.
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There must be something I misunderstood from a conversation that occurred 9+ months ago and is entirely irrelevant to why I started this thread to begin with.

I should not have included that information to begin with.
 
TCABM said:
There must be something I misunderstood from a conversation that occurred 9+ months ago and is entirely irrelevant to why I started this thread to begin with.

I should not have included that information to begin with.
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But this is POA, where people spend far more time discussing the irrelevant minutiae than the original subject. Especially when people get the chance to be righteously indignant about what the big bad airport management is doing.
 
Half Fast said:
I still don't see how the FBO will know that you're doing an annual in the first place.
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Well, the FBO does own the maintenance shop that employs the IA we use. So I guess the FBO can establish work rules for the IA.
 
TCABM said:
Well, the FBO does own the maintenance shop that employs the IA we use. So I guess the FBO can establish work rules for the IA.
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I can understand a shop prohibiting employees from freelancing. They don't want to compete with their own employees.

But I don't see how 100hr vs annual comes into play. And a non-compete rule is a far cry from prohibiting an annual in the hangar.

Sorry. Guess I'm still confused.
 
TCABM said:
Well, the FBO does own the maintenance shop that employs the IA we use. So I guess the FBO can establish work rules for the IA.
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You said it’s one of your members that means the IA is working on his own plane. I don’t think an employer prohibiting work on his own plane is fair or reasonable.
 
mandm said:
You said it’s one of your members that means the IA is working on his own plane. I don’t think an employer prohibiting work on his own plane is fair or reasonable.
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Yeah, I agree with you in this instance. The whole thing seems dumb.
 
mandm said:
You said it’s one of your members that means the IA is working on his own plane. I don’t think an employer prohibiting work on his own plane is fair or reasonable.
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The member is an A&P without IA privileges.
 
TCABM said:
Started the inspection this morning and found this
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Flap cable.

upload_2022-2-12_18-33-0.png

There should be a cotter pin in that pulley bracket to prevent the cable jumping off the pulley. You can see the empty pin hole on the lower leg of the bracket.

That pulley is also worn out, with that much cable tracking in it. It might also be seized. The grease in them gets old and stiff and the pulley stops turning.

See the brown rust dust on the aft spar under the pulley? The cable has been chafed and is also likely shot. The galvanizing is gone, at least, with a bit of the wire as well. Dragging across the bracket and pulley bolt did that.

For want of a five-cent pin and a few seconds of inspection. Cheaping out on maintenance saves no money at all.
 

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Dan Thomas said:
.. That pulley is also worn out, with that much cable tracking in it. It might also be seized. The grease in them gets old and stiff and the pulley stops turning.

See the brown rust dust on the aft spar under the pulley? The cable has been chafed and is also likely shot. The galvanizing is gone, at least, with a bit of the wire as well. Dragging across the bracket and pulley bolt did that.
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I think what we will debate is what else to do while we’re in there.
 
How did you know to check that? Did you hear a noise?
 
What to do about the bulkhead where the cable has been cutting it?
 
Daleandee said:
What to do about the bulkhead where the cable has been cutting it?
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More than likely nothing. Now if it cut into the base flange/skin area may need a simple a "L" bracket repair but from the pic, just break the edges of the "cut" and it will be fine. The cable on the other hand may need some further review.
 
Clip4 said:
Anyone checking cable tensions during your inspections?
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Shouldn't even need to do that to find it. The flap motor is in the right wing and the cables operate the left flap. With that cable off its pulley (it's the flap-down cable) the flap won't come all the way down and the airplane will be left-wing-heavy. Even a walkaround, with the flaps down, would spot the slop if the pilot pushed up a bit on the left flap.

Unless, of course, the cable may have been tensioned with the cable already off the pulley. Oops.

But yes, those cable tensions should be checked annually, at least.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Shouldn't even need to do that to find it. The flap motor is in the right wing and the cables operate the left flap. With that cable off its pulley (it's the flap-down cable) the flap won't come all the way down and the airplane will be left-wing-heavy. Even a walkaround, with the flaps down, would spot the slop if the pilot pushed up a bit on the left flap.

Unless, of course, the cable may have been tensioned with the cable already off the pulley. Oops.

But yes, those cable tensions should be checked annually, at least.
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I’m a pre-flight flaps down guy, and flew in late Jan and everything felt okay, minus a little rudder to maintain heading. I flew three days prior and make it a point to inspect the tracks, but not tension. Visually, with flaps down, I could not discern an issue, but maintaining a constant track on that flight required left rudder input. I haven’t thought to check back pressure, only visual inspection, which was essentially correct six hours prior to inspection.

We’ve kicked around building, but this weekend decided an RV-10 or -14 tail kit needs to be decided upon.
 
My guess is the A &P is using the 100 hr inspections to be “ actively engaged”.

FSDOs seem to vary a lot on this requirement.
 
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TCABM said:
I could not discern an issue, but maintaining a constant track on that flight required left rudder input..
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That is a symptom of a broken rudder bar spring on the left rudder bar. That spring gets stretched more, and more often, because of the right rudder needed to maintain coordination in the takeoff and climb.

Get under the airplane and take off the round inspection panel in the fuselage centerline just aft of the firewall. Get a flashlight and have a look in there. There are two springs attached to bellcranks on the rudder bars and tabs riveted to the tunnel sides. The left one is likely broken, or the tab has worn through and let go of the spring.

Replacing that spring is lots of fun. You need a long rod made of 1/4" or 3/8" steel round bar, flattened on one end and a slot cut into it to force the spring hook into the tab. Bend the other end 90° for a grip. Tie the right rudder pedal all the way back with a strap of some sort, then go to it with the rod. Try to minimize the bad language.
 
Dan Thomas said:
… Try to minimize the bad language.
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Bad language never hurt anyone. Sounds very similar to the tool and process to replace a washing machine seal I did last year.

I’ll probably head out to the airport today to start putting some of the inspection panels back on. I’ll use that opportunity to look at the spring bar.
 
Clip4 said:
Anyone checking cable tensions during your inspections?
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How else will you verify proper aileron/flap extension as per the TCDS?

Loose/tight cables can affect the rigging, so its always checked (or should be if you understand rigging)
 
pfarber said:
How else will you verify proper aileron/flap extension as per the TCDS?

Loose/tight cables can affect the rigging, so its always checked (or should be if you understand rigging)
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Inspect every pulley and check the cable for fraying....from one end to the other.
 
pfarber said:
How else will you verify proper aileron/flap extension as per the TCDS?

Loose/tight cables can affect the rigging, so its always checked (or should be if you understand rigging)
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One uses an inclinometer to find surface travels, except for the rudder, where I use a digital angle finder. My digital inclinometer gauges surface movement in increments of 0.1 degree. Airframe manufacturers will give travels +/- one or two degrees. Surface travels are usually controlled by stops at or close to the surface, not by tensions.

In the shop, low cable tension won't show up in control surface travels unless it's so low that the cables are actually drooping. The surfaces might have less travel in flight, with the air loads on them, as the pilot's controls' travels can max out with loose cables. In some airplanes, slack cables can lead to flutter.

The TCDS is only one source of travel info. The service manual is the proper source, since it gives the rigging instructions. It's been obvious to me over the years that mechanics are ad-libbing it, since I very often found the rigging way off, travels all screwed up and so on. Rigging is not intuitive, and the manuals were printed for good reasons. Getting everything right results in an owner exclaiming how nice the airplane flies now. Sometimes faster, too.
 
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